Hydrogen fuel breakthrough

[loose cannon]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-08/hydrogen-fue...

No expert but spotted the article and thought i would throw it in here, being the alternative fuels section

[EddieSteadyGo]

Not an expert, but I did read this story a couple of weeks ago - it related to the transport of the fuel to the filling stations, rather than how it could be used in a car.

Of course I know hydrogen is highly flammable, but I assumed the transport to the filling stations wasn't a big part of the problem that need to be solved to make hydrogen viable. Hence I couldn't quite understand why the reporters thought it was quite as a big a breakthrough as was being claimed.

[RizzoTheRat]

As I understand it, hydrogen cars are well advanced, it's a pretty easy fuel to use as you just burn it with air in ICE, or reacting it with oxygen in a fuel cell to make electricity. The distribution and storage are tricky though as it's low energy density and highly flammable, so making it easier to transport and store is a pretty significant improvement.

[EddieSteadyGo]

RizzoTheRat said:

As I understand it, hydrogen cars are well advanced, it's a pretty easy fuel to use as you just burn it with air in ICE, or reacting it with oxygen in a fuel cell to make electricity. The distribution and storage are tricky though as it's low energy density and highly flammable, so making it easier to transport and store is a pretty significant improvement.

Fair enough - I thought the main issue with hydrogen was storing it safely in cars, not getting it to the filling stations, but I'm happy to stand corrected.

[RizzoTheRat]

I assume that's also a major issue but at least it's stored in smaller quantities in the car. I guess the risk of a big squeaky pop in crash is higher than that of a petrol car going up in flames before you can get out.

[anonymous-user]

The major issue with hydrogen is actually producing it!

It can be produced via electrolysis from water using electricity, but this process is hugely in-efficient and difficult to productionise, ie difficult to use to make large quantities of Hydrogen, So today, 99.99% of commercial hydrogen comes from the chemical reformation of crude oil.........

[Zirconium]

Max_Torque said:

The major issue with hydrogen is actually producing it!

It can be produced via electrolysis from water using electricity, but this process is hugely in-efficient and difficult to productionise, ie difficult to use to make large quantities of Hydrogen, So today, 99.99% of commercial hydrogen comes from the chemical reformation of crude oil.........

I think it is mostly produced from methane. Not that that really invalidates your point.

[pherlopolus]

Interesting Tag line to a photo "Hydrogen fuel is predicted to reach price parity with petroleum within a decade."

So we can't expect it to be adopted within the next decade, by which point where will EV's sit? 500 mile range for 30 mins charging? at 1/4 the cost of petrol?

[anonymous-user]

Zirconium said:

Max_Torque said:

The major issue with hydrogen is actually producing it!

It can be produced via electrolysis from water using electricity, but this process is hugely in-efficient and difficult to productionise, ie difficult to use to make large quantities of Hydrogen, So today, 99.99% of commercial hydrogen comes from the chemical reformation of crude oil.........

I think it is mostly produced from methane. Not that that really invalidates your point.

it does indeed, but i was glossing over the complexities by writing "it comes from crude oil" to make things simple for people!

[FiF]

For those who don't have an understanding of the difference between road transport of various fuels, and why hydrogen is such a problem, here are some photos of the differences in bulk transport vehicles. Apologies to those who already knew this.

Petrol / Diesel


Gas which can be liquefied


Hydrogen, think of the container weights, there are technical reasons why the pressure vessels have to be this way.