Autonomous Nissan Leaf

[LeoZwalf]

Thanks to Fully Charged, we can see it in action.
https://youtu.be/cfRqNAhAe6c

We really are almost living in the future. The amount of processing power needed, the decisions it has to make, the fact that this tech even exists at all is just amazing. Once it is perfected, using this for the daily grind will be a total no-brainer. Why on earth would you want to drive yourself anymore?

[DapperDanMan]

I saw that today. It was VERY impressive.

[Caruso]

Saw this too and thought 2020...Where do I sign up?

I do enjoy driving but for a regular commute I could happily let the car do the work.

[lost in espace]

Here is some info on pro-pilot on the new Serina, should be the same?

http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/releases/ni...

[herewego]

It was interesting that it didn't know what to do when it reached the bus stopped with it's warning lights flashing.

Edited by herewego on Friday 31st March 16:05

[Dave Hedgehog]

hmm its quite a dilema

a) to be so devoid of passion and personality that i would actually want one of these

or

b) death


a difficult one for sure

[Shilvers]

Saw this and all very impressive. Perfect for the commute.

Question though: It prioritises pedestrian safety over everything else. What happens when pedestrians get wise to this? Even if a light is green or you have right of way, it will stop for a pedestrian so if you see an autonomous car, start walking or step towards the road and it'll allow you to cross. Not sure what the solution is as it just won't move anywhere when people know they can take advantage of the fact it will stop.

[Amateurish]

I don't know about you, but I also tend to stop when a pedestrian steps out in front of me.

[Chris1712]

The political and economic effects of autonomous vehicle are so massive and we're doing nothing about it. The business model will change entirely, car ownership will disappear and many people will be out of work! Really need to get cracking on legislation NOW to help with this.

[Shilvers]

Amateurish said:

I don't know about you, but I also tend to stop when a pedestrian steps out in front of me.

You're human. That's my point.

A pedestrian knows your human and humans sometimes run over other humans hence the added caution. If you knew the car was autonomous and would give you right of way in every situation though, would you be as cautious about stepping in front of it?

[98elise]

Shilvers said:

Amateurish said:

I don't know about you, but I also tend to stop when a pedestrian steps out in front of me.

You're human. That's my point.

A pedestrian knows your human and humans sometimes run over other humans hence the added caution. If you knew the car was autonomous and would give you right of way in every situation though, would you be as cautious about stepping in front of it?

I would be cautious. Nobody is going to guarantee that an autonomous car will never hit someone.

Regardless of who is in control, if you step out in front of a car when you don't have right of way then both will brake. The autonomous car won't try to run you over, but nor would most humans. The be viable autonomous cars just need to be better than humans, but they will never be 100% safe.

[chandrew]

Seeing what Nissan are able to do and then thinking that the current Google stats (published by California who require usage data of prototypes published) is hands-on-wheel every 5700 miles has made me completely rethink what is going to happen in a very short period of time.

Basically, if you buy a car now then for most people when you come to sell it in 3 years time the next buyer will have the choice between a car that can effectively drive itself or one that can't. I think this might have a significant impact on used car prices. As was mentioned, most of the time driving is a PITA. Driving will become a leisure activity.

At the same time in 3 years time there should be a good network of fast charging CCS stations on routes given the spending of the big car makers on infrastructure. As time goes on I'm becoming much more confident that there is going to be a switching point where technology changes pretty quickly. Think back how quickly phones switched from keyboards to touch-screen smartphones after the iPhone. I'm not saying it's going to be that quick but these changes aren't slow and gradual.

On a related theme it's worth reading this article published earlier this week on the second-order changes of electrification and autonomous driving.

http://ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2017/3/20/cars-and-second-order-consequences

[Shilvers]

98elise said:

I would be cautious. Nobody is going to guarantee that an autonomous car will never hit someone.

Regardless of who is in control, if you step out in front of a car when you don't have right of way then both will brake. The autonomous car won't try to run you over, but nor would most humans. The be viable autonomous cars just need to be better than humans, but they will never be 100% safe.

Oh, I'd definitely be cautious and even an autonomous car has to obey the rules of physics, but the absolute number one rule of these things being let on the road is thou shall not kill.

I can't see Nissan speaking to the law makers and saying it will never be 100% safe.

Interesting times ahead for sure.

[tankplanker]

Shilvers said:

Oh, I'd definitely be cautious and even an autonomous car has to obey the rules of physics, but the absolute number one rule of these things being let on the road is thou shall not kill.

I can't see Nissan speaking to the law makers and saying it will never be 100% safe.

Interesting times ahead for sure.

Autonomous cars do not need to be 100% safe, just safer than the average driver, which is a pretty low standard at times. Even a 20% improvement in overall driving standards when we switch to autonomous only would see a huge reduction in accidents and injuries/deaths.

[Terminator X]

Burn it.

TX.

[chandrew]

chandrew said:

Seeing what Nissan are able to do and then thinking that the current Google stats (published by California who require usage data of prototypes published) is hands-on-wheel every 5700 miles has made me completely rethink what is going to happen in a very short period of time.

DELETED: Comment made by a member who's account has been deleted.

I agree it's going to polarise cars, but my guess is that full autonomy will make car-ownership a preserve of the wealthy, especially for those who live in or near a city.

I think your stat might be misleading as it might be removing fleet buying, which probably contributes a lot to the car 'stock'. Here in Switzerland the market is dominated by nearly-new cars with almost 28,000 cars from 2016 listed on 'autoscout.ch' and then dropping down to about 4,500 from 2007 (there is a bulge at 4 and 5 years I guess as leases finish). Of course our market is unusual compared to the UK as I'd imagine a lot of our older cars get exported to countries a bit further east - being LHD makes this easier.

If insurance of non-automated cars increases, or at least the differential increases then I suspect that people will be less willing to buy an older car. I can see ICE non autonomous cars being priced off the road reasonably quickly.

[anonymous-user]

To be fair, if I had to travel in a leaf, I think I'd prefer it to be autonomous. But then I don't commute or live in/near a toilet city.

[Z3MCJez]

tankplanker said:

utonomous cars do not need to be 100% safe, just safer than the average driver, which is a pretty low standard at times. Even a 20% improvement in overall driving standards when we switch to autonomous only would see a huge reduction in accidents and injuries/deaths.

There is no way that the public would tolerate "only" a 20% improvement. Whilst that is thousands of lives, that would be computers killing thousands of people. People are much more tolerant of other people making mistakes than they are of computers making mistakes.

However, when autonomous cars are 100x better (and I don't think that's actually that stretching a target) then people will "take the risk". In the US, about 35,000 die on the roads each year. I think it's relatively easy to see that getting reduced to 350 if all cars are autonomous. As ever, the biggest risk is during the transition phase, but this is coming for sure.

Jez

[Z3MCJez]

chandrew said:

Seeing what Nissan are able to do and then thinking that the current Google stats (published by California who require usage data of prototypes published) is hands-on-wheel every 5700 miles has made me completely rethink what is going to happen in a very short period of time.

Right, and those "hands-on-wheel" stats are not necessarily dangerous. They're the car not being able to make the decision. Like behind the bus (although I doubt that Nissan are as far ahead as Waymo) which I suspect is something that Nissan could solve with a bit of time, but they wanted to demonstrate something.

There is a technology battle taking place here though. Waymo (and Nissan) have a car stacked full of technology. 4 LIDAR + 12 cameras on that Leaf (that they mentioned - I bet they're carrying RADAR too), which together with the processing power is going to add GBP3,000+ in hardware and probably more like GBP6,000 in retail price to the car. It's not going to be cheap. Conversely, MobilEye are pursuing a build it to a price approach with a smaller camera set being supplemented by crowd-sourced "pathways". Taking out the LIDAR is going to save a bundle in cost. If an expensive LIDAR system is first and safer though, will a camera-only system ever get approval?

It's going to be very interesting and level 4 autonomous really does look realistic by 2020. Unless Tesla goes and spoils it for everyone by starting to kill people through beta-testing on the general public.

Jez

[Z3MCJez]

A couple more points: It has 5 RADARs and it didn't work so well for the Guardian!!! Clearly not a socialist!

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/mar/02/k...

Jez