Worth plugging in?

[jonah35]

I have just had my p400e delivered
Says it does 31miles on a charge but people on here say 20

Trouble is 20 miles only costs maybe £3-5 in fuel doesn’t it? So for the sake of charging it I save a fiver let’s say

But how much will it cost to charge it? Couple of quid?

In other words isn’t it a bit of a con and not worth it? I can easily charge it in the garage but don’t have a specific wall charge point. Is it cheaper t charge from a wall charger as opposed to a normal plug socket? If a wall charger is £500 isn’t isn’t that going to take quite some time to recoup

Or is my logic flawed?

[Smiljan]

It'll just take less time to charge with a dedicated charger that's all, doesn't make it any cheaper, I think Autocar said 10 hours to charge from a normal 3 pin wall socket for these so just use that if you already have power in the garage.

[98elise]

jonah35 said:

I have just had my p400e delivered
Says it does 31miles on a charge but people on here say 20

Trouble is 20 miles only costs maybe £3-5 in fuel doesn’t it? So for the sake of charging it I save a fiver let’s say

But how much will it cost to charge it? Couple of quid?

In other words isn’t it a bit of a con and not worth it? I can easily charge it in the garage but don’t have a specific wall charge point. Is it cheaper t charge from a wall charger as opposed to a normal plug socket? If a wall charger is £500 isn’t isn’t that going to take quite some time to recoup

Or is my logic flawed?

20 miles will be about 7kWh, so probably less than £1 to charge.

I doubt the charger will be cheaper, it will be faster.

[Mr E]

The leaf is 3p a mile in electricity.

I’m aware of a lot of hybrids bought for the tax breaks that will never be plugged in.

[jonah35]

Thanks all
Ok re the charger I’ll just plug it into a normal socket if cost the same as I’ll only ever charge at night
If it’s a quid to get 20 miles as opposed to £5 of fuel that could save £4 a day I suppose which is worthwhile

Thanks

[sjg]

P400e has a 13kWh battery. You probably can't use more than 10 or 11kwh of that (some is reserved to protect it). So under £2 to charge from empty allowing for a bit of charging loss, assuming a fairly competitive tariff, but no special overnight rates or anything.

Reviews reckon on 23mpg on longer trips. My quick maths makes that about £5 for 20 miles at my local petrol station prices. I think it would actually be worse if you're doing shorter trips a lot from cold. If you're doing at least 20 miles a day I wouldn't sniff at £750pa saved in fuel.

I think it's worthwhile just on cost but there are other benefits - preheating/cooling the cabin (even if it's in a garage and won't ice up, and presumably has heated seats, getting in a warm car in winter is nice), and the smooth, silent running on electric. I'm assuming too it can do the same as my Golf and heat/cool to a schedule or via app even if it's not plugged in, as long as it has battery charge available to do it.

Even if your regular trips are beyond electric range it's much nicer to do slower speed stuff (like getting stuck in traffic on the M25) without the engine starting and stopping all the time. Plus to get the performance figures quoted you need the petrol and electric motors working together - the P400e is a lot of car to drag about with just a 2 litre 4-pot working by itself.

Assuming the manufacturer doesn't give away a charge point fitting, you can one fitted with government grant, the bit you pay is £279 with podpoint, maybe a bit less on others. It's a bit neater and designed for regular use, but inside a garage with good quality wiring, the 13A charger will do the job overnight just fine.

Edited by sjg on Saturday 13th April 13:58

[jonah35]

Wonderful response thanks very much

[caziques]

Distance travelled in an EV depends almost entirely on speed, 20 miles on the open road could equate to 30 round town.

Using cheap rate power at night, and using the back of an envelope calculator, I reckon an EV is 90% cheaper than a petrol vehicle. 1p (or NZ2c) per kilometre as opposed to 10p per k with petrol. Petrol is £1.15 per litre here in NZ.

I reckon I'm saving getting on for £2000 a year with an eNV200. 25000 miles so far, zero servicing costs.

Fast charging an EV takes the same amount of power as a slow charger, it's just quicker.

[rxe]

It very much depends on your driving pattern.

If you use if for a 50 mile commute, then no, its probably not worth it.

If you do a fair number of journeys of a few miles from home, then it will be way cheaper than a petrol engine that is starting from cold.

[jonah35]

At 15p per kWh it’s like £1.80 to charge
Trouble is that may only get me like 15 miles so 12 ppm

Fuel is what £6 a gallon? Let’s say if the car does 25 to the gallon then it would cost 24ppm

Lol as I’m typing this I realise it may halve my fuel bill but only for 15 miles of fuel a day so I suppose I may save a quid a day

I suppose it’s not to be sniffed at and I shouldn’t whinge but for the value of the car it just seems a bit comical to save £30-60per month.

But as another poster said having it charged may make it better to drive etc

Thanks all

[rxe]

Remember that your stone cold engine won't be doing 25 mpg for a mile or two. If you're regularly doing 2 mile runs to the shops or work, you're probably getting 15 mpg at best. This is the absolute winning scenario for these sort of hybrids.

On a conventional diesel, my commute went from 10 each way to 55 each way. My MPG went from about 32 to 46 when I did this....

[jonah35]

Thanks

I can’t see any downsides to charging it from what you guys have said and it would be lazy not to plug it in at night

Don’t know how they get away with the emissions on these etc as 90% of the time I’ll just be driving a heavy petrol powered 4x4

Bonkers

[rxe]

Slightly bonkers from an overall emissions perspective, but from an urban pollution perspective, they are spot on. If everyone drove these, we wouldn't have a pollution issue in cities. We could do that next year, with zero infrastructure required.

[Ruxpin]

jonah35 said:

Thanks

I can’t see any downsides to charging it from what you guys have said and it would be lazy not to plug it in at night

Don’t know how they get away with the emissions on these etc as 90% of the time I’ll just be driving a heavy petrol powered 4x4

Bonkers

My C350e is just over 3yrs old and nearly 60k miles and long term average of 47mpg - not bad for a near 300hp car and 12mpg average more than my previous 335D.

Early in its life i calculated plugging it in saved c£1 each charge.

"Petrol" MPG totally dependent on journey profile - 36mpg on m-way with no charging, 42mpg general driving with no charging, 50-100-infinite mpg with charging

I have got on really well with the car but i find most people don't understand plugin hybrids and only see the headline (or lowline) figures of 35-40mpg if you drive without charging and only 9mile electric range - whats the point etc.

Most impressive stat i find is that over 60k miles the petrol engine has been off for nearly 30k - nearly 50% of my mileage coasting or on electric! and that is in what is perceived to be one of the worst plugin hybrids for electric only range.

I would love a pure EV but a genuine 200mile range isn't currently affordable (£30k-£50k bracket)/available in the UK.

[Kermit power]

Ruxpin said:

My C350e is just over 3yrs old and nearly 60k miles and long term average of 47mpg - not bad for a near 300hp car and 12mpg average more than my previous 335D.

Early in its life i calculated plugging it in saved c£1 each charge.

"Petrol" MPG totally dependent on journey profile - 36mpg on m-way with no charging, 42mpg general driving with no charging, 50-100-infinite mpg with charging

I have got on really well with the car but i find most people don't understand plugin hybrids and only see the headline (or lowline) figures of 35-40mpg if you drive without charging and only 9mile electric range - whats the point etc.

Most impressive stat i find is that over 60k miles the petrol engine has been off for nearly 30k - nearly 50% of my mileage coasting or on electric! and that is in what is perceived to be one of the worst plugin hybrids for electric only range.

I would love a pure EV but a genuine 200mile range isn't currently affordable (£30k-£50k bracket)/available in the UK.

I would totally agree with that. I don't get world-beating MPG out of mine on motorway runs, but hey, it's a nearly 300bhp estate which usually have a family of five in it under those circumstances, and often has bikes on the roof!

The vast majority of weeks, I'll use almost no petrol, as I don't commute in it, meaning a lot of runs are to the shops, kids' clubs and the like, and all done on battery.

The only time it's a bit st, and I question the value of charging it, is when the temperature drops to around freezing and you get about 3 miles from the battery, but at least if you leave it plugged in, you can programme the car to be all warm and toasty when you get in to it in the morning!

[jonobigblind]

jonah35 said:

At 15p per kWh it’s like £1.80 to charge
Trouble is that may only get me like 15 miles so 12 ppm

Fuel is what £6 a gallon? Let’s say if the car does 25 to the gallon then it would cost 24ppm

Lol as I’m typing this I realise it may halve my fuel bill but only for 15 miles of fuel a day so I suppose I may save a quid a day

I suppose it’s not to be sniffed at and I shouldn’t whinge but for the value of the car it just seems a bit comical to save £30-60per month.

But as another poster said having it charged may make it better to drive etc

Thanks all

Worth noting that when the weather turns cold you won’t get anywhere near 15 miles on electric. My previous car (Mini hybrid) ‘should’ have had 24 miles or so. When I had it in winter it wouldn’t show more than 12 on a full charge and regularly did 4-8 before giving up. Couple that with appalling motorway MPG and it really was only beneficial for the BiK.

Anything you can get on electric is a bonus and the charge / parking spots are usually a bonus being quite close to the stores