I think we've been blacklisted!
Discussion
We've had a weird experience over the past week.
My wife and I were thinking about trading in her Macan GTS for a new one in July, as we've had it 3 years. It's a phenomenal car and she really loves it, but we structured a finance deal to allow us to swap it out every three years, and the time was coming up. And given lead times, we thought we'd start talking to the dealer now.
So, she called the local OPC (where we bought the car) to be told that we could order one now for delivery in May/June. Cool, we thought, let's go in and spec one up and place the deposit. When we got there we were then told that we couldn't have one until 2021 at least as their order book was now full, and they had a 20 car wait list too, so if we could find one elsewhere we should just go there instead! So we left, somewhat confused.
We then called around a few other OPCs. Another relatively local one said they could get us one for July, so we gave them details of our current car as a trade in, and they offered us 17k below the current Porsche Approved prices for similar cars, and £5k below WBAC (which oddly, they told us themselves). I can stand a bit of margin, but this was insane and a bit insulting too. And when I questioned this they just suggested that maybe we should just keep our existing car! And that was the end of that conversation...
So we called a third OPC, who then told us that we could place a deposit, but they couldn't give us a build date yet - it's probably September but maybe not - but if we paid 3k deposit we could get a build slot in the future. And as for trade in, well, it was better, but still £12k below those on the Porsche Approved site today, and probably quite a bit less when we get the new car!
In short, nobody wants to sell us a car. When we get past the first conversation, which is usually positive, we either get an insane delivery date or an insane trade in. But it's more than that... the attitude of the sales people we've spoken to could simply be summarised as "we really don't want your business, thank you".
Maybe we've pissed some people off in the network. We did get a good deal on my 991 GT3, and they took a bath on my 997 turbo trade in. We've also complained a couple of times about shoddy service, but they have admitted it. And we are usually pretty polite, especially when compared to the local footballers' wives, plus I don't remember insulting anyone's mother.
In the past 4 years we've bought 4 Porsches, given them the finance business, serviced them, put warranties on them and had OPCs repair them when they have gone wrong. Maybe I am being a bit sensitive, but when you drop over £300k on cars in a few years it's a bit galling to be fobbed off in this way.
But hey, silver linings and all that... we'll keep our current Macan GTS and avoid the hassle, Porsche tax, new car VED rates, etc. And it's put me off trading up my 981BS for a 718 Spyder, which I was thinking about this year too, but now I just can't be bothered to go through this whole thing again. I probably wouldn't get one anyway!
My wife and I were thinking about trading in her Macan GTS for a new one in July, as we've had it 3 years. It's a phenomenal car and she really loves it, but we structured a finance deal to allow us to swap it out every three years, and the time was coming up. And given lead times, we thought we'd start talking to the dealer now.
So, she called the local OPC (where we bought the car) to be told that we could order one now for delivery in May/June. Cool, we thought, let's go in and spec one up and place the deposit. When we got there we were then told that we couldn't have one until 2021 at least as their order book was now full, and they had a 20 car wait list too, so if we could find one elsewhere we should just go there instead! So we left, somewhat confused.
We then called around a few other OPCs. Another relatively local one said they could get us one for July, so we gave them details of our current car as a trade in, and they offered us 17k below the current Porsche Approved prices for similar cars, and £5k below WBAC (which oddly, they told us themselves). I can stand a bit of margin, but this was insane and a bit insulting too. And when I questioned this they just suggested that maybe we should just keep our existing car! And that was the end of that conversation...
So we called a third OPC, who then told us that we could place a deposit, but they couldn't give us a build date yet - it's probably September but maybe not - but if we paid 3k deposit we could get a build slot in the future. And as for trade in, well, it was better, but still £12k below those on the Porsche Approved site today, and probably quite a bit less when we get the new car!
In short, nobody wants to sell us a car. When we get past the first conversation, which is usually positive, we either get an insane delivery date or an insane trade in. But it's more than that... the attitude of the sales people we've spoken to could simply be summarised as "we really don't want your business, thank you".
Maybe we've pissed some people off in the network. We did get a good deal on my 991 GT3, and they took a bath on my 997 turbo trade in. We've also complained a couple of times about shoddy service, but they have admitted it. And we are usually pretty polite, especially when compared to the local footballers' wives, plus I don't remember insulting anyone's mother.
In the past 4 years we've bought 4 Porsches, given them the finance business, serviced them, put warranties on them and had OPCs repair them when they have gone wrong. Maybe I am being a bit sensitive, but when you drop over £300k on cars in a few years it's a bit galling to be fobbed off in this way.
But hey, silver linings and all that... we'll keep our current Macan GTS and avoid the hassle, Porsche tax, new car VED rates, etc. And it's put me off trading up my 981BS for a 718 Spyder, which I was thinking about this year too, but now I just can't be bothered to go through this whole thing again. I probably wouldn't get one anyway!
I think the issue is that they can sell as many as these small SUVs as they can make especially in GTS spec.
In your shoes I'd buy whichever SUV you like (AMG GLC 63s Coupe defo worth a quick look too - I have an AMG GL63 for last 6 years 50k miles and she's been faultless) and give your Macan to a trusted Indy like 911V for sale or just sell out right to them. You'll get circa £5k ish below retail with no hassle or funny business like some other independents. Carlsberg SOR experience with 911v for all their customers
In your shoes I'd buy whichever SUV you like (AMG GLC 63s Coupe defo worth a quick look too - I have an AMG GL63 for last 6 years 50k miles and she's been faultless) and give your Macan to a trusted Indy like 911V for sale or just sell out right to them. You'll get circa £5k ish below retail with no hassle or funny business like some other independents. Carlsberg SOR experience with 911v for all their customers
OP if you want my contact at Porsche Swindon maybe they might be able to help - feel free to PM. They’ve been brilliant thus far looking after SWMBO. Hotels for servicing, events etc as live quite far away from them. Such a shame our local OPC so prickly historically but hopefully they’re getting better. Met a few new OPC guys at R21 concours and they seemed far nicer. The arrogance of some of the sales staff in the past not great but you should have seen the young Turk I met at Mcl London. Not the best trained.
It’s only when you deal with other brands that you realise actually even the worst Porsche dealerships ahead of the best dealerships of many other marques. I have a Mercedes and love it but no way I’d buy another it’s comical dealing with their servicing dept.
VW have always been brill. Better than Porsche even if you’re only buying a Polo or Golf. Brilliant cars too with zero issues.
It’s only when you deal with other brands that you realise actually even the worst Porsche dealerships ahead of the best dealerships of many other marques. I have a Mercedes and love it but no way I’d buy another it’s comical dealing with their servicing dept.
VW have always been brill. Better than Porsche even if you’re only buying a Polo or Golf. Brilliant cars too with zero issues.
gd said:
When we get past the first conversation, which is usually positive, we either get an insane delivery date or an insane trade in. But it's more than that... the attitude of the sales people we've spoken to could simply be summarised as "we really don't want your business, thank you".
It's a bit weird how their attitude changes mid-discussion, especially if it's happened multiple times.Not Porsche, but the only time I've had an experience that seemed completely bizarre at the time I found out later that the dealer was on notice.
If the global markets keep crashing the dealers will all be on the phone to you pretty quickly.
Same old same old....
I'm currently on Porsche number 4 and not bought any of them from an OPC - I tried too on numerous occasions but failed to comply with their sh***y attitude, ridiculous demands, lack of basic spec knowledge, failure to identify genuine customer interest, laziness and general poor customer service. That and the hoops they expect you to jump through to only then be refused the option to buy the car you want because they choose to sell them to people who then magically change their minds and let the dealers sell them at over list making more ££££.
The only reason I use the OPC for servicing is for the Porsche stamp and perceived value at resale time. Having said that I do have a great contact at my local OPC on the servicing team who is old school so still understands the importance of customer service.
I'm currently on Porsche number 4 and not bought any of them from an OPC - I tried too on numerous occasions but failed to comply with their sh***y attitude, ridiculous demands, lack of basic spec knowledge, failure to identify genuine customer interest, laziness and general poor customer service. That and the hoops they expect you to jump through to only then be refused the option to buy the car you want because they choose to sell them to people who then magically change their minds and let the dealers sell them at over list making more ££££.
The only reason I use the OPC for servicing is for the Porsche stamp and perceived value at resale time. Having said that I do have a great contact at my local OPC on the servicing team who is old school so still understands the importance of customer service.
I’d happily pay a little more and travel further to buy the same car from an enthusiast independent than go through the torture of dealing with my local Porsche centre again.
All the more reason to support good independents... For Porsche, RPM technik spring to mind, I’m sure there are other similar outfits around the country.
All the more reason to support good independents... For Porsche, RPM technik spring to mind, I’m sure there are other similar outfits around the country.
rootsandculture said:
I’d happily pay a little more and travel further to buy the same car from an enthusiast independent than go through the torture of dealing with my local Porsche centre again.
All the more reason to support good independents... For Porsche, RPM technik spring to mind, I’m sure there are other similar outfits around the country.
Just to chip in, i buy and service all my Porsches at Dick Lovett Cardiff who are absolutely brilliant to deal with..All the staff from the DP, Sales to servicing are easy to deal with and always helpful..The have a lot of clients from all over the UK which says a lot..Give them a call and it'll restore your faith in the Porsche brand.All the more reason to support good independents... For Porsche, RPM technik spring to mind, I’m sure there are other similar outfits around the country.
Taffy66 said:
Just to chip in, i buy and service all my Porsches at Dick Lovett Cardiff who are absolutely brilliant to deal with..All the staff from the DP, Sales to servicing are easy to deal with and always helpful..The have a lot of clients from all over the UK which says a lot..Give them a call and it'll restore your faith in the Porsche brand.
It would be a good test to see if the OP has been affected if Dick Lovetts are that amenable.Watch with interest.
PushedDover said:
It would be a good test to see if the OP has been affected if Dick Lovetts are that amenable.
Watch with interest.
I’d also give a recommendation for Mid Sussex OPC in Burgess Hill. I have dealt with them for over 20 years and they have always been first class - sales and service. Never had a cause for complaint.Watch with interest.
WG said:
I’d also give a recommendation for Mid Sussex OPC in Burgess Hill. I have dealt with them for over 20 years and they have always been first class - sales and service. Never had a cause for complaint.
I guess it depends what models you want to buy.OPC cannot shift base Macan's and 4 pot caymans, so your sales man must have been over the moon.
I hope that don’t sound too bad, but try asking for a GT4 or a Macan GTS and if they are as nice.
Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 28th February 15:19
Porsche911R said:
I guess it depends what models you want to buy.
OPC cannot shift base Macan's and 4 pot caymans, so your sales man must have been over the moon.
I hope that don’t sound too bad, but try asking for a GT4 or a Macan GTS and if they are as nice.
Well they have allocated me a 718 Spyder - couldn’t live with a GT 4 (or GT 3) with that wing on the back!OPC cannot shift base Macan's and 4 pot caymans, so your sales man must have been over the moon.
I hope that don’t sound too bad, but try asking for a GT4 or a Macan GTS and if they are as nice.
Edited by Porsche911R on Friday 28th February 15:19
OP. You don’t say specifically but it sounds like the OPC’s are difference dealer groups ? If that’s the case and you think this behaviour is consistent it must be something at Porsche GB level. Were you complaints previously made to Porsche GB or an OPC ? Not sure how you do it but in the days of GDPR I don’t think any company can keep any data about you without having to disclose it.
A quick Google found this
https://www.gov.uk/data-protection/find-out-what-d...
A quick Google found this
https://www.gov.uk/data-protection/find-out-what-d...
Thanks all, much appreciated.
I've tried OPC Swindon, and they could actually give me a build slot in June, but they also low-balled the trade-in and would not even commit to that value as the car would be for July delivery (so 16 weeks away!) They were very pleasant though.
And in response to the last question, yes it was across dealer networks. I did complain to Porsche GB once about fixed price servicing, i.e. it's a bit wrong when their website states one price and the bill from the OPC is quite another. I explained to them that the "smallprint" at the bottom of the page that states that some dealers don't participate was a bit fanciful. They objected, so I asked them which ones did and they couldn't give me one example, so I suggested they take it down as it was both misleading and breaking the law if none actually did! I guess I poked the bear just a bit too hard with that one...
TBH, I think we are just going to keep our current car. I've been really unimpressed by this experience, and when we next come to change one I might try something else. I was looking at a Spyder to replace my Boxster, but now I might just have to try a 458 in place of the GT3RS I was going to swap my GT3 for. Life is too short and there are too many choices out there to have to put up with the s**t that this marque thinks we should swallow.
I've tried OPC Swindon, and they could actually give me a build slot in June, but they also low-balled the trade-in and would not even commit to that value as the car would be for July delivery (so 16 weeks away!) They were very pleasant though.
And in response to the last question, yes it was across dealer networks. I did complain to Porsche GB once about fixed price servicing, i.e. it's a bit wrong when their website states one price and the bill from the OPC is quite another. I explained to them that the "smallprint" at the bottom of the page that states that some dealers don't participate was a bit fanciful. They objected, so I asked them which ones did and they couldn't give me one example, so I suggested they take it down as it was both misleading and breaking the law if none actually did! I guess I poked the bear just a bit too hard with that one...
TBH, I think we are just going to keep our current car. I've been really unimpressed by this experience, and when we next come to change one I might try something else. I was looking at a Spyder to replace my Boxster, but now I might just have to try a 458 in place of the GT3RS I was going to swap my GT3 for. Life is too short and there are too many choices out there to have to put up with the s**t that this marque thinks we should swallow.
gd said:
Thanks all, much appreciated.
I've tried OPC Swindon, and they could actually give me a build slot in June, but they also low-balled the trade-in and would not even commit to that value as the car would be for July delivery (so 16 weeks away!) They were very pleasant though.
And in response to the last question, yes it was across dealer networks. I did complain to Porsche GB once about fixed price servicing, i.e. it's a bit wrong when their website states one price and the bill from the OPC is quite another. I explained to them that the "smallprint" at the bottom of the page that states that some dealers don't participate was a bit fanciful. They objected, so I asked them which ones did and they couldn't give me one example, so I suggested they take it down as it was both misleading and breaking the law if none actually did! I guess I poked the bear just a bit too hard with that one...
TBH, I think we are just going to keep our current car. I've been really unimpressed by this experience, and when we next come to change one I might try something else. I was looking at a Spyder to replace my Boxster, but now I might just have to try a 458 in place of the GT3RS I was going to swap my GT3 for. Life is too short and there are too many choices out there to have to put up with the s**t that this marque thinks we should swallow.
I am inclined to agree. After 20 years of being lucky enough to have owned numerous Porsches I was treated badly when my wife's 997 engine developed bore scoring at 12 months old (7000 miles) - it was tapping, blowing smoke and using 2 litres of oil every 1000 miles, almost from new. Porsche insisted they would only cover a rebuild of the affected piston (and that was after they 1. tried to say it was normal 2. Told the dealer to change the oil separator etc). I was gobsmacked. The dealer, who I had always bought from and serviced with (Dick Lovett by chance), pushed for a complete new engine, which I eventually got. But it left such a bad taste I vowed never to buy another new Porsche. That was 10 years ago and I haven't. But I have had a few old ones I've tried OPC Swindon, and they could actually give me a build slot in June, but they also low-balled the trade-in and would not even commit to that value as the car would be for July delivery (so 16 weeks away!) They were very pleasant though.
And in response to the last question, yes it was across dealer networks. I did complain to Porsche GB once about fixed price servicing, i.e. it's a bit wrong when their website states one price and the bill from the OPC is quite another. I explained to them that the "smallprint" at the bottom of the page that states that some dealers don't participate was a bit fanciful. They objected, so I asked them which ones did and they couldn't give me one example, so I suggested they take it down as it was both misleading and breaking the law if none actually did! I guess I poked the bear just a bit too hard with that one...
TBH, I think we are just going to keep our current car. I've been really unimpressed by this experience, and when we next come to change one I might try something else. I was looking at a Spyder to replace my Boxster, but now I might just have to try a 458 in place of the GT3RS I was going to swap my GT3 for. Life is too short and there are too many choices out there to have to put up with the s**t that this marque thinks we should swallow.
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