My EV Journey So Far
Discussion
I am on EV number 5, so I’m a bit of a veteran. Thought I'd commit my thoughts & share.
I’ve had 2 of the early Renault Zoes, a 30kwh LEAF, a 40KWH LEAF & I have just collected a new i3S 120Ah. At no point in 5 years of EV driving have I felt driving an EV has compromised my ability to complete a trip, mostly I guess due to actually planning my longer trips carefully, to have a contingency plan should my preferred charge point on the route fail to work.
The Zoe was cheap “in” to the world of EV’s, sadly the first Zoe died after 4 days with traction battery failure.
Along came Zoe 2, after a week it had A/C issues that resulted in multiple, repeat returns to the Renault garage to have rectified, after a year of Zoe 2 I decided it was time to move to a more grown up EV, that’s when the 30kwh LEAF came along.
The 30kwh LEAF was an excellent car, I could never get away from it’s ugly duckling looks though. Add to that the fact I was travelling from Bristol to the Williams F1 teams base in Oxfordshire every day a further range upgrade was needed as I really wanted to do the trip without stopping to charge, fortuitously the 40kwh LEAF was announced at the same time.
I collected the 40kwh LEAF 2.Zero on 1st March 2018, the snowiest day I can remember for many years. This car was excellent, the range was great, I loved the Spring Cloud Green colour, it had a great level of standard equipment including steering assist & intelligent cruise control. It was quiet, smooth, comfortable…and theirin lay the problem for me. I’m a massive car nut, I’ve raced cars & karts for year, so the car was just too…dull. So an alternativ, more exciting EV was required.
I was all set to lease a Tesla Model on a 4year agreement (25k miles a year) until I realised the warranty was only 50k miles, that would entail me running a Tesla (arguable not the most reliable car around) for 2 year, unwarrantied, with the associated risk of Tesla-esque repair bills.
Now I’ve always thought the BMW i3 was a funky looking car, so arranged with Cotswold BMW to borrow one for a weekend, the same weekend we spent looking at Kia e-Niros & Hyundai Kona EVs. The deduction after a long weekend with it was that it had stupid doors & a tiny boot, but a certain charm I could not put my finger on. Maybe it was my inner geek, I’m a motorsport designer, so the bare carbon appealed, as did the low (for an EV) kerb weight. Clearly the design team at BMW knew what they were doing.
The loan car was returned on the Monday morning, we did some numbers on a standard i3, 2 year lease & the figures were great, however, all the time the i3S in the showroom was calling my name, nagging in the back of my mind, it’s looked so smart. As luck would have it there was no stock of standar i3’s in the country, so I simply “had to have” the I3S that was in the showroom, how unfortunate!!!
It’s a different animal to the standard i3, stiffer roll bars, spring & dampers, heavier steering, wider tires on bigger rims & a few 10ths off the traffic light grand prix 0-60 all add up to something that, for an EV, feels rather special & is actually a great drivers car.
Sure nothing gets you away from the fact fact the tyres are very narrow, so cornering speeds are grio, not bravery limited, but with a deft touch on the steering & throttle very decent pace can be maintained. A car you actually have to drive, which is after all what I was after.
As a side note it would appear to be about 10%more efficient than the LEAF 40kwh on the same daily commute.
I’ve had 2 of the early Renault Zoes, a 30kwh LEAF, a 40KWH LEAF & I have just collected a new i3S 120Ah. At no point in 5 years of EV driving have I felt driving an EV has compromised my ability to complete a trip, mostly I guess due to actually planning my longer trips carefully, to have a contingency plan should my preferred charge point on the route fail to work.
The Zoe was cheap “in” to the world of EV’s, sadly the first Zoe died after 4 days with traction battery failure.
Along came Zoe 2, after a week it had A/C issues that resulted in multiple, repeat returns to the Renault garage to have rectified, after a year of Zoe 2 I decided it was time to move to a more grown up EV, that’s when the 30kwh LEAF came along.
The 30kwh LEAF was an excellent car, I could never get away from it’s ugly duckling looks though. Add to that the fact I was travelling from Bristol to the Williams F1 teams base in Oxfordshire every day a further range upgrade was needed as I really wanted to do the trip without stopping to charge, fortuitously the 40kwh LEAF was announced at the same time.
I collected the 40kwh LEAF 2.Zero on 1st March 2018, the snowiest day I can remember for many years. This car was excellent, the range was great, I loved the Spring Cloud Green colour, it had a great level of standard equipment including steering assist & intelligent cruise control. It was quiet, smooth, comfortable…and theirin lay the problem for me. I’m a massive car nut, I’ve raced cars & karts for year, so the car was just too…dull. So an alternativ, more exciting EV was required.
I was all set to lease a Tesla Model on a 4year agreement (25k miles a year) until I realised the warranty was only 50k miles, that would entail me running a Tesla (arguable not the most reliable car around) for 2 year, unwarrantied, with the associated risk of Tesla-esque repair bills.
Now I’ve always thought the BMW i3 was a funky looking car, so arranged with Cotswold BMW to borrow one for a weekend, the same weekend we spent looking at Kia e-Niros & Hyundai Kona EVs. The deduction after a long weekend with it was that it had stupid doors & a tiny boot, but a certain charm I could not put my finger on. Maybe it was my inner geek, I’m a motorsport designer, so the bare carbon appealed, as did the low (for an EV) kerb weight. Clearly the design team at BMW knew what they were doing.
The loan car was returned on the Monday morning, we did some numbers on a standard i3, 2 year lease & the figures were great, however, all the time the i3S in the showroom was calling my name, nagging in the back of my mind, it’s looked so smart. As luck would have it there was no stock of standar i3’s in the country, so I simply “had to have” the I3S that was in the showroom, how unfortunate!!!
It’s a different animal to the standard i3, stiffer roll bars, spring & dampers, heavier steering, wider tires on bigger rims & a few 10ths off the traffic light grand prix 0-60 all add up to something that, for an EV, feels rather special & is actually a great drivers car.
Sure nothing gets you away from the fact fact the tyres are very narrow, so cornering speeds are grio, not bravery limited, but with a deft touch on the steering & throttle very decent pace can be maintained. A car you actually have to drive, which is after all what I was after.
As a side note it would appear to be about 10%more efficient than the LEAF 40kwh on the same daily commute.
i3 sits among a small number of cars that are "way more than the sum of their parts" in my experience! Cars that feel special and have a character of their own. I'd include original mini's, the Ferrari F40, and Land Rover defenders in this group! ;-)
There is something very endearing about the quirky i3. I've had an M3 CS on loan for a couple of weeks, and i'm somewhat surprised myself to say, it got less use than my i3......
There is something very endearing about the quirky i3. I've had an M3 CS on loan for a couple of weeks, and i'm somewhat surprised myself to say, it got less use than my i3......
Frimley111R said:
SpikeBmth said:
The i3 is a little quirky, and the older ones arn't 100% electric, but they are growing on me!
I'm pretty sure some were but people opted for the ReX versions just in case. I think they dropped the ReX version now that people are comfortable with the full EV range.I think the longest range REX (94ah or 33kwh cars) was around 180 miles (74 miles more than the equivalent battery EV i3).
The range of the latest 120ah (42.2kwh) cars is up to 195 miles, I believe in reality I could see 160miles form the i3S I'm driving, as opposed to 140ish in the LEAF 40kwh.
IN51GHT said:
Yes, the earlier ones you had a choice of full EV, or a range extender that had a marginally shorter EV range, but as the name suggested a range extender engine onboard that generated electricity to help the battery.
I think the longest range REX (94ah or 33kwh cars) was around 180 miles (74 miles more than the equivalent battery EV i3).
The range of the latest 120ah (42.2kwh) cars is up to 195 miles, I believe in reality I could see 160miles form the i3S I'm driving, as opposed to 140ish in the LEAF 40kwh.
Thank you for explaining how the engine in an i3 operates... now it makes sense why an i3 is counted as a full EV, as the engine doesn't drive the wheels directlyI think the longest range REX (94ah or 33kwh cars) was around 180 miles (74 miles more than the equivalent battery EV i3).
The range of the latest 120ah (42.2kwh) cars is up to 195 miles, I believe in reality I could see 160miles form the i3S I'm driving, as opposed to 140ish in the LEAF 40kwh.
SpikeBmth said:
IN51GHT said:
Yes, the earlier ones you had a choice of full EV, or a range extender that had a marginally shorter EV range, but as the name suggested a range extender engine onboard that generated electricity to help the battery.
I think the longest range REX (94ah or 33kwh cars) was around 180 miles (74 miles more than the equivalent battery EV i3).
The range of the latest 120ah (42.2kwh) cars is up to 195 miles, I believe in reality I could see 160miles form the i3S I'm driving, as opposed to 140ish in the LEAF 40kwh.
Thank you for explaining how the engine in an i3 operates... now it makes sense why an i3 is counted as a full EV, as the engine doesn't drive the wheels directlyI think the longest range REX (94ah or 33kwh cars) was around 180 miles (74 miles more than the equivalent battery EV i3).
The range of the latest 120ah (42.2kwh) cars is up to 195 miles, I believe in reality I could see 160miles form the i3S I'm driving, as opposed to 140ish in the LEAF 40kwh.
Edited by IN51GHT on Tuesday 25th June 12:10
IN51GHT said:
I believe this is the same way the Ampera/Volt work. i.e. With the I/C unit being a generator. That way the I/C unit can be designed to be very efficient at a set RPM, rather than a traditional I/C car where the wheels are driven by the engine.
I had an Ampera, and that's my understanding of the Range extender. It wasn't brilliant in the Ampera as the engine was pretty rough and noisy, and had the habit of revving to its 'max charge mode' at odd times on a journey - especially bad as this was quite high up on the rev-range. Every time it happened with a passenger on board they would look slightly alarmed and ask 'is it supposed to do that'? Edited by IN51GHT on Tuesday 25th June 12:10
Big Nanas said:
I had an Ampera, and that's my understanding of the Range extender. It wasn't brilliant in the Ampera as the engine was pretty rough and noisy, and had the habit of revving to its 'max charge mode' at odd times on a journey - especially bad as this was quite high up on the rev-range. Every time it happened with a passenger on board they would look slightly alarmed and ask 'is it supposed to do that'?
It is fine in the i3. Mainly because the range on electric is pretty high so you rarely need it. Sounds like a sewing machine when running though.IN51GHT said:
The range of the latest 120ah (42.2kwh) cars is up to 195 miles, I believe in reality I could see 160miles form the i3S I'm driving, as opposed to 140ish in the LEAF 40kwh.
That's interesting, I looked at the i3 a couple of years ago before I bought my Zoe but the boot was too small, the range was too short, it only had 4 seats, it made me feel ill, the handling was bad and it was much more expensive, so I chose the Zoe.I have done 43k miles in 17 months in my 40kwh Zoe with no issues other than an occasionally rattly tailgate, I regularly get 170 miles of range and once achieved 185 miles on a hot summer day driving mostly on A roads.
I had expected that the new i3 and Leaf would both have done better than the figures you have achieved.
I don't understand how BMW built a small carbon fibre car and ended up with less range from a bigger battery than Renault managed with a bigger, heavier converted Clio?
Edited by Pooh on Tuesday 25th June 18:06
Edited by Pooh on Tuesday 25th June 18:09
GetCarter said:
Hoping to go EV at some stage, but I regularly drive 155 miles (310 mile round trip) and there are no chargers en-route or at the destination. Once there, I drive quite a bit. When I can get guaranteed 400 miles per charge, I'll buy one. Not until then.
What's the route (roughly) ?MaxSo said:
GetCarter said:
Hoping to go EV at some stage, but I regularly drive 155 miles (310 mile round trip) and there are no chargers en-route or at the destination. Once there, I drive quite a bit. When I can get guaranteed 400 miles per charge, I'll buy one. Not until then.
What's the route (roughly) ?
That's approx a 75 mile radius BTW.
Pooh said:
I don't understand how BMW built a small carbon fibre car and ended up with less range from a bigger battery than Renault managed with a bigger, heavier converted Clio?
I imagine the difference in power output would play a part? The standard Zoe is painfully slow, not something I've ever heard levelled at the i3.Pooh said:
I don't understand how BMW built a small carbon fibre car and ended up with less range from a bigger battery than Renault managed with a bigger, heavier converted Clio?
The Zoe has a larger useable battery (41kWh useable, 44.1kWh gross) than the i3 (37.9kWh useable, 42.2kWh gross).
Overall efficiency is roughly the same, despite the i3 having far superior performance - in large part due to its reduced weight stemming from its manner and materials of construction.
SWoll said:
MaxSo said:
GetCarter said:
Hoping to go EV at some stage, but I regularly drive 155 miles (310 mile round trip) and there are no chargers en-route or at the destination. Once there, I drive quite a bit. When I can get guaranteed 400 miles per charge, I'll buy one. Not until then.
What's the route (roughly) ?That's approx a 75 mile radius BTW.
The other thing is that the one near me is in the car park of the local hotel, obviously meant for patrons. I'm pretty sure they'd take a dim view of the 'great unwashed' turning up using their charging point. I don't know this for a fact, but I bet the others in the NW Highlands are similarly situated. I very much doubt they are on public roads.
I looked at the Audi E Tron when buying earlier this year (as that's the size of car I want/need) and apart from the fact that the remote charge takes 50 minutes, the starting price is £70k. Fully spec'd it's close to £90k. (+/- twice the price of the ICE equiv). I paid less than half that for a 300 BHP 4x4 Jag Sportbreak.
When I can charge at home, drive 400 miles without battery stress, get home and recharge, then I'll buy one. I'll even consider spending £90k!
Edited by GetCarter on Wednesday 26th June 06:56
Similar story for me. Tempted by an EV and decided in 2015 to lease an i3 for two years, the early BEV model so 70mile-ish range. I figured that doing this would prove whether my normal driving really was suited to EV for 90+% of the time as people say. I kept my other car for longer trips.
Over two years and 12,000 miles, yes I used the other car for long trips and holidays into Europe, but I found myself taking the other car for no other reason than it had been sat in the garage for weeks at a time with no use. Every other trip was in the i3. Just twice I found myself with range anxiety as the range metre dropped to below 5 miles, but inevitably wherever I was going there was a charger and I have a charger at home so every morning the battery had full range.
The i3 was an indulgence, but like the OP I liked the approach to the i3, the carbon, the lack of weight, the fact it looked to be designed as an EV from the start not an electric powered petrol model. I even like the design and never had any real issues with the back doors.
Size wise, people say its small, but with the rear seats folded it became the go-to car for tip runs and if space was needed. There is loads of space in it and it sits high.
Two years over and it went back, point proven. The only thing I didn't like was its stability on the motorway as being tall and light it did get buffeted around a bit.
I went without for about 12 months and have now got a leased i3s 120ah, one of the first in the country. It is brilliant. Range is 160+ miles and all concerns about range have vanished completely. The S spec totally resolves the stability issue and its huge fun to drive. In fact, I recently sold my '17 330d due to it now sitting for weeks unused and when I did use it found it slow and cumbersome and just not as fun to drive compared to the i3s.
I spec'd mine reasonably well as I fully intend to keep it after the lease. The first one proved to me that it was a quarter of the price to run than my other car in terms of fuel so as a long term proposition is a no brainer.
The range issue is understandable and having a large range is all well and good, but all that means is the battery is huge and takes far longer to charge. It's just like buying a car with a 150 litre fuel tank rather than a 75 litre one. You get through the fuel at the same rate but look at the size of a Tesla or iPace - they sit on a vast floorpan to hold all this battery capacity (and weight) which for 90% of the time, you'll never need.
For me 150-170 mile range is ideal for 99% of the time. Its simple enough to hire a car for the very few times in the year I need to doing hundreds of miles in one trip. And I live in Scotland where long distances are fairly routine...
Over two years and 12,000 miles, yes I used the other car for long trips and holidays into Europe, but I found myself taking the other car for no other reason than it had been sat in the garage for weeks at a time with no use. Every other trip was in the i3. Just twice I found myself with range anxiety as the range metre dropped to below 5 miles, but inevitably wherever I was going there was a charger and I have a charger at home so every morning the battery had full range.
The i3 was an indulgence, but like the OP I liked the approach to the i3, the carbon, the lack of weight, the fact it looked to be designed as an EV from the start not an electric powered petrol model. I even like the design and never had any real issues with the back doors.
Size wise, people say its small, but with the rear seats folded it became the go-to car for tip runs and if space was needed. There is loads of space in it and it sits high.
Two years over and it went back, point proven. The only thing I didn't like was its stability on the motorway as being tall and light it did get buffeted around a bit.
I went without for about 12 months and have now got a leased i3s 120ah, one of the first in the country. It is brilliant. Range is 160+ miles and all concerns about range have vanished completely. The S spec totally resolves the stability issue and its huge fun to drive. In fact, I recently sold my '17 330d due to it now sitting for weeks unused and when I did use it found it slow and cumbersome and just not as fun to drive compared to the i3s.
I spec'd mine reasonably well as I fully intend to keep it after the lease. The first one proved to me that it was a quarter of the price to run than my other car in terms of fuel so as a long term proposition is a no brainer.
The range issue is understandable and having a large range is all well and good, but all that means is the battery is huge and takes far longer to charge. It's just like buying a car with a 150 litre fuel tank rather than a 75 litre one. You get through the fuel at the same rate but look at the size of a Tesla or iPace - they sit on a vast floorpan to hold all this battery capacity (and weight) which for 90% of the time, you'll never need.
For me 150-170 mile range is ideal for 99% of the time. Its simple enough to hire a car for the very few times in the year I need to doing hundreds of miles in one trip. And I live in Scotland where long distances are fairly routine...
Pooh said:
IN51GHT said:
The range of the latest 120ah (42.2kwh) cars is up to 195 miles, I believe in reality I could see 160miles form the i3S I'm driving, as opposed to 140ish in the LEAF 40kwh.
That's interesting, I looked at the i3 a couple of years ago before I bought my Zoe but the boot was too small, the range was too short, it only had 4 seats, it made me feel ill, the handling was bad and it was much more expensive, so I chose the Zoe.I have done 43k miles in 17 months in my 40kwh Zoe with no issues other than an occasionally rattly tailgate, I regularly get 170 miles of range and once achieved 185 miles on a hot summer day driving mostly on A roads.
I had expected that the new i3 and Leaf would both have done better than the figures you have achieved.
I don't understand how BMW built a small carbon fibre car and ended up with less range from a bigger battery than Renault managed with a bigger, heavier converted Clio?
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