Ferrari 812 Superfast prices

[MrC986]

I’ve just seen (courtesy of reading some comments on YT) about a nearly new 812 SF being advertised by Tom H Jnr - I know I’m not a Ferrari owner/reader of market conditions but the market has certainly dipped when a 2020 car with 700 miles is being advertised at just under £250k having cost over £343k less than 10 months ago (with dealer mark up of course).

If I won the lottery I’d be kicking the tyres as the colour combo & spec (Triple layer Roses Fuoco & Terra Bruciata interior) looks fabulous.

[andrew]

there's a cheap one careful london owner tdf coming onto the market soon

[rat rod]

MrC986 said:

I’ve just seen (courtesy of reading some comments on YT) about a nearly new 812 SF being advertised by Tom H Jnr - I know I’m not a Ferrari owner/reader of market conditions but the market has certainly dipped when a 2020 car with 700 miles is being advertised at just under £250k having cost over £343k less than 10 months ago (with dealer mark up of course).

If I won the lottery I’d be kicking the tyres as the colour combo & spec (Triple layer Roses Fuoco & Terra Bruciata interior) looks fabulous.

Just watched a "Car Guys" video on Damon cancelling his 812 Super Fast order ,Shame as the colour and spec sounded quite special

several reasons but i think the main one was he

knows he's in for a good kicking if or when he wants to sell it, having all ready taken a £70k plus hit on his 488 after only covering

a small mileage,can't remember the exact mileage now, would have to watch the video again. Apparently he had to buy it to get the Pista.

Also he has his T.D.F still for sale and having paid a huge premium for it knows that it's going to be painful on his wallet.

Lucky he's in the real world and seems to shrug it off, plus it sounds like he's got some more toys coming.

Edited by rat rod on Saturday 31st October 01:43

[SVJBalboni]

Wasn't his 812 tailor made? I thought if it's a tailor made car you can't cancel unless he cancelled prior to production?

[rat rod]

SVJBalboni said:

Wasn't his 812 tailor made? I thought if it's a tailor made car you can't cancel unless he cancelled prior to production?

I think it was more paintwork that was tailor made although he did say there was some expensive options .

Didn't say what the name of the colour was but it was in homage to a 275 GTBC Scagletti Speciale that was in a Anthracite

grey with a single silver stripe, Only showed a photo of the 275 with wide Borrani competition wire wheels and exhaust exiting

out of the side , Don't think he was going that far just the colour.

It's all on their "Car Guys" You Tube channel titled " What ever happened to my 812 Super Fast", I would link it but being a dinosaur

I don't know how to,

[petjam]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXRpf5I1w8U

There you go. Good episode, I like those two, really down to earth.

[Cheib]

You have to be seriously wealthy to buy a car knowing it’s going to cost you over £100k for driving it off the forecourt like that Tom Hartley car. Clearly a lot of people won’t have been expecting that when they ordered their 812’s and even 488’s have been a disaster compared to 458 in terms of residuals.

Ferrari’s have gone from being relatively sensible to run (all things considered) to a very,very expensive hobby. Too many cars and too many ludicrously priced options that are a necessity. Not sure why you’d buy new given that the access to the limited edition cars doesn’t appear to be the road to riches it was.

[jimmyslr]

I’d noticed this re 812 prices having seen this car pop up a couple of days ago.... https://www.bramley.com/carsales/details/Ferrari/8...

That’s a lovely looking car, but the first owner has dropped £100k and done 400 miles. Ouch. A year or two back these were the latest and greatest and Ferrari might sell you one if you were sufficiently deserving. Being balanced, this is a return of some greater normality than we’ve seen in the last 5 or so years so I’m not a actually complaining. With relatively low mileage sub £140k F12s around one can see it’s a struggle to support 812 prices.

[priley]

Ouch indeed at £250 a mile. Definitely a shift from a few years ago. And yes, an F12 looks good value relative to the 812/TDF (and a little less try-hard aesthetically IMO).

[garystoybox]

priley said:

Ouch indeed at £250 a mile. Definitely a shift from a few years ago. And yes, an F12 looks good value relative to the 812/TDF (and a little less try-hard aesthetically IMO).

V12 Ferrari have almost deprecated heavily, nothing new here. Shaking my head at Y tube vids of people specIng c£100k on worthless options and then complainIng of losing £150k in depreciation when selling 12 months later. Why would you expect any differently? It’s was the same with Damon’s (car guys) 488. Blew almost £90k on options and then whinged at losing £70k after two years ownership; hardly unexpected? It’s the options that make the depreciation seem so bad.

You can still get a nice spec car from new with a £25-£30k max option spend as long as keep away from excessive carbon (in the wrong areas) and the ridiculous up-cost special paint finishes, from which you get zero back on resale.

[Taffy66]

The Ferraris i've bought have all been very highly specced by their first owners which makes them a bargain at say four years old. I recently bought a one owner 488 from a main dealer for just under £160K with only 6.5K miles. It cost well over £250K when new which is why i'll only buy used ones.
Next Ferrari for me will be a 812 next year but it'll be a high spec example at no more then £200k hopefully, otherwise i'll just wait until one comes along. I've worked too hard for my money to blow it £100K a time on crippling depreciation.

[Jonny TVR]

Taffy66 said:

The Ferraris i've bought have all been very highly specced by their first owners which makes them a bargain at say four years old. I recently bought a one owner 488 from a main dealer for just under £160K with only 6.5K miles. It cost well over £250K when new which is why i'll only buy used ones.
Next Ferrari for me will be a 812 next year but it'll be a high spec example at no more then £200k hopefully, otherwise i'll just wait until one comes along. I've worked too hard for my money to blow it £100K a time on crippling depreciation.

My thoughts exactly and we are also following the same buying pattern .. 488 at £155k with 7k miles bought a few weeks ago and have an eye on an 812 in a couple of years or less. Although you seem to also like Porsche quite a lot!

[Taffy66]

Jonny TVR said:

My thoughts exactly and we are also following the same buying pattern .. 488 at £155k with 7k miles bought a few weeks ago and have an eye on an 812 in a couple of years or less. Although you seem to also like Porsche quite a lot!

My 488 was also 2016 which at four years old seems to to be the optimum age to buy a used Ferrari. At that age the prices seem to start levelling off with the added bonus of free servicing until 2024.
Nice garage you've got with a lovely mix of classics and newer stuff. I also have a couple of Masseys, although newer ones which are used for farm work.
Ignore my garage as its completely out of date and i can't be arsed to update it.!

[footsoldier]

I’m on the right side of a V12 Lusso that went from 340 list to 180 (retail) in 2yrs and 5k miles...

[rat rod]

footsoldier said:

I’m on the right side of a V12 Lusso that went from 340 list to 180 (retail) in 2yrs and 5k miles...

OUCH! That's a big hit in anyone's book, hope for the previous owners sake it was a company car,at least the tax man would
help write off some of the loss.
TGE had to buy a new Lusso to secure his Pista and left it with the Ferrari garage to sell, After little interest he ended swapping
it for a 6,000 mile 458 spider which was sold after a few months, Sure i will be corrected if i got it wrong.

[Taffy66]

footsoldier said:

I’m on the right side of a V12 Lusso that went from 340 list to 180 (retail) in 2yrs and 5k miles...

That's an astonishing amount of money to lose in two years.Even worse for the first owner as £180K retail probably translates to £150K trade price if you bought it from a Ferrari main dealer.

[footsoldier]

Taffy66 said:

That's an astonishing amount of money to lose in two years.Even worse for the first owner as £180K retail probably translates to £150K trade price if you bought it from a Ferrari main dealer.

It was from a main dealer, but I guess the trade was better than that. It was a no risk deal for them - car was never advertised, and I was there for a trade they were trying to make work for first owner.

I called round a lot of main dealers, and more than one knew of similar cars available or coming soon and not advertised. Only revealed once they knew I was a serious buyer. All were priced similarly, so it was just a case of going for best spec.

I’ve almost doubled the mileage in 4 months!

Edited by footsoldier on Friday 6th November 21:55

[MDL111]

footsoldier said:

I’m on the right side of a V12 Lusso that went from 340 list to 180 (retail) in 2yrs and 5k miles...

That’s similar to my FF - went from c €330k list to 180k when I bought it 3 years and 11.6k km later. Speccing a car to your liking can get expensive quickly at Ferrari. Now it is probably worth 80-90k at 80k km and another 5 plus years older.
Mine was a SOR sale, so he would have paid away 5% I believe plus the extended warranty cost I assume.

[Camlet]

Something like 80% of new Ferraris are financed. At relatively high rates of interest. The system was always finely tuned. As loaded prices increased sharply over the past 4 years (a reasonably loaded 812 GTS today is not far short from the original price of a reasonably loaded tdf back in 2016), and volumes ramped-up, the system was being stretched. Strong residuals were essential to enable the finance system to work.

Covid has driven several trucks through the system. People who are bailing from their expensive 3 year deals are driving residuals down further and faster.

For buyers, don't jump for joy unless you're heavily in cash. Because loan books are becoming heavily overcooked.

Possible remedies are not hard to identify but unlikely in the short term. The complexity and cost is obvious. However given what's at stake for all luxury oem, remedies are necessary and urgent.

[MDL111]

Camlet said:

Something like 80% of new Ferraris are financed. At relatively high rates of interest. The system was always finely tuned. As loaded prices increased sharply over the past 4 years (a reasonably loaded 812 GTS today is not far short from the original price of a reasonably loaded tdf back in 2016), and volumes ramped-up, the system was being stretched. Strong residuals were essential to enable the finance system to work.

Covid has driven several trucks through the system. People who are bailing from their expensive 3 year deals are driving residuals down further and faster.

For buyers, don't jump for joy unless you're heavily in cash. Because loan books are becoming heavily overcooked.

Possible remedies are not hard to identify but unlikely in the short term. The complexity and cost is obvious. However given what's at stake for all luxury oem, remedies are necessary and urgent.

I always wonder if those 80% are really confident that they can make say 10% on the money not paid upfront (give our take 7% post tax return) or what other reason they have to finance a new Ferrari given that there is no guaranteed residual value as far as I know (or those Ferrari really give you that many “good customer” points for taking the finance - and even then, not everybody necessarily wants a limited edition car I assume)