F12 vs Aston Martin Vanquish S

[Simonmd]

I’ve got a 458 Italia and a Maserati Gran Cabrio at the moment.

I don’t really drive the 458. It’s a think of beauty but I have young kids and if I do get any time to go for a drive without them then it’s pretty rare that I get the chance to open it up properly given the amount of traffic on the roads nowadays. Therefore I need my cars to be a bit more
comfortable and have a decent stereo etc so that when I’m sitting in traffic it doesn’t become maddening.

I love the Maserati and it has totally changed my perspective on drop tops. When I bought the car I wasn’t sure but I’m totally converted. Having a drop top in the garage is definitely a must. The only issue with the Maserati is that it isn’t the most reliable and has regular small issues, the latest one being the hood getting stuck half way.

So I’m looking at changing up and I’m looking at the f12 and the Aston vanquish s.

First question is has anyone gone from 458 to f12 and is the f12 as exciting as the 458 or am I going to regret selling the 458?

Second question is on Aston vanquish s vs the f12. Has anyone owned both and how was the comparison?

Depending on answers I’m toying with f12 and then vanquish s volante but my love for the Maserati is strong so even though it seems like a child fixed some of the trims in place it will take a quite a lot to draw me from it so it may even up keeping that on which case it’s Aston vanquish s coupe vs f12.

Thanks and apologies for any typos!

[ANOpax]

Simonmd said:

First question is has anyone gone from 458 to f12 and is the f12 as exciting as the 458 or am I going to regret selling the 458?

Second question is on Aston vanquish s vs the f12. Has anyone owned both and how was the comparison?

I can’t help noticing that you don’t drive the 458 much because it’s a 2 seater. And yet you’re proposing to replace it with another 2 seater (the Aston may be marketed as 2+2 but nobody short of a double amputee has ever sat in the back of an Aston 2+2 for any length of time). So may I suggest you look no further than an FF or Lusso if you want Ferrari thrills which the whole family can engage in?

In answer to your questions;

1 The F12 is more exciting than the 458. You never feel that you’re going to die in the 458 if you overstep the mark. The F12 doesn’t give you that certainty. I call that exciting.

2 Sorry - can’t help you. I’ve experience of the V8V, Virage and DBS. There’s another thread on PH somewhere where the OP ended up with a Vanquish S and is deliriously happy. Although I think he was cross shopping it against a 599. FWIW, the FF is better than the 599 and the F12 is just as good as the FF. In fact, some would say it’s better but it just depends on what you want it for. However, the message here is that if 599=Vanquish S then FF&F12>Vanquish S.


Edited to add the link to the 599 vs Vanquish thread.

here it is

Edited by ANOpax on Saturday 13th August 13:05

[DeejRC]

Unfortunately for the Aston, the F12 is in a different league. I’m pretty much every dimension bar, maybe noise? The F12 can be a little muted until you open her up. Then she makes music that even John Williams would bow down to.

[robm3]

I had a Vanquish S for a weekend. And while I can't compare it to an F12, compared to my 812 it was a real let down.

I won't go into specifics but to summarise, it felt 'wooly'. Just everything had a bit of play in it.
Definitely more of a soft tourer than something that'll set your soul on fire. Whereas the Ferrari can play both roles, tourer and racer.

That said, the Vanquish got a lot more positive attention. Perhaps, dare I say, it's a 'cooler' car....

[vanquish spirit]

Well I did have two until a few weeks ago and I sold the Vanquish Volante and retained the F12. In reality, these are two different cars for two different uses. There is little doubt that the F12 is a barely disguised out and out hooligan race machine. I have driven a lot of cars in my years but nothing like this. You only need to look at Fiorano track times to see what it can do. As a previous poster said you never quite know whether you are going to come back from a drive in the F12 in one piece, let alone a rag. Ragging an F12? You would be a braver man than me. The car is totally awesome and whilst I have not owned an 812 I dont think its softened approach will excite me as much as the F12 which really does test your credentials.

The Aston Vanquish is a wonderful car, and having had 2 of the previous S models I was super pleased to be in such a reliable and easy to use car. It took me and the better half on a long tour to the South of France and ate miles like it should. Most importantly I got out of it feeling relaxed and able to enjoy my evening. I think I would have been much more tired in the F12 as its steering is so quick and the throttle response and low inertia flywheel make it extremely difficult to maintain smooth motorway driving. All in all pretty tiring to be on it all the time.

I bought the F12 to replace the Vanquish and then realised that the latter was so very different and such a great car I really could not do without it. The F12 , well I do feel I am in the presence of greatness every time I awaken it for a drive. Incomparable.

[DeejRC]

The F12 really is one of Ferrari’s greatest hits.

[jayemm89]

The Vanquish S is a fabulous car, but so is the F12. Both are different in every conceivable way.

I'd say the Vanquish is the more subtle, classic GT - the Ferrari more in your face but to drive both are superb (again in their own way).

You need to get proper seat time in both and see how they compare. Properly hussled, the F12 is a step on, but the Aston has its charms

[Simonmd]

It sounds like the Vanquish may be better for me. I don’t do track days and so I’m looking for something more comfortable and luxurious than the 458 that can still bring a smile to my face. It sounds like the Aston will fit that bill better than the F12 as it will be more enjoyable at lower speeds. It’s one of the reasons I love the Maserati and drive that a lot more than my 458 as the Maserati can just cruise around in comfort whilst still sounding great. With the f12 it sounds like I’ll nee to be alert all the time. I’m sure it’s absolutely brilliant and a hell of a buzz but with dash cams and the amount of traffic around nowadays it must be difficult to really enjoy it on the road without feeling like your going to either lose your license or stick it in a ditch. I’d be arriving everywhere with a nervous sweat on! Thanks for all the replies. Is there any other cars I should consider?

Edited by Simonmd on Monday 29th August 21:29

Edited by Simonmd on Monday 29th August 21:30

[21ATS]

I've just bought an FF. It is simply awesome and so useable. I sold a 2 seater convertible (Mercedes SL) and an estate car to buy one of these, mainly as there were so many occassions I couldn't use the 2 seater. I wanted a V12 Ferrari - actually the F12 was my number 1 choice, but it's a 2 seater so made little sense. The FF wasn't really number two - more 1.1 - I like them both (but can only afford one)

Think of the F12 as a schizophrenic axe murder. It really it unhinged when you open it up. Terrifying actually. Yet it is a masterpiece.

The FF is a 4 adult seat, 4wd version of the F12 but on personality disorder medication. The Stereo needs a double din upgrade though, even the later one.

I have never owned or driven something which such a wide range of talents. In auto it cruises at 40 in 6th, the suspension is the firm side of comfortable, in manual/sport it sounds like little else on the road - it is actually a little more tuneful than the F12.

My neighbour owns a 458 and he phoned me within 24hrs of me getting the FF, he hadn't seen it, but he heard it and knew exactly what it was.

The V12 Lusso was made a little more comfortable and a little less shouty, two critisms that were noted by early buyers of the FF. To this end, I have ordered some Dynomat and I'm going to soundproof the boot floor to see if tones down the in cabin noise for when I'm long distance cruising, there is a frequency drone at cruising speed on bad motorway surfaces and having had a look in the boot there appears to be almost zero sound deadening on there. Right above the two huge exhaust back boxes.

So the FF is closer to a four seat F12 that's been toned down a bit and manageable, the Lusso is more refined again and even better if you intend to genuinely travel cross content.

Either the FF or Lusso are a perfect fit for your remit.

The FF gathers speed at an astonishing rate, but it feels very controlled when doing so, almost suprisingly so. Yet you look at the speedo reading and the numbers are increasing rapidly. Probably something to do with the size of the car and the weight, it is just so composed on PS4S tryes.

Clarkson/Top Gear still has the best review of an F12 ever, he really nailed it, right up to and including the "too scary" bit.

I'm on the Kent/Surrey border, if you're close by you're welcome to come and have a ride in mine.

Edited by 21ATS on Monday 29th August 22:15

[ANOpax]

We have both the FF and F12.

The analogy we draw is that the FF is like the The Queen. All grace and manners, impeccably behaved, supremely capable, immensely powerful and quite enchanting. The F12 is like Princess Margaret: the more flamboyant, racier and dangerous younger sister.

If the OP is shopping around at Vanquish money then the FF fits his brief better. The F12 and Vanq are both 2 seaters. The F12 is too lairy and I predict that the Vanq will be too tame for his tastes.

[vanquish spirit]

The bad boy at rest in most peaceful surroundings, who would know!

Edited by vanquish spirit on Tuesday 30th August 09:13

[DeejRC]

All this thread is doing is making me think I should buy another F12 !!

[Simonmd]

ANOpax said:

We have both the FF and F12.

The analogy we draw is that the FF is like the The Queen. All grace and manners, impeccably behaved, supremely capable, immensely powerful and quite enchanting. The F12 is like Princess Margaret: the more flamboyant, racier and dangerous younger sister.

If the OP is shopping around at Vanquish money then the FF fits his brief better. The F12 and Vanq are both 2 seaters. The F12 is too lairy and I predict that the Vanq will be too tame for his tastes.

Looking at Vanquish S rather than standard Vanquish so budgeting around 150 if I go that route.

Will the F12 and FF both be a lot more comfy than my 458? The 458 is hard work if I’m sitting in traffic. I need the car to be a more comfy place to be.

I think I’ll just book in at a dealer that has both and be done with it and then I’ll probably forget about comfort and buy the F12 anyway.

[ANOpax]

Simonmd said:

ANOpax said:

We have both the FF and F12.

The analogy we draw is that the FF is like the The Queen. All grace and manners, impeccably behaved, supremely capable, immensely powerful and quite enchanting. The F12 is like Princess Margaret: the more flamboyant, racier and dangerous younger sister.

If the OP is shopping around at Vanquish money then the FF fits his brief better. The F12 and Vanq are both 2 seaters. The F12 is too lairy and I predict that the Vanq will be too tame for his tastes.

Looking at Vanquish S rather than standard Vanquish so budgeting around 150 if I go that route.

Will the F12 and FF both be a lot more comfy than my 458? The 458 is hard work if I’m sitting in traffic. I need the car to be a more comfy place to be.

I think I’ll just book in at a dealer that has both and be done with it and then I’ll probably forget about comfort and buy the F12 anyway.

The 458 has a hair trigger throttle and a comparatively rough engine compared to the V12s. It also doesn’t sound as good

The FF has a more refined cabin than the F12 (more sound deadening and double glazing). The Lusso is even more refined than the FF. If you’re driving the F12 or FF in auto mode in traffic, be sure to have the manettino in race (F12) or sport (FF) as the car won’t hold gear for long enough to give you a smooth ride.

Given that your budget extends to an F12, you should also consider the Lusso with the FF representing the half-way house between F12 and Lusso in terms of refinement and comfort.

[Drl22]

Simonmd said:

Looking at Vanquish S rather than standard Vanquish so budgeting around 150 if I go that route.

Will the F12 and FF both be a lot more comfy than my 458? The 458 is hard work if I’m sitting in traffic. I need the car to be a more comfy place to be.

I think I’ll just book in at a dealer that has both and be done with it and then I’ll probably forget about comfort and buy the F12 anyway.

Which element of the 458 do you find uncomfortable in traffic? I have both a Lusso and a 458 and recently completed a trip around Europe. I was at odds with which car to take and went for the 458, I am 6 foot 6 and am still marvelling at how comfortable I was driving for 5-6 hours a day for a week. The Lusso is a more spacious car, sublimely fast and has better stereo, apple car play etc but for me it’s too soft for a Ferrari and will be moved on soon. Yes you can fit children in the back, I told my wife the two doors would not be a problem, in real life and after 8 months of ownership it is. In addition to that it has many little Italian foibles that grate after a while when you daily the car like I have.

I am still at odds with your brief though, if you want a car to cruise in but still put the kids (because the 458 is a two seater) then there are much better alternatives and the two you mention (F12 and Aston) do not provide that. I love my 458 more than any car I’ve ever had and will always work my garage around it, it will never leave my ownership. My personal opinion is you will regret selling it. That said, if you aren’t picking up the keys then perhaps you are doing the right thing for you in finding a replacement, only you really know the answer.

[21ATS]

ANOpax said:

If you’re driving the F12 or FF in auto mode in traffic, be sure to have the manettino in race (F12) or sport (FF) as the car won’t hold gear for long enough to give you a smooth ride.

This is great information, I'm actually still learning my car at the moment at about 600 miles of driving in.

It does sometimes feel like it's hunting for gears in Comfort/Auto so I'll make a point of using sport/bumpy road mode when local/traffic driving.

When do you use Comfort/Auto then? Is that long distance motorway cruising mode?

[ANOpax]

21ATS said:

It does sometimes feel like it's hunting for gears in Comfort/Auto so I'll make a point of using sport/bumpy road mode when local/traffic driving.

When do you use Comfort/Auto then? Is that long distance motorway cruising mode?

Yes - the use of Sport/Auto makes the car hold the gear for longer so there isn’t the low rev lurch into the next gear which you get at low speeds in Comfort/Auto.

Comfort/Auto is for cruising as it closes the exhaust flaps which open up lower in the rev range in Sport/Auto. There’s a live discussion about this in FChat as some have claimed that the FF ‘drones’ at motorway speeds when I’m pretty sure that it’s simply a louder exhaust note caused by the valves being open in Sport when they remain closed in Comfort.

[21ATS]

ANOpax said:

Yes - the use of Sport/Auto makes the car hold the gear for longer so there isn’t the low rev lurch into the next gear which you get at low speeds in Comfort/Auto.

Comfort/Auto is for cruising as it closes the exhaust flaps which open up lower in the rev range in Sport/Auto. There’s a live discussion about this in FChat as some have claimed that the FF ‘drones’ at motorway speeds when I’m pretty sure that it’s simply a louder exhaust note caused by the valves being open in Sport when they remain closed in Comfort.

For me the "drone" is mostly tyre roar on some road surfaces, but there is a bit of exhaust going on there too. That said I have mostly been using comfort mode so far until I get used to the car.

I've ordered some dynamat and I'm going to line the boot floor and see if makes any difference.

I have a 300 mile round trip this weekend which is going to give me more chance to try different modes.

[Monkeybiz101]

ANOpax said:

Simonmd said:

ANOpax said:

We have both the FF and F12.

The analogy we draw is that the FF is like the The Queen. All grace and manners, impeccably behaved, supremely capable, immensely powerful and quite enchanting. The F12 is like Princess Margaret: the more flamboyant, racier and dangerous younger sister.

If the OP is shopping around at Vanquish money then the FF fits his brief better. The F12 and Vanq are both 2 seaters. The F12 is too lairy and I predict that the Vanq will be too tame for his tastes.

Looking at Vanquish S rather than standard Vanquish so budgeting around 150 if I go that route.

Will the F12 and FF both be a lot more comfy than my 458? The 458 is hard work if I’m sitting in traffic. I need the car to be a more comfy place to be.

I think I’ll just book in at a dealer that has both and be done with it and then I’ll probably forget about comfort and buy the F12 anyway.

The 458 has a hair trigger throttle and a comparatively rough engine compared to the V12s. It also doesn’t sound as good

The FF has a more refined cabin than the F12 (more sound deadening and double glazing). The Lusso is even more refined than the FF. If you’re driving the F12 or FF in auto mode in traffic, be sure to have the manettino in race (F12) or sport (FF) as the car won’t hold gear for long enough to give you a smooth ride.

Given that your budget extends to an F12, you should also consider the Lusso with the FF representing the half-way house between F12 and Lusso in terms of refinement and comfort.

I got an FF a couple of year’s ago having found I never drove my weekender 911 turbo given the rear seats were a no go for even my two small kids, and the boot a no go for a family trip. I have never looked back, the FF is our family car in effect, which is a joy to drive 4 up, and fantastic when pushing on solo, much more emotion/feel than the 911. I struggled to put 500 miles pa on the 911 and struggle to keep the FF below 3,000…. I also have an e90 M3 (the city car) and the FF is as practical in terms of carrying capacity, although you just need to park it more carefully given the width….