A major little word of warning re. EV conversions
Discussion
As some of you know, I restored a 1960 Mini ditching the 850cc engine for an electric motor.
Unfortunately, DVLA said that because I drilled holes in the boot, it is now a modified kit-car.
They couldn't fault the conversion, but due to the holes my car needs an IVA test which it could never pass.
They refused to allow the holes to be welded up so this is terminal, the car is scrap.
This has now been reported in the press a little, by those who actually believe that it is real (it is a little like ''I married Elvis on the moon").
My MP has written 3 times and been fobbed off 3 times.
The British Classic car EV industry is in big trouble and trying to get a liaison going with the dept of Transport to establish a code of some sort to allow them to stay in business in light of this DVLA idiocy.
The holes I drilled were to safely mount the batteries. The conversion was designed by a Doctor of engineering and a degree qualified engineer, but over ruled as unsafe by a bureaucrat.
IMHO if DVLA get away with twisting their old rules to apply to the new issue of classic car EV conversions, then what is to stop them from popping up any car show, finding a car with a hole drilled, rusted or otherwise, and insisting it should have an IVA and then a Q-plate.
So if you or anyone you know is planning a conversion, be careful. My lovely Mini no longer has a registration and I'm not even allowed to convert it back to petrol, even if I thought that was ethical in light of the planet pollution problem!
Unfortunately, DVLA said that because I drilled holes in the boot, it is now a modified kit-car.
They couldn't fault the conversion, but due to the holes my car needs an IVA test which it could never pass.
They refused to allow the holes to be welded up so this is terminal, the car is scrap.
This has now been reported in the press a little, by those who actually believe that it is real (it is a little like ''I married Elvis on the moon").
My MP has written 3 times and been fobbed off 3 times.
The British Classic car EV industry is in big trouble and trying to get a liaison going with the dept of Transport to establish a code of some sort to allow them to stay in business in light of this DVLA idiocy.
The holes I drilled were to safely mount the batteries. The conversion was designed by a Doctor of engineering and a degree qualified engineer, but over ruled as unsafe by a bureaucrat.
IMHO if DVLA get away with twisting their old rules to apply to the new issue of classic car EV conversions, then what is to stop them from popping up any car show, finding a car with a hole drilled, rusted or otherwise, and insisting it should have an IVA and then a Q-plate.
So if you or anyone you know is planning a conversion, be careful. My lovely Mini no longer has a registration and I'm not even allowed to convert it back to petrol, even if I thought that was ethical in light of the planet pollution problem!
Another tactic would be to ask them how you could fit a towbar to the car.
On a 1960 (or any 1959 to 1998'ish when the stupid EU type approval rules came in) Mini, that would certainly involve drilling some holes in the boot.
Would drilling said towbar holes render you in the same situation? I doubt it, but as we know the world has mad and gets madder every day.
Good luck!
On a 1960 (or any 1959 to 1998'ish when the stupid EU type approval rules came in) Mini, that would certainly involve drilling some holes in the boot.
Would drilling said towbar holes render you in the same situation? I doubt it, but as we know the world has mad and gets madder every day.
Good luck!
I am afraid common sense and precedents are pretty absent here!
The DVLA actually require camper van conversions to have windows cut out but they don't need any sort of test!
I am trying to spread the word a bit, my drilled holes are only as bad as a new wing mirrors, fog lights, better seatbelts and other period correct modifications........
The DVLA actually require camper van conversions to have windows cut out but they don't need any sort of test!
I am trying to spread the word a bit, my drilled holes are only as bad as a new wing mirrors, fog lights, better seatbelts and other period correct modifications........
Edited by bitsilly on Sunday 23 October 10:39
Sorry to hear of your problems. Seems pretty stupid for officialdom to stop EV conversions of classic cars - I think there can't be anything 'greener' (short of walking!) than converting an existing vehicle using 'used' EV motors etc.
I have always wondered how Vintage Voltage seem to just put their completed vehicles on the road, without (even seemingly) bothering with an MOT, let alone SVA etc
An unscrupulous individual might just (ahem) 'build' another EV mini - one that is almost identical to your mini (with no visible holes in the boot) ........ after 'scrapping' your mini. And just not tell them. b
ds!
Old 'existing' cars can seemingly be modified in all sorts of ways. Providing you don't go near officialdom..................
I have always wondered how Vintage Voltage seem to just put their completed vehicles on the road, without (even seemingly) bothering with an MOT, let alone SVA etc
An unscrupulous individual might just (ahem) 'build' another EV mini - one that is almost identical to your mini (with no visible holes in the boot) ........ after 'scrapping' your mini. And just not tell them. b
ds!Old 'existing' cars can seemingly be modified in all sorts of ways. Providing you don't go near officialdom..................
Thanks all.
The holes were for mounting a plate to mount the batteries. The plate was secured over the cut out box of the original battery so actually removed a stress concentration!
There are many firms doing conversions and you-tube stuff etc. Since I have been having this problem a number of the registrations you see on the TV have been deleted, and some of them are still listed as petrol.
If you are planning a conversion I would ask in detail how they plan on registering it afterwards.
Someone recently contacted me to say after over 2 years the DVLA 'reassessed' his case and said he needs an IVA.
I think they are cynically applying this nonsense to anything which has upset them in the past, but I am bias!
The holes were for mounting a plate to mount the batteries. The plate was secured over the cut out box of the original battery so actually removed a stress concentration!
There are many firms doing conversions and you-tube stuff etc. Since I have been having this problem a number of the registrations you see on the TV have been deleted, and some of them are still listed as petrol.
If you are planning a conversion I would ask in detail how they plan on registering it afterwards.
Someone recently contacted me to say after over 2 years the DVLA 'reassessed' his case and said he needs an IVA.
I think they are cynically applying this nonsense to anything which has upset them in the past, but I am bias!
Here is the original build thread, but you may have to ask to join the forum to see the photos (sorry Mk 1 moderators!).
https://mk1-forum.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3118...
I'll see about putting photos here...
https://mk1-forum.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3118...
I'll see about putting photos here...
bitsilly said:
As some of you know, I restored a 1960 Mini ditching the 850cc engine for an electric motor.
Unfortunately, DVLA said that because I drilled holes in the boot, it is now a modified kit-car.
They couldn't fault the conversion, but due to the holes my car needs an IVA test which it could never pass.
They refused to allow the holes to be welded up so this is terminal, the car is scrap.
This has now been reported in the press a little, by those who actually believe that it is real (it is a little like ''I married Elvis on the moon").
My MP has written 3 times and been fobbed off 3 times.
The British Classic car EV industry is in big trouble and trying to get a liaison going with the dept of Transport to establish a code of some sort to allow them to stay in business in light of this DVLA idiocy.
The holes I drilled were to safely mount the batteries. The conversion was designed by a Doctor of engineering and a degree qualified engineer, but over ruled as unsafe by a bureaucrat.
IMHO if DVLA get away with twisting their old rules to apply to the new issue of classic car EV conversions, then what is to stop them from popping up any car show, finding a car with a hole drilled, rusted or otherwise, and insisting it should have an IVA and then a Q-plate.
So if you or anyone you know is planning a conversion, be careful. My lovely Mini no longer has a registration and I'm not even allowed to convert it back to petrol, even if I thought that was ethical in light of the planet pollution problem!
What paperwork did they issue and what regulation are they quoting?Unfortunately, DVLA said that because I drilled holes in the boot, it is now a modified kit-car.
They couldn't fault the conversion, but due to the holes my car needs an IVA test which it could never pass.
They refused to allow the holes to be welded up so this is terminal, the car is scrap.
This has now been reported in the press a little, by those who actually believe that it is real (it is a little like ''I married Elvis on the moon").
My MP has written 3 times and been fobbed off 3 times.
The British Classic car EV industry is in big trouble and trying to get a liaison going with the dept of Transport to establish a code of some sort to allow them to stay in business in light of this DVLA idiocy.
The holes I drilled were to safely mount the batteries. The conversion was designed by a Doctor of engineering and a degree qualified engineer, but over ruled as unsafe by a bureaucrat.
IMHO if DVLA get away with twisting their old rules to apply to the new issue of classic car EV conversions, then what is to stop them from popping up any car show, finding a car with a hole drilled, rusted or otherwise, and insisting it should have an IVA and then a Q-plate.
So if you or anyone you know is planning a conversion, be careful. My lovely Mini no longer has a registration and I'm not even allowed to convert it back to petrol, even if I thought that was ethical in light of the planet pollution problem!
No paperwork to speak of, just a letter and another refusing the appeal.
They would not let me see the inspectors report, even when I used FOI request, and also refused to let my MP see it.
The consensus is that they used an excuse to stop my conversion, if it wasn't holes it would be something else.
The EV industry are having all sorts of problems now too with refusals due to 'new problems'.
They would not let me see the inspectors report, even when I used FOI request, and also refused to let my MP see it.
The consensus is that they used an excuse to stop my conversion, if it wasn't holes it would be something else.
The EV industry are having all sorts of problems now too with refusals due to 'new problems'.
Sorry, I forgot
the failure is based on the kit car rules which give points for having original features and using original parts. Mine pretty much had maximum possible points except for the engine which I think deducted one point. Then they said because I had modified the chassis the chassis scored 0 out of 5.
So I lost too many points.
The modification was because 'material had been removed by drilling'.
the failure is based on the kit car rules which give points for having original features and using original parts. Mine pretty much had maximum possible points except for the engine which I think deducted one point. Then they said because I had modified the chassis the chassis scored 0 out of 5.
So I lost too many points.
The modification was because 'material had been removed by drilling'.
Dear moderator,
why did you remove my similar post on the Classic car section?.
Telling Classic car owners who my be planning to do an EV is in their interest.
More relevant perhaps than letting me tell EV owners of my experience.
Please can you re-instate the Classic car thread and delete this one if you have to.
If the twain shall never meet surely there is no harm.
Thank you
why did you remove my similar post on the Classic car section?.
Telling Classic car owners who my be planning to do an EV is in their interest.
More relevant perhaps than letting me tell EV owners of my experience.
Please can you re-instate the Classic car thread and delete this one if you have to.
If the twain shall never meet surely there is no harm.
Thank you
I watched Vintage Voltage (it's been repeated a couple of times on daytime on Quest) and like a good nosey parker, I did a search on many of the cars. 
They were mostly still recorded at DVLA as having the original petrol / diesel (in the Land Rover case) fitted, I suspected it was for this reason. If you change an engine, you just tell DVLA and they very rarely want to inspect, but it seems that converting to electric is different.
Another issue is that in the case of cars over 40 years old, they are only MoT exempt if 'mostly' unmodified. When renewing VED (at £0), you have to tick the box and declare that a vehicle has not been modified in the last 30 years. I had to do this with my 1975 Triumph Toledo this week. Mine has different wheels and interior, and a non-standard rear bumper. This I consider not 'substantially' modified, the engine is standard.
So, even if accepted, a classic now an EV will have to be MoT'd every year. Not an issue to many owners, not only since they won't be short of the money (have you seen conversion costs?!), but because many classic owners volunteer for the test anyway for safety's sake.
A couple of the conversions on VV were done on Irish plated cars so it may be worth trying to find out what they do?
They were mostly still recorded at DVLA as having the original petrol / diesel (in the Land Rover case) fitted, I suspected it was for this reason. If you change an engine, you just tell DVLA and they very rarely want to inspect, but it seems that converting to electric is different.
Another issue is that in the case of cars over 40 years old, they are only MoT exempt if 'mostly' unmodified. When renewing VED (at £0), you have to tick the box and declare that a vehicle has not been modified in the last 30 years. I had to do this with my 1975 Triumph Toledo this week. Mine has different wheels and interior, and a non-standard rear bumper. This I consider not 'substantially' modified, the engine is standard.
So, even if accepted, a classic now an EV will have to be MoT'd every year. Not an issue to many owners, not only since they won't be short of the money (have you seen conversion costs?!), but because many classic owners volunteer for the test anyway for safety's sake.
A couple of the conversions on VV were done on Irish plated cars so it may be worth trying to find out what they do?
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