348TS and Mondial 3.4T - Are they worth the asking prices?
Discussion
I've been considering whether to buy either a Mondial 3.4T or a 348TS and am curious whether the cars on sale are actually worth the money?
Mondial's seem to be up at £40-50K, and early 2.9's are being asked for £30-35k....
348Ts seem to be from £42K for a LHD upto £60K+ for low mile RHD are these realistic? i notice a lot of cars been for sale for a lot of months...
My other question is: Are either cars any good? or should i be looking for something else?
Do any Mondial T and 348 owners have any buying advice?
Many Thanks in Advance.
Andy
Mondial's seem to be up at £40-50K, and early 2.9's are being asked for £30-35k....
348Ts seem to be from £42K for a LHD upto £60K+ for low mile RHD are these realistic? i notice a lot of cars been for sale for a lot of months...
My other question is: Are either cars any good? or should i be looking for something else?
Do any Mondial T and 348 owners have any buying advice?
Many Thanks in Advance.
Andy
andyman_2006 said:
My other question is: Are either cars any good? or should i be looking for something else?
Both 348 and Mondial have ridden a rising tide of Ferrari prices of late. I think both are superb cars. They have been priced less than other models because their looks haven't been in favour. Remember that the 308 GT4 spent decades in the doldrums like this, only to eventually come out shining. Both Mondial and 348 outperform previous cars in many ways, as every generation of Ferrari does almost without exception. They are also quite different in character. Go drive them. You only need spend an hour on a B road to know what the fuss is about. Your choice is then simply a matter of stylistic taste & purchasing brio. Go for it.
How things have changed, I once paid £13k for a LHD Mondial t and there were always plenty of 348's around at £18-£20k.
Great cars at that kind of money, not so sure if they are worth double that as there is plenty of other stuff around and don't forget maintenance is by no means cheap even on a well maintained car.
Great cars at that kind of money, not so sure if they are worth double that as there is plenty of other stuff around and don't forget maintenance is by no means cheap even on a well maintained car.
Behemoth said:
Both 348 and Mondial have ridden a rising tide of Ferrari prices of late. I think both are superb cars. They have been priced less than other models because their looks haven't been in favour. Remember that the 308 GT4 spent decades in the doldrums like this, only to eventually come out shining.
Both Mondial and 348 outperform previous cars in many ways, as every generation of Ferrari does almost without exception. They are also quite different in character. Go drive them. You only need spend an hour on a B road to know what the fuss is about. Your choice is then simply a matter of stylistic taste & purchasing brio. Go for it.
+1Both Mondial and 348 outperform previous cars in many ways, as every generation of Ferrari does almost without exception. They are also quite different in character. Go drive them. You only need spend an hour on a B road to know what the fuss is about. Your choice is then simply a matter of stylistic taste & purchasing brio. Go for it.
great cars for hustling through A and B roads.
both still good value and currently less than their new MRSP sticker price. Compare to something like a Sunbeam Alpine which are now around 6 x their original sticker price
Have you driven both ?
6.5 0-60 = pretty slow / 5.9 0-60 = reasonably quick !
Yet they have the same engine.....Ok the Mondial is about 100 kg heavier
Lots of 348 info here http://www.my348.com/
6.5 0-60 = pretty slow / 5.9 0-60 = reasonably quick !
Yet they have the same engine.....Ok the Mondial is about 100 kg heavier
Lots of 348 info here http://www.my348.com/
Thanks to the replies so far.
I suppose to many the Mondial is odd looking, and far less pretty most if not all other Ferrari cars, but they are getting rare now and very few cars are around, which is the main issue, its much the same with the 348's, and the values are on the up it seems.
On the mondial being slow, 3.4T is 300hp 0-60-6.3 and 158mph, 348 300hp 0-60 5.6 and 170mph. Wouldn't say either are slow.
Haven't driven either (yet) the only Ferrari's I've driven are the 360 and the F430 both manual cars.
I'm leaning towards the 348 (on looks and performance) but cant ignore the £10K price difference between this and the Mondial T's, and 3.2's.
I suppose to many the Mondial is odd looking, and far less pretty most if not all other Ferrari cars, but they are getting rare now and very few cars are around, which is the main issue, its much the same with the 348's, and the values are on the up it seems.
On the mondial being slow, 3.4T is 300hp 0-60-6.3 and 158mph, 348 300hp 0-60 5.6 and 170mph. Wouldn't say either are slow.
Haven't driven either (yet) the only Ferrari's I've driven are the 360 and the F430 both manual cars.
I'm leaning towards the 348 (on looks and performance) but cant ignore the £10K price difference between this and the Mondial T's, and 3.2's.
swindler said:
The Mondial is hideous looking, IMHO, and pretty slow. 348 appeals more as a fairly analogue car, much better looking and reasonably quick.
When you say pretty slow? were you referring to the earlier Mondial 2.9 240hp cars? or the 300hp 3.4T cars?Looks are marmite to many, i get that.
Andy
johnnyreggae said:
Have you driven both ?
6.5 0-60 = pretty slow / 5.9 0-60 = reasonably quick !
Yet they have the same engine.....Ok the Mondial is about 100 kg heavier
Lots of 348 info here http://www.my348.com/
+16.5 0-60 = pretty slow / 5.9 0-60 = reasonably quick !
Yet they have the same engine.....Ok the Mondial is about 100 kg heavier
Lots of 348 info here http://www.my348.com/
It's a 1989 design, and the T is far from slow cross-country unless it suffers from a bad pilot.
T has better balance than the 348, plus the electronic dampers later stolen by the 355
Both 348 and T have real world range and sound great with Tubi.. FWIW I arrived in Monaco way before my friends F50 due to his refuelling requirements
swindler said:
The Mondial is hideous looking, IMHO, and pretty slow. 348 appeals more as a fairly analogue car, much better looking and reasonably quick.
No, not at all hideous. There are some gorgeous details, like the chamfered engine cover. I think the car's stance deserves the darker more subtle colours. There are elements of it that reminds me of the 400, another car that's better in darker colours and also much derided but actually quite astonishingly beautiful in the flesh.Bo_apex said:
For those who get off on number crunching the Mondial T and 928 GT were class of the GT field in outright performance in 1989. NSX is 1990's so doesn't count
Dull, but true
Car and driver must have had a complete ham-fisted muppet driving the 348! - 0~60mph in 6 secs?Dull, but true
Autocar tested the 348 "back in the day" and didn't have any problems matching Ferrari's official 0~100Kph (0~62mph) time of 5.6 secs (0~60 mph is @ 5.4~5.5 secs)
A neighbour has a Mondial. Looks and sounds cool. But the car spends ~70% of its time in the garage being repaired. Feels like the Forth Bridge, with neverending repairs and niggles every other weekend. Leaks, misfires, etc. He is a mechanic enthusiast, so he loves the challenge. But go into it with eyes wide open and be prepared for problems.
Yipper said:
A neighbour has a Mondial. Looks and sounds cool. But the car spends ~70% of its time in the garage being repaired. Feels like the Forth Bridge, with neverending repairs and niggles every other weekend. Leaks, misfires, etc. He is a mechanic enthusiast, so he loves the challenge. But go into it with eyes wide open and be prepared for problems.
Sounds like he bought a nail. What version of Mondial ? The 8 was most fragile.I'm clearly biased but the 348 - especially in the TS (targa) form is a terrific car to own and an excellent 1st Ferrari.
If you like a bit of DIY it has the best support of any car I've ever owned and there are plenty of very knowledgeable owners who are more than willing to help and advise - it's actually one of the nicest things about owning the car.
Some parts costs are eye wateringly expensive but if you don't mind scouring eBay, user forums etc most things can be sourced and at a reasonable price.
If your tall or plan on doing long journeys with the roof off the optional canvas soft top is a must as the removable hard top is stored behind the seats which in my case means you have to have the drivers seat just a little but too far forward than I'd like. The canvas roof can be stored on the rear shelf so you can have the seat as far back as you like.
The standard exhaust is a bit lame sounding so most owners fit an aftermarket exhaust so budget around £1500 for an upgrade.
Things to look out for....
Mileage and/or price are no indication of condition at all. You really need to go and check the car out.
My personal opinion but cars from dealers are no better than privately sold cars especially if its from a non specialist dealer.
Again my personal opinion but I wouldnt buy a LH drive car
Other items...
Damaged or cracked front fog lights (very expensive),
rattly door innards when being closed,
slow or non working windows,
slow or non working pop up lights,
leaks from the rear "pumpkin",
leaks from the front of engine (camshaft seals),
non working AC unit,
non working windscreen wipers,
ABS warning light either illuminated or not coming on at startup,
sticky interior plastics
Badly aligned panels around the front indicating accident damage
Missing items from toolkit or toolkit missing altogether
Heat proofing foam on underside of engine deck dropping to bits`
Apart from minor mods such as exhaust or wheels modifications such as "355 conversions", wacky interiors etc make the car almost unsaleable
If you like a bit of DIY it has the best support of any car I've ever owned and there are plenty of very knowledgeable owners who are more than willing to help and advise - it's actually one of the nicest things about owning the car.
Some parts costs are eye wateringly expensive but if you don't mind scouring eBay, user forums etc most things can be sourced and at a reasonable price.
If your tall or plan on doing long journeys with the roof off the optional canvas soft top is a must as the removable hard top is stored behind the seats which in my case means you have to have the drivers seat just a little but too far forward than I'd like. The canvas roof can be stored on the rear shelf so you can have the seat as far back as you like.
The standard exhaust is a bit lame sounding so most owners fit an aftermarket exhaust so budget around £1500 for an upgrade.
Things to look out for....
Mileage and/or price are no indication of condition at all. You really need to go and check the car out.
My personal opinion but cars from dealers are no better than privately sold cars especially if its from a non specialist dealer.
Again my personal opinion but I wouldnt buy a LH drive car
Other items...
Damaged or cracked front fog lights (very expensive),
rattly door innards when being closed,
slow or non working windows,
slow or non working pop up lights,
leaks from the rear "pumpkin",
leaks from the front of engine (camshaft seals),
non working AC unit,
non working windscreen wipers,
ABS warning light either illuminated or not coming on at startup,
sticky interior plastics
Badly aligned panels around the front indicating accident damage
Missing items from toolkit or toolkit missing altogether
Heat proofing foam on underside of engine deck dropping to bits`
Apart from minor mods such as exhaust or wheels modifications such as "355 conversions", wacky interiors etc make the car almost unsaleable
348Jeff
Really helpful 348 info, thanks for going to the trouble of posting all the points to watch out for, your car looks really nice, and the wheels (355 ones i think) suit the car well. Is it a big job to fit them?
I know what you mean about buying on condition, not on mileage and owners, i enquired about a 38K mile one with low owners, and after getting more pictures emailed to me, close ups on rear arches, wheels and doors the condition was far from acceptable (to me anyway) for a £50K car. And i suppose this will be the issue finding a good one at a price that is acceptable, i'd rather not have one than spend near on £50K on a tatty one i wont be happy with.
I'm hopefully going to look at a 348TB LHD car thats only 66 miles from me, whilst i think i know my preference it will be a good barometer on whether i like the car, and whether i can rule LHD in or out, i'm sure it'll be the latter but i'm open to trying one and go from there. The same dealer has a '90 3.4T Mondial so i'm going to see how that feels/drives as a comparison, and then we can go from there.
Is there anything major during ownership you have had go wrong? and anything (as you put it eye watering) which surprised you and you struggled to find parts wise?
On the TS hood good tip, i'm 6' tall so will give that a try when i view a TS and see if it makes any real difference to the driving position.
Once again, and to all thanks for the info its much appreciated.
Andy
Really helpful 348 info, thanks for going to the trouble of posting all the points to watch out for, your car looks really nice, and the wheels (355 ones i think) suit the car well. Is it a big job to fit them?
I know what you mean about buying on condition, not on mileage and owners, i enquired about a 38K mile one with low owners, and after getting more pictures emailed to me, close ups on rear arches, wheels and doors the condition was far from acceptable (to me anyway) for a £50K car. And i suppose this will be the issue finding a good one at a price that is acceptable, i'd rather not have one than spend near on £50K on a tatty one i wont be happy with.
I'm hopefully going to look at a 348TB LHD car thats only 66 miles from me, whilst i think i know my preference it will be a good barometer on whether i like the car, and whether i can rule LHD in or out, i'm sure it'll be the latter but i'm open to trying one and go from there. The same dealer has a '90 3.4T Mondial so i'm going to see how that feels/drives as a comparison, and then we can go from there.
Is there anything major during ownership you have had go wrong? and anything (as you put it eye watering) which surprised you and you struggled to find parts wise?
On the TS hood good tip, i'm 6' tall so will give that a try when i view a TS and see if it makes any real difference to the driving position.
Once again, and to all thanks for the info its much appreciated.
Andy
348jeff said:
Heat proofing foam on underside of engine deck dropping to bits`
It's for sound, not heat. You usually want engine heat to escape.btw, F40 & Integrale owners amongst others will tell you that LHD is not a problem
I can't remember what the ergonomics are like in the 348, but I often find RHD setups in Italian cars compromised in some way. It still happens on luxury cars released today, like the Maserati Levante.Hi Andy
355 wheels are a direct fit, however, most people, myself included fit spacers otherwise they sit too far inside the arch (as do standard 355s).
Just back to the roof - as well as the problem of driving position the roof bangs against the seat and gets marked - something you may notice particularly on a black textured roof. There is a cover that goes over it but they are expensive to buy.
The only "major" thing I have had happen is the clutch slave cylinder went which is a known issue (sometimes indicated by hydraulic fluid on the bottom of the clutch bell housing). This cost me approx £700 in parts with me doing it myself which any competent DIYer can do. That's the only time in 5 years I've had to be recovered by the AA and I've driven all over the place including London and back with no issues.
As mentioned Fog light units are around £650 IIRC but now someone has started selling just the glass for about £150 (wish that was the case when mine was broken).
If you get the black sticky interior plastics refinished I think it's getting on for nearly £1k but I did mine myself for about £50.
My ABS ECU failed which are approx £1200 but I bought a 2nd hand one from a 355 for £250. Part of the fun of owning the car for me is after the initial fainting at the thought of the price once you knuckle down and doing a bit of research/asking on forums etc the reality is that the repair is usually going to cost a fraction of what you initially thought.
Check out my thread below which is basicly a blog of everything I have done to my car (you'll need to sign up to see the pictures).
http://www.clubscuderia.co.uk/forum/showthread.php...
If you check this website youll be able to see typical prices
http://www.eurospares.co.uk/parts/ferrari
Your more than welcome to come over to mine and I can show you round and you can ask as many questions as you like and get to know the cars without any salesman looking over your shoulder pressuring you. I went in blind really and learnt as I went along but TBH Ive enjoyed it LOL Drop me a PM if your interested.
355 wheels are a direct fit, however, most people, myself included fit spacers otherwise they sit too far inside the arch (as do standard 355s).
Just back to the roof - as well as the problem of driving position the roof bangs against the seat and gets marked - something you may notice particularly on a black textured roof. There is a cover that goes over it but they are expensive to buy.
The only "major" thing I have had happen is the clutch slave cylinder went which is a known issue (sometimes indicated by hydraulic fluid on the bottom of the clutch bell housing). This cost me approx £700 in parts with me doing it myself which any competent DIYer can do. That's the only time in 5 years I've had to be recovered by the AA and I've driven all over the place including London and back with no issues.
As mentioned Fog light units are around £650 IIRC but now someone has started selling just the glass for about £150 (wish that was the case when mine was broken).
If you get the black sticky interior plastics refinished I think it's getting on for nearly £1k but I did mine myself for about £50.
My ABS ECU failed which are approx £1200 but I bought a 2nd hand one from a 355 for £250. Part of the fun of owning the car for me is after the initial fainting at the thought of the price once you knuckle down and doing a bit of research/asking on forums etc the reality is that the repair is usually going to cost a fraction of what you initially thought.
Check out my thread below which is basicly a blog of everything I have done to my car (you'll need to sign up to see the pictures).
http://www.clubscuderia.co.uk/forum/showthread.php...
If you check this website youll be able to see typical prices
http://www.eurospares.co.uk/parts/ferrari
Your more than welcome to come over to mine and I can show you round and you can ask as many questions as you like and get to know the cars without any salesman looking over your shoulder pressuring you. I went in blind really and learnt as I went along but TBH Ive enjoyed it LOL Drop me a PM if your interested.
Hi Andyman, I had a 348 from 2009 till just recently (decided to depart for a V8V)
I initially bought the car to join friends on a European trip where the car covered 2900 miles faultlessly and the intention was to sell when I got back but as you know with cars you can fall in love!!
In that time when I sold I totalled up all the receipts and it came to £13000 in servicing and repairs over 11000 miles. Taking into account the car had belts done when I bought from Foskers, one of the biggest bills was the cambelt service for approx. £2500 iirc when I did it in 2013. I also had the pulleys changed and sourced them cheaper than the agent from Europarts. Another big bill was when the clutch master cylinder failed. I decided to change the clutch at the same time and that also came to approx. £2-2500.
Starter failed and that took a few weeks to source a genuine one £600, Door cable snapped so could open from inside, Aircon rarely works, engine bay struts lost ability to hold lid up, battery failed but apart from those items all the rest was routine servicing (which was done yearly) that you would do on any car.
Biggest bug bear though as mentioned above is the sticky plastics, air vents, steering column etc as get that on your clothes it just wont come out.
So to summarise it worked out approx. £1800 a year or £1.20 a mile to own and drive a Ferrari. Would I do it again..... Hell yes
Only ever got positive reactions from people also.
Steve
I initially bought the car to join friends on a European trip where the car covered 2900 miles faultlessly and the intention was to sell when I got back but as you know with cars you can fall in love!!
In that time when I sold I totalled up all the receipts and it came to £13000 in servicing and repairs over 11000 miles. Taking into account the car had belts done when I bought from Foskers, one of the biggest bills was the cambelt service for approx. £2500 iirc when I did it in 2013. I also had the pulleys changed and sourced them cheaper than the agent from Europarts. Another big bill was when the clutch master cylinder failed. I decided to change the clutch at the same time and that also came to approx. £2-2500.
Starter failed and that took a few weeks to source a genuine one £600, Door cable snapped so could open from inside, Aircon rarely works, engine bay struts lost ability to hold lid up, battery failed but apart from those items all the rest was routine servicing (which was done yearly) that you would do on any car.
Biggest bug bear though as mentioned above is the sticky plastics, air vents, steering column etc as get that on your clothes it just wont come out.
So to summarise it worked out approx. £1800 a year or £1.20 a mile to own and drive a Ferrari. Would I do it again..... Hell yes
Only ever got positive reactions from people also.Steve
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