458 v 488 market
Discussion
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202306148...
add 11k miles to this car, add more than half a year warranty. add a place to speak when you have a problem. add the convenience of re selling /pxing to them. and many more.
yes your interior carbons make up for it right. lol
add 11k miles to this car, add more than half a year warranty. add a place to speak when you have a problem. add the convenience of re selling /pxing to them. and many more.
yes your interior carbons make up for it right. lol
Someone help me out here.
I’m so confused.
You said my car is priced at a dealer price.
I asked you to show me, and you find a car £13k more expensive than my one, which is older, less warranty, less carbon BUT has less miles.
I actually think that’s a nice car, but my car is £13k cheaper.
So again, show me a Ferrari dealer car, similar to Mine and colour, at my price. You said it , not me.
Everything you said above you can do with any Ferrari. That’s the whole point of a dealer network. Are you saying if something goes wrong you’re going to take it back to Belfast?
Are you saying you can’t trade in a Ferrari for another one if it wasn’t bought from a dealer? You’re going to learn an expensive lesson if you think a dealer will cut you a deal on used approved stock. You might get a hamper though.
I’m so confused.
You said my car is priced at a dealer price.
I asked you to show me, and you find a car £13k more expensive than my one, which is older, less warranty, less carbon BUT has less miles.
I actually think that’s a nice car, but my car is £13k cheaper.
So again, show me a Ferrari dealer car, similar to Mine and colour, at my price. You said it , not me.
Everything you said above you can do with any Ferrari. That’s the whole point of a dealer network. Are you saying if something goes wrong you’re going to take it back to Belfast?
Are you saying you can’t trade in a Ferrari for another one if it wasn’t bought from a dealer? You’re going to learn an expensive lesson if you think a dealer will cut you a deal on used approved stock. You might get a hamper though.
Edited by craig511 on Sunday 9th July 22:49
Edited by craig511 on Sunday 9th July 22:50
This 488 could be a good buy for the OP of this thread at £140k
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202307099...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202307099...
m333m444 said:
mate you canr even compare two things. pointleaa to argue.
i told you, enjoy your car i am not interested.
that car has warranty btw. but who cares, you dont read, thats why we use the word delusional
I can compare. My car is 13k cheaper. There you go, compared.i told you, enjoy your car i am not interested.
that car has warranty btw. but who cares, you dont read, thats why we use the word delusional
I know it has warranty, it’s a Ferrari car from a dealer. I said less warranty.
But please, buy this car ( it’s a good car) then when it comes time to buy an 812, let us all know what a great deal you get from the dealer on the sell and buy side.
Fortunately I’ve owned a fair few nice cars so know exactly what reality is like when it comes to dealers. You clearly don’t.
This going around in circles and obscure logic is the reason why i stopped engaging with you on WhatsApp and said to buy the car you were going to “pull the trigger on” that weekend. What happened with that?
Dreamer
Did I take a wrong turning on this thread somewhere?
It seemed to go weird very quickly!
I have no idea how quickly the market will move downwards. If I did I could probably make some money in this car park instead of just wasting money! I wouldn’t be shocked tho to see main dealers punting 458s out £20k lower than currently come
January time.
As I said though, I’m a bit useless at making any money from cars!
It seemed to go weird very quickly!
I have no idea how quickly the market will move downwards. If I did I could probably make some money in this car park instead of just wasting money! I wouldn’t be shocked tho to see main dealers punting 458s out £20k lower than currently come
January time.
As I said though, I’m a bit useless at making any money from cars!
craig511 said:
I can compare. My car is 13k cheaper. There you go, compared.
I know it has warranty, it’s a Ferrari car from a dealer. I said less warranty.
But please, buy this car ( it’s a good car) then when it comes time to buy an 812, let us all know what a great deal you get from the dealer on the sell and buy side.
Fortunately I’ve owned a fair few nice cars so know exactly what reality is like when it comes to dealers. You clearly don’t.
This going around in circles and obscure logic is the reason why i stopped engaging with you on WhatsApp and said to buy the car you were going to “pull the trigger on” that weekend. What happened with that?
Dreamer
mate I decided not to buy your car, not you stopped. My only offer to you was £122k and that was it. I am glad I did not get it. I was going to buy another one but seemed that car had some non factory mods with lots of questions. Then I've thought that it is better to wait as nothing moves in the market at the moment. I know it has warranty, it’s a Ferrari car from a dealer. I said less warranty.
But please, buy this car ( it’s a good car) then when it comes time to buy an 812, let us all know what a great deal you get from the dealer on the sell and buy side.
Fortunately I’ve owned a fair few nice cars so know exactly what reality is like when it comes to dealers. You clearly don’t.
This going around in circles and obscure logic is the reason why i stopped engaging with you on WhatsApp and said to buy the car you were going to “pull the trigger on” that weekend. What happened with that?
Dreamer
Again, firstly you say no warranty, then you accept it. That's why no need to argue anything with you. You just believe something and keep going on with it. And actually you popped into the thread when other member mentioned/made fun with your pricing.
Dreamer hah? I actually told my friend I am not going to get your car just because of your cocky behaviour, regardless of the cost. you just prove it.
All I said was private sellers were asking dealer price. he went mad lol.
You said “Again, firstly you say no warranty”
Where did I say that? Show me exactly. Can you read? Quote me exactly word for word.
You have said multiple times that my car is priced at dealer levels. I’ve asked you to prove that. You haven’t.
You came back to me on WhatsApp on 4 different occasions, blethering on about carbon seats , some black car, some red car you were going to “pull the tigger on”. You even said “ I can even get guaranteed value after a year from them.“ No ferrari dealer will give you a future guaranteed value on a used 458. Talking s
te.
You tell me my car is priced at dealer prices, but then can’t find one to back that up. You find one car but £13k more.
You’re full of BS. Want me to post up the chat for all to see?
June 30th
You “mate I am about to pull the trigger on the other ones”
You “the red one”
You “give me your best price”
Me “ I don’t want to be rude, but I don’t care.
You either want to buy my car at my price or buy any other one. Best price is £131k”
You seem to have some notion that buying a used approved car will get you some favours buying a used approved car again in the future. At most you might get a free subscription to the Ferrari magazine.
Go and buy a 458 already. I mean, there’s so many good cheap ones right?
Where did I say that? Show me exactly. Can you read? Quote me exactly word for word.
You have said multiple times that my car is priced at dealer levels. I’ve asked you to prove that. You haven’t.
You came back to me on WhatsApp on 4 different occasions, blethering on about carbon seats , some black car, some red car you were going to “pull the tigger on”. You even said “ I can even get guaranteed value after a year from them.“ No ferrari dealer will give you a future guaranteed value on a used 458. Talking s
te. You tell me my car is priced at dealer prices, but then can’t find one to back that up. You find one car but £13k more.
You’re full of BS. Want me to post up the chat for all to see?
June 30th
You “mate I am about to pull the trigger on the other ones”
You “the red one”
You “give me your best price”
Me “ I don’t want to be rude, but I don’t care.
You either want to buy my car at my price or buy any other one. Best price is £131k”
You seem to have some notion that buying a used approved car will get you some favours buying a used approved car again in the future. At most you might get a free subscription to the Ferrari magazine.
Go and buy a 458 already. I mean, there’s so many good cheap ones right?
You said “Again, firstly you say no warranty”
Where did I say that? Show me exactly. Can you read? Quote me exactly word for word.
You have said multiple times that my car is priced at dealer levels. I’ve asked you to prove that. You haven’t.
You came back to me on WhatsApp on 4 different occasions, blethering on about carbon seats , some black car, some red car you were going to “pull the tigger on”. You even said “ I can even get guaranteed value after a year from them.“ No ferrari dealer will give you a future guaranteed value on a used 458. Talking ste.
You tell me my car is priced at dealer prices, but then can’t find one to back that up. You find one car but £13k more.
You’re full of BS. Want me to post up the chat for all to see?
June 30th
You “mate I am about to pull the trigger on the other ones”
You “the red one”
You “give me your best price”
Me “ I don’t want to be rude, but I don’t care.
You either want to buy my car at my price or buy any other one. Best price is £131k”
You seem to have some notion that buying a used approved car will get you some favours buying a used approved car again in the future. At most you might get a free subscription to the Ferrari magazine.
Go and buy a 458 already. I mean, there’s so many good cheap ones right?
Where did I say that? Show me exactly. Can you read? Quote me exactly word for word.
You have said multiple times that my car is priced at dealer levels. I’ve asked you to prove that. You haven’t.
You came back to me on WhatsApp on 4 different occasions, blethering on about carbon seats , some black car, some red car you were going to “pull the tigger on”. You even said “ I can even get guaranteed value after a year from them.“ No ferrari dealer will give you a future guaranteed value on a used 458. Talking s
te. You tell me my car is priced at dealer prices, but then can’t find one to back that up. You find one car but £13k more.
You’re full of BS. Want me to post up the chat for all to see?
June 30th
You “mate I am about to pull the trigger on the other ones”
You “the red one”
You “give me your best price”
Me “ I don’t want to be rude, but I don’t care.
You either want to buy my car at my price or buy any other one. Best price is £131k”
You seem to have some notion that buying a used approved car will get you some favours buying a used approved car again in the future. At most you might get a free subscription to the Ferrari magazine.
Go and buy a 458 already. I mean, there’s so many good cheap ones right?
Hi there
Thread has gone crazy but to try and put a fair and logical spin on this, first of all no matter what anyone says, the full carbon interior and carbon bucket seats are the specification the majority want and it adds at least £10,000 to the retail price whether its private or with a dealer, trade price however well we all know most dealers will always try to shaft you. No matter how comfortable comfort seats might be for some they simply don't have the desirability of the carbon buckets and for me the latter is comfier also, the carbon wheel is a must and the carbon driver zone and other bits are a nice touch, far nicer than the cheap looking plastic grey items.
Anyway that aside I also agree with the fact a private seller cannot command dealership prices, buying from the dealer gets you in with them as to speak and will potentially see you some rewards like trips out with said dealers and invites to events.
However no one be under the illusion that buying from a dealer will get you a better trade in, IT WON'T, they will still absolutely shaft you come trade in even if against another Ferrari, they will give you bottom price for your car or try too and then still try to make as much profit on what they are flogging you, that is the nature of the game and whether you buy from them or not has no impact on this. End of the day they are not a charity, they are not your buddy no matter how nice they might be to you.
Lets try to make it clear regarding trade values we can all put number plates and mileage into sites like WBAC, Cazoo, Motorway, CarWOW to get some idea of trade price and a Ferrari dealer will bid around this sometimes worse, sometimes better.
So lets say a 458 has following values, this is no particular 458 just an example, but lets say its an average spec 2010 car with 25k miles:
- Trade: 110k
- Dealer: 135k
You might get 5k of the dealer, so a potential 130k purchase as such a private seller probably wants to be pitching down the middle, that way its a fair dealer, seller makes 10k over a trade offer and buyer saves 10k over a dealer. All numbers are fictitious and examples, the reality will be different but its just a guideline example.
Any buyer should have in their mind the spec they want and then wait until a car comes along that is their spec, if this spec is common with a few in the market then you have a strong buying case and can be aggressive. If your spec is more unique and there are no cars on the market them I am afraid to say the seller can command whatever they want, they may not sell it but if its a rare spec and no others for sale expect to pay more.
As others have said great spec car in great condition do sell, some very fast.
Thread has gone crazy but to try and put a fair and logical spin on this, first of all no matter what anyone says, the full carbon interior and carbon bucket seats are the specification the majority want and it adds at least £10,000 to the retail price whether its private or with a dealer, trade price however well we all know most dealers will always try to shaft you. No matter how comfortable comfort seats might be for some they simply don't have the desirability of the carbon buckets and for me the latter is comfier also, the carbon wheel is a must and the carbon driver zone and other bits are a nice touch, far nicer than the cheap looking plastic grey items.
Anyway that aside I also agree with the fact a private seller cannot command dealership prices, buying from the dealer gets you in with them as to speak and will potentially see you some rewards like trips out with said dealers and invites to events.
However no one be under the illusion that buying from a dealer will get you a better trade in, IT WON'T, they will still absolutely shaft you come trade in even if against another Ferrari, they will give you bottom price for your car or try too and then still try to make as much profit on what they are flogging you, that is the nature of the game and whether you buy from them or not has no impact on this. End of the day they are not a charity, they are not your buddy no matter how nice they might be to you.
Lets try to make it clear regarding trade values we can all put number plates and mileage into sites like WBAC, Cazoo, Motorway, CarWOW to get some idea of trade price and a Ferrari dealer will bid around this sometimes worse, sometimes better.
So lets say a 458 has following values, this is no particular 458 just an example, but lets say its an average spec 2010 car with 25k miles:
- Trade: 110k
- Dealer: 135k
You might get 5k of the dealer, so a potential 130k purchase as such a private seller probably wants to be pitching down the middle, that way its a fair dealer, seller makes 10k over a trade offer and buyer saves 10k over a dealer. All numbers are fictitious and examples, the reality will be different but its just a guideline example.
Any buyer should have in their mind the spec they want and then wait until a car comes along that is their spec, if this spec is common with a few in the market then you have a strong buying case and can be aggressive. If your spec is more unique and there are no cars on the market them I am afraid to say the seller can command whatever they want, they may not sell it but if its a rare spec and no others for sale expect to pay more.
As others have said great spec car in great condition do sell, some very fast.
Always interesting seeing the market trends on CC
https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/2013-ferrari-4...
Think that got to low £130s.
https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/2013-ferrari-4...
Think that got to low £130s.
AndyC_123 said:
Always interesting seeing the market trends on CC
https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/2013-ferrari-4...
Think that got to low £130s.
The last 3 or 4 458s I watched on CC failed to meet reserve so went unsold. Buyers and sellers seem a long way off from their valuations.https://collectingcars.com/for-sale/2013-ferrari-4...
Think that got to low £130s.
Similar phenomenon is taking place in the Porsche world as so many "desriable" GT 911s and other classics are going unsold on CC
AndyC_123 said:
Gibbo205 said:
No matter how comfortable comfort seats might be for some they simply don't have the desirability of the carbon buckets
This.No one really wants comfort seats.
PinkHouse said:
The carbon buckets look much more striking, but I'd bet many people that ruled out the comfort seats before a back to back test drive might actually change their mind and consider them. Plus they're fully adjustable and most are heated which is another benefit for year-round usage or long tours. It's all down to preference either way and I quite liked the Daytona seats on the ones I drove - this is coming from an Exige with fixed carbon buckets.
Having owned an Exige I can say with confidence the Ferrari buckets are far more comfortable, though a percentage of that comes from the 458 been a much nicer place to sit in. I've done NC500 in my 458 and the seats gave me no issues on that trip which I covered around 2500 miles in as we spent around 10 days touring Scotland, so not just NC500 but most of the inland roads too.I've driven a 458 with comfort seats and for me they did not seem to fit as well, but the thing I noticed most of all is that I felt higher up in the car which was a huge no no for me, the buckets sit you lower in the car which is a must in any sports car let alone a super car.
I agree with all of that above.
I was offered £119k trade 4 weeks ago.
A similar specced car, same colour, miles history wtc is £142k at the dealer today, cheapest i can find. Let’s say £140k as there will be some wriggle room.
I’m priced right down the middle, £129k. If the market moves further downwards which It may well do then it is what it is.
I’ll just have to keep it longer for when the market rises again.
But man some people ( 1 person tbf) talk ste though !
I was offered £119k trade 4 weeks ago.
A similar specced car, same colour, miles history wtc is £142k at the dealer today, cheapest i can find. Let’s say £140k as there will be some wriggle room.
I’m priced right down the middle, £129k. If the market moves further downwards which It may well do then it is what it is.
I’ll just have to keep it longer for when the market rises again.
But man some people ( 1 person tbf) talk s
te though ! Edited by craig511 on Monday 10th July 10:03
Gibbo205 said:
PinkHouse said:
The carbon buckets look much more striking, but I'd bet many people that ruled out the comfort seats before a back to back test drive might actually change their mind and consider them. Plus they're fully adjustable and most are heated which is another benefit for year-round usage or long tours. It's all down to preference either way and I quite liked the Daytona seats on the ones I drove - this is coming from an Exige with fixed carbon buckets.
Having owned an Exige I can say with confidence the Ferrari buckets are far more comfortable, though a percentage of that comes from the 458 been a much nicer place to sit in. I've done NC500 in my 458 and the seats gave me no issues on that trip which I covered around 2500 miles in as we spent around 10 days touring Scotland, so not just NC500 but most of the inland roads too.I've driven a 458 with comfort seats and for me they did not seem to fit as well, but the thing I noticed most of all is that I felt higher up in the car which was a huge no no for me, the buckets sit you lower in the car which is a must in any sports car let alone a super car.
The reality is that the economic outlook for the next few years suggests some pain and there will be some great cars around that people will need to cash out of quickly so there will be some bargains for a motivated buyer with the funds.
There were in 1993, 2002 and 2008. History always repeats itself.
But if we look at 360's and 430's as an example they tend to find a level and settle there irrespective of variances. You could certainly buy a 360 in the low 40's at one point but the average has tended to be 50-55k. Some guy on here used to keep a spreadsheet.
Same with F430's at £75k-ish allowing for variances.
My guess is that 458's will settle around £115-£120k. But there are a lot more of them than the aforementioned models and there is less that an owner can do themselves as the cars get older so that may affect things.
I sold my 458 six years ago for around £130k so things haven't really moved much. Same with 360's and 430's. The real cost is in the thousands of maintenance required, £5k here or there doesn't matter much.
There were in 1993, 2002 and 2008. History always repeats itself.
But if we look at 360's and 430's as an example they tend to find a level and settle there irrespective of variances. You could certainly buy a 360 in the low 40's at one point but the average has tended to be 50-55k. Some guy on here used to keep a spreadsheet.
Same with F430's at £75k-ish allowing for variances.
My guess is that 458's will settle around £115-£120k. But there are a lot more of them than the aforementioned models and there is less that an owner can do themselves as the cars get older so that may affect things.
I sold my 458 six years ago for around £130k so things haven't really moved much. Same with 360's and 430's. The real cost is in the thousands of maintenance required, £5k here or there doesn't matter much.
cgt2 said:
The reality is that the economic outlook for the next few years suggests some pain and there will be some great cars around that people will need to cash out of quickly so there will be some bargains for a motivated buyer with the funds.
There were in 1993, 2002 and 2008. History always repeats itself.
But if we look at 360's and 430's as an example they tend to find a level and settle there irrespective of variances. You could certainly buy a 360 in the low 40's at one point but the average has tended to be 50-55k. Some guy on here used to keep a spreadsheet.
Same with F430's at £75k-ish allowing for variances.
My guess is that 458's will settle around £115-£120k. But there are a lot more of them than the aforementioned models and there is less that an owner can do themselves as the cars get older so that may affect things.
I sold my 458 six years ago for around £130k so things haven't really moved much. Same with 360's and 430's. The real cost is in the thousands of maintenance required, £5k here or there doesn't matter much.
Yep I paid a little over for my 360 manual but it had never missed a service in its life, was totally corrosion free and had been in the care of AV engineering for past four years with thousands spent in work bringing it back upto scratch, when it was inspected all it needs was a wiper and a hub nut. Compared to another which came back with £20,000 worth of potential work from the inspection so for me dropping 70k on a Modena manual coupe though at the top end price wise I am happy as the condition of the car is superb in every area.There were in 1993, 2002 and 2008. History always repeats itself.
But if we look at 360's and 430's as an example they tend to find a level and settle there irrespective of variances. You could certainly buy a 360 in the low 40's at one point but the average has tended to be 50-55k. Some guy on here used to keep a spreadsheet.
Same with F430's at £75k-ish allowing for variances.
My guess is that 458's will settle around £115-£120k. But there are a lot more of them than the aforementioned models and there is less that an owner can do themselves as the cars get older so that may affect things.
I sold my 458 six years ago for around £130k so things haven't really moved much. Same with 360's and 430's. The real cost is in the thousands of maintenance required, £5k here or there doesn't matter much.
360 F1's are becoming really cheap again however, easy to pick one up now around 40k. Manuals are still commanding more and the coupes seem to command more than Spiders but last night a manual Spider went for £56,000 with fees, just a few months ago that would be 60k plus.
Pretty much every make and model of cars are softening, so what is happening to Ferrari values is the same for all other brands, its a buyers market again but at the same time if as a seller you have a rare spec car in perfect condition and you don't need cash then don't give it away.
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