Decided not to buy
Discussion
Many years ago, like most young men I wanted a Ferrari and was lucky enough to own one.
I always felt that owning it came with the conflict of the pleasure of ownership, against the worry of breakdown. This worry overshadowed my pleasure. That small voice at the back of my head telling me that something is likely to break or it could fail to start without warning at any time leaving me stranded and with a big bill..
Since then I've owned Lotuses, vx220's, Porsche, TVR, Caterham, Westfield, Lancia, Cobra, and more. Some of these also gave me a small feeling of concern but: 1) to a far lesser degree, and 2) I felt confident that any arising problem could most likely be sorted by myself without a large bill. In owning there cars I always had all the fun, without the worry.
All my cars have indeed been trouble free and great fun. For some time I've been looking at purchasing a McLaren, and this has brought back all those memories of early Ferrari ownership - only 10 fold !! It feels like playing with your favourite toy while sitting under a damocles sword. I feel that the risk so far out ways the fun that it destroys the desire to buy one. This is a terrible shame because I really want one. I've even viewed a few. McLaren have obviously got something terribly wrong. In this day and age with such technology available, their cars should be perfect and 100% reliable. They appear to have made all the right technical and design decisions but failed somewhere during execution.
When visiting a main dealer I was told in no uncertain terms that it was imperative that I have a full dealer warranty with any purchase and would need to keep it current because i would need it !! ...... Doesn't fill you with a great deal of confidence.
I'm sure there are many of you that have had mainly trouble free ownership. However I think I will have to look elsewhere while you all sit under your swords. With a car of this type, branding, age, mileage and price. You should be able to open the adds page, take a pin, close your eyes and purchase blind without a worry...... WHAT A SHAME !!!
Perhaps in the passing of time my arm will be twisted or my head will be turned or that itch will need scratching etc etc. Who knows ?
I always felt that owning it came with the conflict of the pleasure of ownership, against the worry of breakdown. This worry overshadowed my pleasure. That small voice at the back of my head telling me that something is likely to break or it could fail to start without warning at any time leaving me stranded and with a big bill..
Since then I've owned Lotuses, vx220's, Porsche, TVR, Caterham, Westfield, Lancia, Cobra, and more. Some of these also gave me a small feeling of concern but: 1) to a far lesser degree, and 2) I felt confident that any arising problem could most likely be sorted by myself without a large bill. In owning there cars I always had all the fun, without the worry.
All my cars have indeed been trouble free and great fun. For some time I've been looking at purchasing a McLaren, and this has brought back all those memories of early Ferrari ownership - only 10 fold !! It feels like playing with your favourite toy while sitting under a damocles sword. I feel that the risk so far out ways the fun that it destroys the desire to buy one. This is a terrible shame because I really want one. I've even viewed a few. McLaren have obviously got something terribly wrong. In this day and age with such technology available, their cars should be perfect and 100% reliable. They appear to have made all the right technical and design decisions but failed somewhere during execution.
When visiting a main dealer I was told in no uncertain terms that it was imperative that I have a full dealer warranty with any purchase and would need to keep it current because i would need it !! ...... Doesn't fill you with a great deal of confidence.
I'm sure there are many of you that have had mainly trouble free ownership. However I think I will have to look elsewhere while you all sit under your swords. With a car of this type, branding, age, mileage and price. You should be able to open the adds page, take a pin, close your eyes and purchase blind without a worry...... WHAT A SHAME !!!
Perhaps in the passing of time my arm will be twisted or my head will be turned or that itch will need scratching etc etc. Who knows ?
Probably a wise decision anyway as a) you wouldn't be able to drive it at the moment and b) you'll be able to buy it for a lot less in a few months time!
Personally I think that you do need the warranty (as with most newish cars) but most issues are niggles rather than breakdown causing faults and as such shouldn't put you off owning one - the level of the warranty taking the risk and most of the worry out of the equation.
Personally I think that you do need the warranty (as with most newish cars) but most issues are niggles rather than breakdown causing faults and as such shouldn't put you off owning one - the level of the warranty taking the risk and most of the worry out of the equation.
Which Ferrari did you have? I owned my first at 24 and I knew the maintenance would be costly and they certainly didn't have the best reputation for reliability in those days. I was always playing Russian Roulette with a £10k bill but got away with it for many years. 20 years on however I have far less tolerance for unreliable cars that are painful to own so I think I've changed to be far more risk averse.
Edited by cgt2 on Tuesday 24th March 20:06
the av8er said:
When visiting a main dealer I was told in no uncertain terms that it was imperative that I have a full dealer warranty with any purchase and would need to keep it current because i would need it !! ......
....think about why they would tell you this. Firstly so you would buy a car from them and not privately or from an indy who can't transfer a warranty.........and secondly so that you come back at service time and renew the warranty.....decent money spinner for them.There are issues, sure..........I've had a McLaren in some guise for about four years.......I've had a few things done under warranty but nothing major that would have kept the car off the road. I sold the first car before the warranty ran out......current warranty runds out this summer, which I won't be renewing.
It's all about attitude to risk. My four years in McLaren will lead me to not renewing the warranty. Sometimes, it seems worse from the outside of a situation, looking inwards.
Back in 2007 I bought a Gallardo, at the time they were all burning through clutches........£6k to replace, not under warranty......Lambo went from about five revisions from memory till they found a proper solution.........enough to make you run a mile........still bought one..............and it was one of the best cars I've ever owned!!
Sometimes, the fear, paranoia and negativity of forums/social media can distort the reality and potentially deny yourself experiencing something that could really enrich your life!
I don’t really understand. You’ve decided not to buy anything from a particular brand because a salesman used a tactic to keep your money in the main dealer network??
No manufacturer makes cars that are ‘100% reliable’ so I’m afraid you’ll be disappointed regardless. I’ve had 11 Porsche’s, 2 have had big problems, and 4 have had little niggles - would you consider them a ‘reliable’ manufacturer? My McLaren has only had one niggle in the last 15 months. I realise others have had worse issues but as has been said I wouldn’t run one of these without a warranty anyway.
If you’re buying with a warranty, I wouldn’t be discounting McLaren, but that’s entirely your choice.
No manufacturer makes cars that are ‘100% reliable’ so I’m afraid you’ll be disappointed regardless. I’ve had 11 Porsche’s, 2 have had big problems, and 4 have had little niggles - would you consider them a ‘reliable’ manufacturer? My McLaren has only had one niggle in the last 15 months. I realise others have had worse issues but as has been said I wouldn’t run one of these without a warranty anyway.
If you’re buying with a warranty, I wouldn’t be discounting McLaren, but that’s entirely your choice.
Drl22 said:
I wouldn’t run any modern supercar from any brand out of warranty, they are far too complex and expensive to fix. It’s piece of mind.
....if you have a issue.Three years in my car without a warranty claim, thats circa £13-£15k of warranty costs that weren't needed.....
Piece of mind is fine, but it comes at a cost.......and the cost is never weighted in your favour.
At circa £3500 a year.......McLaren are betting that you will only have claims of this value or less. By buying it, you think you will have more........the people setting the pricing are rarely wrong.
It would appear that some of you have failed to read and understand my post having read some of your replies (especially Justin ).
I have listed cars that I have bought and used and that's not all of them !
One of my car's is an " M " spec BMW. It's a couple of years out of warranty and it's never entered my head that I might need a warranty. One of my bikes is honda CBR sp. This has all the same tech as the McLaren including active suspension, again..... Never entered my head to feel I need a warranty. (If you don't know this bike, check out its spec for yourself.) Neither of these have ever given me any problems and I would never expect them to.
I've also agreed that I'm sure there are owners who have had non or few problems with their McLarens
I don't understand why some people behave so defensively about criticism...... You didn't personally develop, design, build or sell the car and I'm not talking about your personal car. Everything I've said is accurate. Even if I were to buy a used Kia I wouldn't feel the need for warranty and would be surprised if it developed a fault
My Ferrari was a very clean and well sorted Mondial QV. It ran fine and reliable, but they are poorly made. You can't argue with that.
As one of you said, as you get older your tolerance and acceptable level of expectation alters. In my 20's I might have taken standing by the roadside waiting with a broken down sportcar as all part of ownership. But now in my 50's and latest technology I find it unacceptable. If you are prepared to put up with that, that's up to you but remember...... The manufacturer is having a laugh at your expense.
I have listed cars that I have bought and used and that's not all of them !
One of my car's is an " M " spec BMW. It's a couple of years out of warranty and it's never entered my head that I might need a warranty. One of my bikes is honda CBR sp. This has all the same tech as the McLaren including active suspension, again..... Never entered my head to feel I need a warranty. (If you don't know this bike, check out its spec for yourself.) Neither of these have ever given me any problems and I would never expect them to.
I've also agreed that I'm sure there are owners who have had non or few problems with their McLarens
I don't understand why some people behave so defensively about criticism...... You didn't personally develop, design, build or sell the car and I'm not talking about your personal car. Everything I've said is accurate. Even if I were to buy a used Kia I wouldn't feel the need for warranty and would be surprised if it developed a fault
My Ferrari was a very clean and well sorted Mondial QV. It ran fine and reliable, but they are poorly made. You can't argue with that.
As one of you said, as you get older your tolerance and acceptable level of expectation alters. In my 20's I might have taken standing by the roadside waiting with a broken down sportcar as all part of ownership. But now in my 50's and latest technology I find it unacceptable. If you are prepared to put up with that, that's up to you but remember...... The manufacturer is having a laugh at your expense.
the av8er said:
It would appear that some of you have failed to read and understand my post having read some of your replies (especially Justin ).
I have listed cars that I have bought and used and that's not all of them !
One of my car's is an " M " spec BMW. It's a couple of years out of warranty and it's never entered my head that I might need a warranty. One of my bikes is honda CBR sp. This has all the same tech as the McLaren including active suspension, again..... Never entered my head to feel I need a warranty. (If you don't know this bike, check out its spec for yourself.) Neither of these have ever given me any problems and I would never expect them to.
I've also agreed that I'm sure there are owners who have had non or few problems with their McLarens
I don't understand why some people behave so defensively about criticism...... You didn't personally develop, design, build or sell the car and I'm not talking about your personal car. Everything I've said is accurate. Even if I were to buy a used Kia I wouldn't feel the need for warranty and would be surprised if it developed a fault
My Ferrari was a very clean and well sorted Mondial QV. It ran fine and reliable, but they are poorly made. You can't argue with that.
As one of you said, as you get older your tolerance and acceptable level of expectation alters. In my 20's I might have taken standing by the roadside waiting with a broken down sportcar as all part of ownership. But now in my 50's and latest technology I find it unacceptable. If you are prepared to put up with that, that's up to you but remember...... The manufacturer is having a laugh at your expense.
How many McLarens have you seen broken down by the road side?I have listed cars that I have bought and used and that's not all of them !
One of my car's is an " M " spec BMW. It's a couple of years out of warranty and it's never entered my head that I might need a warranty. One of my bikes is honda CBR sp. This has all the same tech as the McLaren including active suspension, again..... Never entered my head to feel I need a warranty. (If you don't know this bike, check out its spec for yourself.) Neither of these have ever given me any problems and I would never expect them to.
I've also agreed that I'm sure there are owners who have had non or few problems with their McLarens
I don't understand why some people behave so defensively about criticism...... You didn't personally develop, design, build or sell the car and I'm not talking about your personal car. Everything I've said is accurate. Even if I were to buy a used Kia I wouldn't feel the need for warranty and would be surprised if it developed a fault
My Ferrari was a very clean and well sorted Mondial QV. It ran fine and reliable, but they are poorly made. You can't argue with that.
As one of you said, as you get older your tolerance and acceptable level of expectation alters. In my 20's I might have taken standing by the roadside waiting with a broken down sportcar as all part of ownership. But now in my 50's and latest technology I find it unacceptable. If you are prepared to put up with that, that's up to you but remember...... The manufacturer is having a laugh at your expense.
Mine hasn't and not seen of barely a single other one in years on interacting with other owners..........that not being defensive, thats being factual.........you seem to be translating your own perception, into a reality, which doesn't exist......
Serine clearly states that to him peace of mind comes from buying an all inclusive warranty.
To me, peace of mind comes from buying a quality example of a car from a recognised main dealer.
Now, do you understand the difference ??
I never said that should I buy a McLaren it would be unreliable. No, I said that the perception is that it will be unreliable. This is only reinforced by the comments of Serine and other owners with similar comments and main dealer representative also with similar chat.
As I said at the very beginning, a bit of a damocles sword.
To me, peace of mind comes from buying a quality example of a car from a recognised main dealer.
Now, do you understand the difference ??
I never said that should I buy a McLaren it would be unreliable. No, I said that the perception is that it will be unreliable. This is only reinforced by the comments of Serine and other owners with similar comments and main dealer representative also with similar chat.
As I said at the very beginning, a bit of a damocles sword.
the av8er said:
Serine clearly states that to him peace of mind comes from buying an all inclusive warranty.
To me, peace of mind comes from buying a quality example of a car from a recognised main dealer.
Now, do you understand the difference ??
I never said that should I buy a McLaren it would be unreliable. No, I said that the perception is that it will be unreliable. This is only reinforced by the comments of Serine and other owners with similar comments and main dealer representative also with similar chat.
As I said at the very beginning, a bit of a damocles sword.
Who is Serine?To me, peace of mind comes from buying a quality example of a car from a recognised main dealer.
Now, do you understand the difference ??
I never said that should I buy a McLaren it would be unreliable. No, I said that the perception is that it will be unreliable. This is only reinforced by the comments of Serine and other owners with similar comments and main dealer representative also with similar chat.
As I said at the very beginning, a bit of a damocles sword.
I stumbled onto this thread via the ‘What’s New’ tab and while I don’t have any super car ownership history, I don’t understand why anyone in this day and age would buy a super car without a warranty!
You say your BMW & a Kia wouldn’t make you think about a warranty, ok, but are they 150k + super cars?
I extended the warranty on my 2015 4 series and while it only cost £300, it did give me piece of mind and helped me sell it with 3 months remaining, if you can afford a McLaren, my £300 is like your £3000. Id say get it, whichever one it is, hopefully a 720s, I saw a purple one the other day and it really is a stunning piece of kit
You say your BMW & a Kia wouldn’t make you think about a warranty, ok, but are they 150k + super cars?
I extended the warranty on my 2015 4 series and while it only cost £300, it did give me piece of mind and helped me sell it with 3 months remaining, if you can afford a McLaren, my £300 is like your £3000. Id say get it, whichever one it is, hopefully a 720s, I saw a purple one the other day and it really is a stunning piece of kit
Why would you think that your £300 is like my £3000.??
Warranty on a 650 is £5000!!!
Please understand. This isn't about who's right and who's wrong. We are all different and I respect that we all see things differently.
If you think it's good business practice to sell a car for upwards of £150000 knowing that your customers are likely to encounter faults and problems then I respect that for you that's an added price worth paying.
In return I expect your respect that that doesn't work for me.
When I started I said that I had decided not to buy a car that I would otherwise love to own. I never invited, asked, or insisted that others should follow my lead nor was I trying to to influence anyone. I respect that your decision works for you. You should happily do the same.
Warranty on a 650 is £5000!!!
Please understand. This isn't about who's right and who's wrong. We are all different and I respect that we all see things differently.
If you think it's good business practice to sell a car for upwards of £150000 knowing that your customers are likely to encounter faults and problems then I respect that for you that's an added price worth paying.
In return I expect your respect that that doesn't work for me.
When I started I said that I had decided not to buy a car that I would otherwise love to own. I never invited, asked, or insisted that others should follow my lead nor was I trying to to influence anyone. I respect that your decision works for you. You should happily do the same.
I really don't understand this. Show me the data that shows a nearly new McLaren is less reliable than its peers? Plus, spending £80k upwards on a used example, just buy a warranty, concerns over. Warranties are cheaper on the sports series cars too (540/570).
You owned a TVR. That is a gamble. A McLaren isn't. The engines are bulletproof, the whole car feels solid and made with precision. I drove 15,000 miles in mine in 2 years and it never had any mechanical issues, I never thought 'will it start' or 'will it overheat' even in the worst of conditions.
Choose not to buy one, that is fine, but doing so because of alleged reliability is a big mistake.
Have you driven one yet? Decision may be different then...
You owned a TVR. That is a gamble. A McLaren isn't. The engines are bulletproof, the whole car feels solid and made with precision. I drove 15,000 miles in mine in 2 years and it never had any mechanical issues, I never thought 'will it start' or 'will it overheat' even in the worst of conditions.
Choose not to buy one, that is fine, but doing so because of alleged reliability is a big mistake.
Have you driven one yet? Decision may be different then...
Not in the market for one but I don’t have that perception. I wouldn’t buy it now because of the Coronavirus crisis, much uncertainty for the future.
Warranty wise it’s a no brainer unless you keep spare cash for mishaps. Seems to me you are not buying because the £5000 seem a bit much for you to take. I look at it as a running cost. It’s about probabilities. That warranty buys you peace of mind but has its cost.
Either keep money in the bank to fix it or buy the warranty. I live around Woking, not seen many/any McLaren by the side of the road. I would buy one without worrying about breaking downs. All modern cars have niggles, small production cars probably more.
Warranty wise it’s a no brainer unless you keep spare cash for mishaps. Seems to me you are not buying because the £5000 seem a bit much for you to take. I look at it as a running cost. It’s about probabilities. That warranty buys you peace of mind but has its cost.
Either keep money in the bank to fix it or buy the warranty. I live around Woking, not seen many/any McLaren by the side of the road. I would buy one without worrying about breaking downs. All modern cars have niggles, small production cars probably more.
the av8er said:
When I started I said that I had decided not to buy a car that I would otherwise love to own.
And that was Justin's point.For some bizarre reason, people who decide not to buy McLaren often feel the need to start threads saying they've decided not to buy one. I'm not convinced it happens with any other marque.
If you feel that you wouldn't enjoy the car, then you're right not to buy one. For what it's worth, I was aware of the common internet view of the cars before I bought mine - I even mentioned them on my running thread - although I was of the view that the warranty was comprehensive enough that I wouldn't worry too much. Despite some annoying niggles in the first few months, I have absolutely no regrets about buying mine.
Ignore... It's a wind up.
They started a nearly identical thread just over a year ago, explaining why they decided not to buy a McLaren, in the same 'oh I'd love to buy one but warranty reliability warranty ... ' school project tone.
You can tell it's a wind-up as soon as anybody mentions they've owned a TVR in the past and never had any trouble with it.... Liar liar pants on fire
What do we think, Porsche Marketting department
They started a nearly identical thread just over a year ago, explaining why they decided not to buy a McLaren, in the same 'oh I'd love to buy one but warranty reliability warranty ... ' school project tone.
You can tell it's a wind-up as soon as anybody mentions they've owned a TVR in the past and never had any trouble with it.... Liar liar pants on fire
What do we think, Porsche Marketting department
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