Discussion
My dad turns 80 next week. He's wanting to change his car (currently a 10yr old 320d touring) which as a gift, we are chipping in for.
He doesn't need the size of the 3-series so it looking a sector down, and fancies a hybrid as most of his journeys are sub 10-15 miles so he'd run on mostly electricity.
I'm not up to speed with Hybrids, but I'm tempted to bias towards a PHEV so he can charge it at home (double garage, single car) given his driving habits, not sure he'd ever get a huge amount of regen charge - but am I right?
Beyond that, he's looking at approved used, up to c12mths old, but may just go new....and favouring a Kia Niro. Good choice? Other recommendations?
Thanks
He doesn't need the size of the 3-series so it looking a sector down, and fancies a hybrid as most of his journeys are sub 10-15 miles so he'd run on mostly electricity.
I'm not up to speed with Hybrids, but I'm tempted to bias towards a PHEV so he can charge it at home (double garage, single car) given his driving habits, not sure he'd ever get a huge amount of regen charge - but am I right?
Beyond that, he's looking at approved used, up to c12mths old, but may just go new....and favouring a Kia Niro. Good choice? Other recommendations?
Thanks
Does he ever do journeys longer than about 150 miles? If not, he may as well go fully electric.
The only real point of PHEVs in my opinion is to avoid company car tax. They are really expensive to buy, and most are surprisingly inefficient in electric mode so the electric miles aren't really any cheaper than the petrol miles.
A normal hybrid Niro, Kona, Corolla etc will do over 60mpg without much effort, which is just over 10p per mile at current fuel prices. A PHEV will do about 3 miles per kWH, which is ..... just over 10p per mile if on a standard electricity tariff. A good smallish EV (the e-Niro would be a decent choice) will do between 4 and 5 miles per kWH in town, which is cheaper to run than petrol even on standard electricity prices.
The only real point of PHEVs in my opinion is to avoid company car tax. They are really expensive to buy, and most are surprisingly inefficient in electric mode so the electric miles aren't really any cheaper than the petrol miles.
A normal hybrid Niro, Kona, Corolla etc will do over 60mpg without much effort, which is just over 10p per mile at current fuel prices. A PHEV will do about 3 miles per kWH, which is ..... just over 10p per mile if on a standard electricity tariff. A good smallish EV (the e-Niro would be a decent choice) will do between 4 and 5 miles per kWH in town, which is cheaper to run than petrol even on standard electricity prices.
I’d agree, get a hybrid the Toyota ones are ace
We have a couple of elderly relatives that have them, one a Corolla and another a new Yaris
For pottering around in they are the perfect solution and for someone of advanced years great because they are simple and need just a visit to a petrol stn periodically and are very cheap to run and there’s no adjustment needed in how you use them
We have a couple of elderly relatives that have them, one a Corolla and another a new Yaris
For pottering around in they are the perfect solution and for someone of advanced years great because they are simple and need just a visit to a petrol stn periodically and are very cheap to run and there’s no adjustment needed in how you use them
SkodaIan said:
Does he ever do journeys longer than about 150 miles? If not, he may as well go fully electric.
The only real point of PHEVs in my opinion is to avoid company car tax. They are really expensive to buy, and most are surprisingly inefficient in electric mode so the electric miles aren't really any cheaper than the petrol miles.
A normal hybrid Niro, Kona, Corolla etc will do over 60mpg without much effort, which is just over 10p per mile at current fuel prices. A PHEV will do about 3 miles per kWH, which is ..... just over 10p per mile if on a standard electricity tariff. A good smallish EV (the e-Niro would be a decent choice) will do between 4 and 5 miles per kWH in town, which is cheaper to run than petrol even on standard electricity prices.
Yes, he does c200 mile trips a few times per year (coming to see us for the day is a 160 mile round trip), that was the big driver in not going full EV.The only real point of PHEVs in my opinion is to avoid company car tax. They are really expensive to buy, and most are surprisingly inefficient in electric mode so the electric miles aren't really any cheaper than the petrol miles.
A normal hybrid Niro, Kona, Corolla etc will do over 60mpg without much effort, which is just over 10p per mile at current fuel prices. A PHEV will do about 3 miles per kWH, which is ..... just over 10p per mile if on a standard electricity tariff. A good smallish EV (the e-Niro would be a decent choice) will do between 4 and 5 miles per kWH in town, which is cheaper to run than petrol even on standard electricity prices.
TheDeuce said:
On the assumption he's not ever going to exceed the range of a similarly priced EV, is there are reason to not just get an EV?
The fact he can charge at home should make it a no brainer, he won't have to faff about at petrol stations ever again
He does sometimes do longer journeys than the range of this sector of EV would offer.The fact he can charge at home should make it a no brainer, he won't have to faff about at petrol stations ever again
I was tasked with finding a replacement for my 80+ MIL. Pretty much the task you don't want, lol.
Her current car is not that old (six years old I think) and doesn't get used much so my recommendation was do nothing which so far has stuck. It drives very well so no reason to replace it. Anyways, I looked at what's out there and there are indeed various Toyota hybrids that are worse than what she has now, PHEVs that seem to be too expensive, and EVs that she don't want to deal with. She also has pottering around + longer trips requirement and her current car does that very well and I think she would struggle with all the faff that goes with charging, either at home or away, and the phone full of apps that you need for this to work. I think if I had ICE and I were elderly I would just keep it tbh. Let the next generation worry about the faff.
She incidentally had a Honda Jazz previously and it was a really good car to drive. The previous pure ICE version, not a hybrid. Back when cars were simple and light.
Her current car is not that old (six years old I think) and doesn't get used much so my recommendation was do nothing which so far has stuck. It drives very well so no reason to replace it. Anyways, I looked at what's out there and there are indeed various Toyota hybrids that are worse than what she has now, PHEVs that seem to be too expensive, and EVs that she don't want to deal with. She also has pottering around + longer trips requirement and her current car does that very well and I think she would struggle with all the faff that goes with charging, either at home or away, and the phone full of apps that you need for this to work. I think if I had ICE and I were elderly I would just keep it tbh. Let the next generation worry about the faff.
She incidentally had a Honda Jazz previously and it was a really good car to drive. The previous pure ICE version, not a hybrid. Back when cars were simple and light.
DMZ said:
I was tasked with finding a replacement for my 80+ MIL. Pretty much the task you don't want, lol.
Her current car is not that old (six years old I think) and doesn't get used much so my recommendation was do nothing which so far has stuck. It drives very well so no reason to replace it. Anyways, I looked at what's out there and there are indeed various Toyota hybrids that are worse than what she has now, PHEVs that seem to be too expensive, and EVs that she don't want to deal with. She also has pottering around + longer trips requirement and her current car does that very well and I think she would struggle with all the faff that goes with charging, either at home or away, and the phone full of apps that you need for this to work. I think if I had ICE and I were elderly I would just keep it tbh. Let the next generation worry about the faff.
She incidentally had a Honda Jazz previously and it was a really good car to drive. The previous pure ICE version, not a hybrid. Back when cars were simple and light.
This was the conversation we had with him 5yrs ago. But at 10yrs old, the car is a little leggy and not as easy to get into as it's very low.Her current car is not that old (six years old I think) and doesn't get used much so my recommendation was do nothing which so far has stuck. It drives very well so no reason to replace it. Anyways, I looked at what's out there and there are indeed various Toyota hybrids that are worse than what she has now, PHEVs that seem to be too expensive, and EVs that she don't want to deal with. She also has pottering around + longer trips requirement and her current car does that very well and I think she would struggle with all the faff that goes with charging, either at home or away, and the phone full of apps that you need for this to work. I think if I had ICE and I were elderly I would just keep it tbh. Let the next generation worry about the faff.
She incidentally had a Honda Jazz previously and it was a really good car to drive. The previous pure ICE version, not a hybrid. Back when cars were simple and light.
Great call from a few on Toyotas though.
Thanks!
I'm an oldie. I do very few miles now and mostly local. But I do still enjoy driving.
I am buying a used EV. As I can charge at home, I will only need to charge away when I'm on a (rare - once a month) longer run.
I see absolutely no point in going for a hybrid. I am perfectly able to manage the range/charging process and as 99% of the time I will charge at home, there's no point in the penalty of an ICE to pull around. I will also be rid of the most complex bit that needs the most servicing.
I am buying a used EV. As I can charge at home, I will only need to charge away when I'm on a (rare - once a month) longer run.
I see absolutely no point in going for a hybrid. I am perfectly able to manage the range/charging process and as 99% of the time I will charge at home, there's no point in the penalty of an ICE to pull around. I will also be rid of the most complex bit that needs the most servicing.
Julian Scott said:
Yes, he does c200 mile trips a few times per year (coming to see us for the day is a 160 mile round trip), that was the big driver in not going full EV.
An i3 with REX? Keeps the familiarity of controls etc with the 320, kept charged via a 3pin in the garage and no need for any special tariff given the level of usage, will do the 200 mile occasional drive with simple petrol top ups and the slightly inconvenient rear doors are going to be less of a hassle unless he does a Hefner!It's also the only generic EV that's been on sale to date that will become a classic and appreciate in value in the future.
It does have a marginally raised seating position but what really caught my attention was the superb all round visibility which has been lost from so many modern cars.
Paul Drawmer said:
I'm an oldie. I do very few miles now and mostly local. But I do still enjoy driving.
I am buying a used EV. As I can charge at home, I will only need to charge away when I'm on a (rare - once a month) longer run.
I see absolutely no point in going for a hybrid. I am perfectly able to manage the range/charging process and as 99% of the time I will charge at home, there's no point in the penalty of an ICE to pull around. I will also be rid of the most complex bit that needs the most servicing.
This is why I also don't really understand the desire for a hybrid. To benefit from the electric range of the hybrid on a daily basis also requires it to be plugged in at home - and much more often than an EV actually.I am buying a used EV. As I can charge at home, I will only need to charge away when I'm on a (rare - once a month) longer run.
I see absolutely no point in going for a hybrid. I am perfectly able to manage the range/charging process and as 99% of the time I will charge at home, there's no point in the penalty of an ICE to pull around. I will also be rid of the most complex bit that needs the most servicing.
The EV is the simplest solution overall, even allowing for reliance on public charging very occasionally. Albeit the purchase cost of a full EV might be a factor.
TheDeuce said:
This is why I also don't really understand the desire for a hybrid. To benefit from the electric range of the hybrid on a daily basis also requires it to be plugged in at home - and much more often than an EV actually.
The EV is the simplest solution overall, even allowing for reliance on public charging very occasionally. Albeit the purchase cost of a full EV might be a factor.
It's the wealthiest generation to have ever existed and the one that owns the bulk of the off street residential parking. It's also the most time rich and flexible demographic in society. The EV is the simplest solution overall, even allowing for reliance on public charging very occasionally. Albeit the purchase cost of a full EV might be a factor.
Simultaneously it contains the largest group of people easily sold any old tut just by getting the marketing right or offering a free Parker pen.
Yet, it's the smaller element within that group who are taking full advantage of EVs.
It's a bit of a fundamental failure in the marketing of EVs in reality. Too much targeting of younger blokes with beards and problems sleeping at night due to the mountains of debt from their insatiable shopping addiction when there's an enormous army of time rich, cash rich, land rich blokes who could happily hoover up every single EV imported into the U.K.
It's not just a failure of marketing but govt policy? It's all well and good offering massive tax incentives to middle income workers but we're ignoring the higher income non workers, the folks buying all the big ticket SUVs, keeping all the country pubs and garden centres open? It seems a bit of an overnight to not be doing something to incentivise this important demographic to switch to EVs more. Instead we seem happy to let it head down some frothing, Charlton Hestonesque cul de sac?
The breaking of the manufacturers' grip on nearly new pricing of EVs will hopefully achieve what the govt a manufacturers have failed to date to achieve?
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