Anyone searching for an F430? Patchy history common?

[mwstewart]

Is anyone else looking at the moment? I'm changing mine and finding that most cars I call about have gaps in the history.

My car has been serviced annually regardless of mileage and also at the mileage intervals, which is the prescribed way, but I've yet to call about a car with 'full history' (including main dealer history) that actually has a 'correct' full history.

Is this common or have I just come across a glut of this type of car?

[garym3m5]

Think maybe a struggle to find anything outside the main dealer network serviced annually, particularly the lower mileage vehicles. Many owners seem to only want to service 18-24 months if few miles added. Personally I avoided and always a little concerned if mileage was genuine..... Just traded my Rosso Crem f430 back to Graypaul Edinburgh and it has been serviced every year without fail and never missed a beat over 18 months of ownership. Somebody will end up with a great car.....

[johnnyreggae]

Out of interest why the change after all the work you've done to the car over the past 18 months ?

[willy wombat]

I would avoid anything without a "proper" full service history. If someone doesn't get the annual service done on time what else are they skimping on? If the excuse is "very low mileage" then who knows how long they've been left sitting with all sorts of lack of use problems starting to form? Ferraris are expensive enough to look after (properly) so at least try and ensure you start with a good one, not a "dud". I always get my Ferraris serviced by main dealer on the dot at 12 months whether they've done 300 or 3000 miles since last service. If I couldn't afford to do that I'd sell them. I also note that "Secret Supercar Owner" who writes in EVO always gets his cars serviced when due, even if they have done effectively zero miles since the last service.

[allister]

I don't understand why anybody wouldn't service a Ferrari annually..... After all, for every £1k you save yourself on servicing, you're going to probably lose at least double that in re-sale value for missing service history!

If these people can't afford the service they shouldn't buy the cars, regardless of mileage - The only other logical explanation I can think of, is that if the car doesn't see a dealer, there's no regular recordings of mileage, making it easier to turn back the clock in lager numbers!

Personally, I would only buy a Ferrari with full service history (meaning serviced every year without fail).

[red_duke]

I can only speak as a 5 year owner. My 2005, 29000 mile car has every annual and mileage stamp. Unfortunately it's not for sale though.

[andrew]

allister said:

I don't understand why anybody wouldn't service a Ferrari annually..... After all, for every £1k you save yourself on servicing, you're going to probably lose at least double that in re-sale value for missing service history!

If these people can't afford the service they shouldn't buy the cars, regardless of mileage - The only other logical explanation I can think of, is that if the car doesn't see a dealer, there's no regular recordings of mileage, making it easier to turn back the clock in lager numbers!

Personally, I would only buy a Ferrari with full service history (meaning serviced every year without fail).

+100%

[kev b]

I reckon many people buy a Ferrari or similar as a trophy or piece of jewellery.

When the initial thrill wears off they lose interest and the car sits unused, the last thing on their mind is the hassle of arranging a service for a car that has not moved for months, probably has stale fuel and a flat battery because the charger was unplugged.

This happens a lot with boys toys - quad bikes, speedboats, jet skis, motorbikes, convertibles etc. If you keep your eyes and ears open there are bargains to be had, as long as you are up to cleaning out gunge filled fuel systems, removing mould from hoods and repairing rodent damage.

[allister]

kev b said:

"as long as you are up to cleaning out gunge filled fuel systems, removing mould from hoods and repairing rodent damage".

That sounds like one nasty, neglected car Kev...... Actually, sounds a bit like my wife's Mercedes, we established last weekend that she hasn't had it washed since September!

It's still not been done....

[cgt2]

I've seen (and walked away from) many cars over the years because of patchy history. If an owner appears surprised when you question why the car hasn't been maintained annually you have to wonder what else they haven't taken care of. Far worse in Europe, where the majority of owners have a very laidback attitude to this.

Before travelling to see any car in Europe, someone should always ensure they have all the information about servicng (and verify it if necessary)- it will save an expensive journey.

[mwstewart]

Thanks all - much appreciated. There are some top money cars out there with a not so top history.

I will play the waiting game.

[TKH]

in an ideal world we would all want a service for each year and i agree its a relatively small cost for such cars

that said i have come across a few cars that have been bought as toys then SORN'ed for a few years and left garaged and un serviced during the SORN period

does that make them a car to avoid ?

or just a car that needs a full hit recommission & belts before being enjoyed again ?

[roygarth]

On t'continent they find it mildly amusing that in the UK we service our Ferraris etc every 12 months regardless of mileage. Generally they service on mileage not time unless a few years go by and then they have an oil change service as oil starts to degrade after a few years. I'm not sure I subscribe to the idea that a series of stamps in the book means a car has been well looked after. It means the services have been carried out (or at least the dealer is claiming they've carried it out) nothing more, especially If you don't have supporting invoices. I think the service book is part of the picture and needs to be combined with other information e.g. MOT record, SORN record, number of owners, pre-purchase inspection etc.

I do 1k to 3k miles a year in my 550M & 360CS. According to a friend, who was a Lotus engine development engineer, from a best practice point of view for those 2 cars doing that mileage, an oil change service every 2/3 years would suffice. But I get them serviced annually because the market expects it and I know that come re-sale it will be viewed positively. All a bit daft but what can you do?

[keith jecks]

Roygarth: Spot on. Certainly when I bought my car from Maranello, they took a much broader perspective on the car, exactly as you suggest. The odd missed service on a low mileage car isn't something that would stop them buying it in and providing a 2 year warranty (assuming everything else checks out).

[allister]

TKH said:

in an ideal world we would all want a service for each year and i agree its a relatively small cost for such cars

that said i have come across a few cars that have been bought as toys then SORN'ed for a few years and left garaged and un serviced during the SORN period

does that make them a car to avoid ?

or just a car that needs a full hit recommission & belts before being enjoyed again ?

Sorry yes..... Despite my comments above, yes I do think there are instances where you can make a call on these situations.

For example, let's say there's an old boy has owned the car for 7 years - For 5 years he's done a regular pattern of low miles and serviced annually, then it's SORN and showing little or a similar low number of miles over the last two years with no service..... In those kind of instances, yes I think it's definitely OK to go ahead and buy if everything adds up and seems very believable.

These can even be times when you can actually use this to negotiate further and get a greta deal - Although I would only do this if 100% convinced by the whole situation.

[mike01606]

Look into why the gaps are there and don't dismiss a good car based on the odd delay......My car has a couple of small gaps in the 15 year history and from what I've determined is the first one it was sat in Maranello's stock for 9 months and then serviced at point of sale.
I also believe the second gap coincided with a later owner change so was probably something similar.......

I have my annual done late in the year pretty much before I lay it up......I could imagine the next owner might wait until the spring making a 6 month delay look like a year. The longest it has gone between services is 6k miles, with the average <3k miles and the oil is a clean as a whistle.....

We get too hung up on this and regularly thraping the car from cold will do far more damage than a delayed service.

[andy355]

When I was looking years ago for a 430 I saw main dealer cars that didn't have half the services they should have.
In the end I ended up buying a perfect car from TH - the main dealer ones in some cases needed paint, had swilrls all over and as said before a "full service history" with multi year gaps
I was frankly surprised at the time, this was my first intended purchase from a ferrari dealer

[cgt2]

But for the cost of £1500 or so per annum, is it really worth jeapordising the car's value? Most main dealers will knock a car's value for not having full annual history, the only ones it doesn't matter to are clueless independents who have all jumped into the Ferrari game in the past 18 months

Also, if there were a requirement for 18 month or 2 year services as Porsches have then Ferrari would state that. They recommend annually and that is what it should be. One thing I have never skimped on any of my cars is regular servicing and that's probably why I've never had a breakdown in 20 years of Ferrari ownership.

[Eleander]

From my experience a 430 with a full service record is the exception as opposed to the norm.

The first one I bought was from a main dealer and had missed a service. The car was in perfect condition and I took the view that since the car had been serviced a couple of times since including the major 18,000 mile service being done when it was not required, was being serviced as part of the sale and the fact it was being sold by a main dealer with a 2 year warranty I decided to proceed with the purchase.

My second one was bought from a specialist and had missed a service but had been serviced annually three times since the missing one and was being serviced as a condition of sale. Again given the car was in good condition and the fact the recent services had been carried out meant I was comfortable proceeding. If it had missed the last/2nd last service then I would not have bought the car no matter how good a condition it looked to my untrained eye.

I did find it annoying calling round dealers who were advertising full Ferrari service histories to almost universally find they were either serviced on miles and not time or not serviced by Ferrari. The later doesn't particularly bother me as many specialists will give the car better attention than a main dealer but it did undermine trust in the seller when they are misleading in their adverts.

I would not discount car with a gap as long as the recent history was good and the car was in good condition. If you want one with a perfect service history then I suspect it will be a long wait.

[mwstewart]

Thanks for the input. The point raised above by a couple of people is a good one: in some cases a pragmatic view on a missed service is going to be the best call. For what it's worth I don't expect there to be an actual physical detriment to the car if an annual is missed and the car is stored in a good environment, but conversely I don't want to shoot myself in the foot at this stage when I could just find a different car.

Some of the cars I'm calling about have three year gaps.