Recommend me a simple uk 3pin to type 2 charger
Discussion
Wife has just bought a Volvo xc60 T8. Really love it.
It’s supplied with a simple plug in charger that you run the mains on and it starts charging. Absolutely no buttons on it.
Problem is the cable isn’t long enough unless we start shuffling cars around every time we charge it
What I’m after is a very simple turn the electricity on at the 3 pin uk plug 15-20m long cable.
We currently use a smart plug (technics brand I think), this means we can turn the charger on and off with the App, can schedule the plug to turn on and off with the app any time anywhere in the world and can also use Alex in the house.
It’s currently plugged in to a socket in the garage with the cable led under the garage door. Don’t want to have to start opening the garage as another car is parked in front means moving cars around.
I can see many replacement chargers via Amazon, eBay, Google etc but they nearly all seem to have menus and buttons to press and I’m not sure if I just turn the power on at the wall if they will start charging. I could go around contacting all these companies but does anybody know off one without me having to do that.
It’s supplied with a simple plug in charger that you run the mains on and it starts charging. Absolutely no buttons on it.
Problem is the cable isn’t long enough unless we start shuffling cars around every time we charge it
What I’m after is a very simple turn the electricity on at the 3 pin uk plug 15-20m long cable.
We currently use a smart plug (technics brand I think), this means we can turn the charger on and off with the App, can schedule the plug to turn on and off with the app any time anywhere in the world and can also use Alex in the house.
It’s currently plugged in to a socket in the garage with the cable led under the garage door. Don’t want to have to start opening the garage as another car is parked in front means moving cars around.
I can see many replacement chargers via Amazon, eBay, Google etc but they nearly all seem to have menus and buttons to press and I’m not sure if I just turn the power on at the wall if they will start charging. I could go around contacting all these companies but does anybody know off one without me having to do that.
I've got a 10m Masterplug one which is decent (it does have a screen and buttons but would behave as you want it to if connected to a smart plug).
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07TYTW7HS/ref=pe_2706...
I'd be a little wary of the current draw through a smart plug though to be honest, especially if you were leaving it unattended.
I don't think many places do anything longer than 10m so you might struggle!
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07TYTW7HS/ref=pe_2706...
I'd be a little wary of the current draw through a smart plug though to be honest, especially if you were leaving it unattended.
I don't think many places do anything longer than 10m so you might struggle!
dirtbiker said:
I've got a 10m Masterplug one which is decent (it does have a screen and buttons but would behave as you want it to if connected to a smart plug).
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07TYTW7HS/ref=pe_2706...
I'd be a little wary of the current draw through a smart plug though to be honest, especially if you were leaving it unattended.
I don't think many places do anything longer than 10m so you might struggle!
Yeah I did check the plug and it’s rated at 13amp, I think the current charger draws 10 amps. So it should be ok. https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07TYTW7HS/ref=pe_2706...
I'd be a little wary of the current draw through a smart plug though to be honest, especially if you were leaving it unattended.
I don't think many places do anything longer than 10m so you might struggle!
I’m actually wondering if it’s worth biting the bullet and getting a proper dedicated outdoor charger fitted to future proof the house. I do wonder if when everybody starts wanting the chargers fitted if the local infrastructure will run out of capacity and they might refuse people having a charger fitted at there home if the local infrastructure is operating near max.
i would be very wary of this - as reported frequently, domestic sockets are rated at 13A but only intermittently - they may be able to supply 10A continuously but only if everything is in perfect condition and the contacts in the socket haven't lost any of their grip - at 10A the fuse will be warm which causes the contacts to lose their grip gradually and it becomes a vicious circle leading to the situation below on the live pin. Personally i would reduce the current in the settings in the car (on mine there is a setting for 7A) and only use in emergencies.
Also, the regs require any socket used for EV charging to have PEN and DC leakage protection the same as for a dedicated chargepoint which a normal socket won't have.
Also, the regs require any socket used for EV charging to have PEN and DC leakage protection the same as for a dedicated chargepoint which a normal socket won't have.
I understood UK sockets were rated for 13A continuous, as part of the 8-hour temperature rise testing. Happy to be corrected.
However, that 13A is the total for a socket whether it is a single or a double. So a double socket is limited to 13A between the two outlets.
I have a number of WiFi mains switchable solutions and none of mine can handle more than a few hundred Watts. I'm curious which ones can handle nearly 3KW.
However, that 13A is the total for a socket whether it is a single or a double. So a double socket is limited to 13A between the two outlets.
I have a number of WiFi mains switchable solutions and none of mine can handle more than a few hundred Watts. I'm curious which ones can handle nearly 3KW.
So just for info below is the plug and charger we are using.
So it does seem like it should be ok. It’s in the garage which is always the coldest part of the house.
What is PEN DC leakage protection and if it’s in the regs why are Volvo allowed to sell a plug in charger if it can cause damage like in the photo above.
I’m really thinking maybe a proper EV charger might be best (about £1000) offset by say £200 for a quality mains plug in charger.
So it does seem like it should be ok. It’s in the garage which is always the coldest part of the house.
What is PEN DC leakage protection and if it’s in the regs why are Volvo allowed to sell a plug in charger if it can cause damage like in the photo above.
I’m really thinking maybe a proper EV charger might be best (about £1000) offset by say £200 for a quality mains plug in charger.
lots of info on speakEV.com but this example from an earlier post here explains it well:
Jeremy Harris on Speak EV said:
The open PEN fault risk is the same with a granny lead as it is with a non-open PEN fault protected charge point. All outlets intended for charging EVs (not just charge points) are supposed to comply with BS7671:2018 Section 722, but the reality is that many do not, and anyway, there is an argument that an outlet installed to run a Class 2 appliance (like a lawnmower) doesn't need open PEN fault protection (as there are no exposed conductive parts), so the outlet could be said to be compliant with the regs if it wasn't put in specifically for car charging.
The regs do not apply to the granny lead itself, as it's not installed electrical equipment, it's classed as an appliance. That doesn't change anything in terms of the possible risk, but does mean that there is no obligation on granny lead manufacturers to put in any protection measures that may be required by the wiring regs.
In practice, the view regarding appliances that connect to any outdoor exposed conductive part is that the outlet supplying them should have open PEN fault protection. This goes back way before EVs, and includes things like metal framed greenhouses, metal buildings, caravans and hot tubs, all of which really need open PEN fault protection and have done for many years (not that it's ever been formalised in the wiring regs, though, it was always just a "good practice" thing, or sometimes in the MIs for things like hot tubs and caravan hook up boxes).
In terms of risk, no one has yet really done much about the risk that granny leads present, because the assumption is that they are really a "get out of jail" device, that won't be used very often. The theory is reasonable, we get around 300 to 500 open PEN faults a year, and each only usually lasts a very short time. The probability of someone using a granny lead at the same time as their supply has an open PEN fault, and at the same time as someone is standing on the ground and touching the car, is assumed to be very low, much lower than for a fixed charge point that may be in use for several hours every day. Of course, if someone chooses to use a granny lead as their only, or primary, means of charging then the risk is actually greater than that from a fixed charge point, just because the charge rate is lower so the time plugged in is much longer.
Jeremy Harris on Speak EV said:
The open PEN fault risk is the same with a granny lead as it is with a non-open PEN fault protected charge point. All outlets intended for charging EVs (not just charge points) are supposed to comply with BS7671:2018 Section 722, but the reality is that many do not, and anyway, there is an argument that an outlet installed to run a Class 2 appliance (like a lawnmower) doesn't need open PEN fault protection (as there are no exposed conductive parts), so the outlet could be said to be compliant with the regs if it wasn't put in specifically for car charging.
The regs do not apply to the granny lead itself, as it's not installed electrical equipment, it's classed as an appliance. That doesn't change anything in terms of the possible risk, but does mean that there is no obligation on granny lead manufacturers to put in any protection measures that may be required by the wiring regs.
In practice, the view regarding appliances that connect to any outdoor exposed conductive part is that the outlet supplying them should have open PEN fault protection. This goes back way before EVs, and includes things like metal framed greenhouses, metal buildings, caravans and hot tubs, all of which really need open PEN fault protection and have done for many years (not that it's ever been formalised in the wiring regs, though, it was always just a "good practice" thing, or sometimes in the MIs for things like hot tubs and caravan hook up boxes).
In terms of risk, no one has yet really done much about the risk that granny leads present, because the assumption is that they are really a "get out of jail" device, that won't be used very often. The theory is reasonable, we get around 300 to 500 open PEN faults a year, and each only usually lasts a very short time. The probability of someone using a granny lead at the same time as their supply has an open PEN fault, and at the same time as someone is standing on the ground and touching the car, is assumed to be very low, much lower than for a fixed charge point that may be in use for several hours every day. Of course, if someone chooses to use a granny lead as their only, or primary, means of charging then the risk is actually greater than that from a fixed charge point, just because the charge rate is lower so the time plugged in is much longer.
There is now a type approved standard for 13A sockets for granny chargers, they are rated for continuous 10A supply.
https://toughleads.co.uk/products/weatherproof-soc...
The masterplug granny charger I have also has a temperature sensor in the 13A plug and will shut down if it gets too hot.
https://toughleads.co.uk/products/weatherproof-soc...
The masterplug granny charger I have also has a temperature sensor in the 13A plug and will shut down if it gets too hot.
Mars said:
I understood UK sockets were rated for 13A continuous, as part of the 8-hour temperature rise testing. Happy to be corrected.
However, that 13A is the total for a socket whether it is a single or a double. So a double socket is limited to 13A between the two outlets.
I have a number of WiFi mains switchable solutions and none of mine can handle more than a few hundred Watts. I'm curious which ones can handle nearly 3KW.
A healthy socket on a healthy circuit should have zero problems handling 3kw continuous load. Anyone choosing to use one that way should check the health of their socket and circuit, not hard to do and not expensive of you need to call a spark.However, that 13A is the total for a socket whether it is a single or a double. So a double socket is limited to 13A between the two outlets.
I have a number of WiFi mains switchable solutions and none of mine can handle more than a few hundred Watts. I'm curious which ones can handle nearly 3KW.
Regards smart sockets, we use TCP for all sorts of things, they can switch up to 3kw. The internal relays life will be shortened when the socket turns switches off a car charger at full draw, as it's breaking a circuit with 3000w running through it - not dangerous, but you might get 1000 switches instead 10,000 before it gives up.
I charge my Citroen overnight at 10A from a Tapo P105 smart plug and a no-name 3-pin charger that the previous owner of the car threw in
https://www.johnlewis.com/tp-link-tapo-p105-mini-w...
Have done nightly since Nov with zero problems.
I can't say your house will be the same, but it's working well for me and saves me needing to spend a grand on a charger just yet.
samoht said:
I charge my Citroen overnight at 10A from a Tapo P105 smart plug and a no-name 3-pin charger that the previous owner of the car threw in
https://www.johnlewis.com/tp-link-tapo-p105-mini-w...
Have done nightly since Nov with zero problems.
I can't say your house will be the same, but it's working well for me and saves me needing to spend a grand on a charger just yet.
Thanks for that info. The house is only 9 years old we bought it off plan so I know there shouldn’t be any dodgy below standard wiring in the house. https://www.johnlewis.com/tp-link-tapo-p105-mini-w...
Have done nightly since Nov with zero problems.
I can't say your house will be the same, but it's working well for me and saves me needing to spend a grand on a charger just yet.
I’m still tempted to future proof and get a dedicated charger. Unfortunately we only have single phase in to the house but I can’t see that being a problem.
Just re-reading your original post, possibly this extension lead might be a cheap and simple solution:
https://toughleads.co.uk/collections/ev-electric-v...
MB140 said:
samoht said:
I charge my Citroen overnight at 10A from a Tapo P105 smart plug and a no-name 3-pin charger that the previous owner of the car threw in
https://www.johnlewis.com/tp-link-tapo-p105-mini-w...
Have done nightly since Nov with zero problems.
I can't say your house will be the same, but it's working well for me and saves me needing to spend a grand on a charger just yet.
Thanks for that info. The house is only 9 years old we bought it off plan so I know there shouldn’t be any dodgy below standard wiring in the house. https://www.johnlewis.com/tp-link-tapo-p105-mini-w...
Have done nightly since Nov with zero problems.
I can't say your house will be the same, but it's working well for me and saves me needing to spend a grand on a charger just yet.
I’m still tempted to future proof and get a dedicated charger. Unfortunately we only have single phase in to the house but I can’t see that being a problem.
Pull all the socket fronts on the circuit in question and tighten the screws, you'll definitely find there is movement - torque them all up.
Do the same on the MCB and RCD or RCDO in the consumer unit for the circuit.
The first few years after a fresh install are the most likely for things to become relaxed, become loose, and become hot under continuous current. Once tightened a second time they'll go decades.
This is just my thoughts by the way, not 'advice'... Don't sue me and don't hurt yourself checking if you don't know how to isolate and dead check a circuit... If unsure just get a spark to health check the circuit. A spark can also test it beyond simply ensuring it's all done up tight on the terminals.
I purchased this long lead 3 pin charger from Amazon and it works OK but worryingly all trace has since been removed from the Amazon website. Possibly not my most considered purchase.
I'm not proud to admit. I have been charging 2 PHEV each using 3 pin charging cables with both plugged into extension leads and both on the same ring final. The leads trail out under the garage door. It is a worry that although the continuous current of 20 Amps is well within the 32 Amps ring final circuit breaker but imagine that the current is going through every socket in the house for that ring final and I haven't checked that all those terminals are tight..
The smart electricity meter in house display is very useful for confirming that the total load is at the expected 4.4 KW.
I fitted a heat fire alarm in the garage which is wirelessly linked to the other 8 fire/smoke/CO alarms in the house.
As charging runs from midnight to 4am it is not so easy to spot overheating plugs because I am asleep but I did notice that one extension lead plug was heating up and there was a loose connection on the live. Further monitoring has not shown a fault.
I ran this arrangement for about a year but have now upgraded the consumer unit in the garage and added 2 radials each with just one double socket on separate RCBO and all in the garage.
Ooops it's midnight so I need to pop outside and plug in.
samoht said:
Just re-reading your original post, possibly this extension lead might be a cheap and simple solution:
https://toughleads.co.uk/collections/ev-electric-v...
I had thought about that. Problem then becomes people could just walk up the drive and nick the whole charger when it’s not in use. Obviously if plugged in it’s locked to the car. Not an issue. https://toughleads.co.uk/collections/ev-electric-v...
Don’t really want to be dragging a wet cable back through the house in the morning. Currently the charge part of the cable (see previous picture) stays inside the garage with just the cable going out under the garage door so it’s secure.
Thanks for the idea though. Appreciate it.
What about a Juice-Booster?
https://evconnectors.com/product-category/juice-bo...
Not cheap, but you can add extensions of 3, 5 and 10 meters.
https://evconnectors.com/product-category/juice-bo...
Not cheap, but you can add extensions of 3, 5 and 10 meters.
samoht said:
Just re-reading your original post, possibly this extension lead might be a cheap and simple solution:
https://toughleads.co.uk/collections/ev-electric-v...
This is definitely your solution for an extension, I was looking at the same but now have a 7.4kw installed.https://toughleads.co.uk/collections/ev-electric-v...
I was using the master plug charger running from a 16a connection in the garage. Worked perfectly and I had no concerns doing that, worked well with intelligent octopus also.
Parking 2 PHEV in front of the garage means that one needs a longer cable.
The Mini 3 pin charging cable was shorter and also bright yellow and I didn't want to attract attention so I replaced it with a longer one.
The chargers are secured inside the garage and outside I hang them over the side fence.
Each double socket uses a dedicated radial directly from the CU and each with RCBO and I checked plug temperatures last night and the live side of the plugs get ever so slightly warm.
The Mini 3 pin charging cable was shorter and also bright yellow and I didn't want to attract attention so I replaced it with a longer one.
The chargers are secured inside the garage and outside I hang them over the side fence.
Each double socket uses a dedicated radial directly from the CU and each with RCBO and I checked plug temperatures last night and the live side of the plugs get ever so slightly warm.
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