PCCBs and Steels (Again...)

[F12DDE]

Hi Guys

Got a 718 GT4 with PCCBs from factory, but potentially looking at doing some more trackwork with the car (It's done 1 day at Bedford so far in 35 odd degree heat)

I've seen that people switch out steels for ceramics such as surface transforms, but my question is: Is there a steel replacement for PCCB discs? was thinking of using a set of steels for the track and keeping the life in the PCCBs for road? I feel as though it may be more "cost effective"

Is this something people do? Is it even worth doing? Should I keep the PCCBs on and just replace when needed ?

Let me know if its a good idea or if I should get off the sauce (I've never had a car with ceramics before so unsure on "real world wear" with track days etc

[TDT]

F12DDE said:

Hi Guys

Got a 718 GT4 with PCCBs from factory, but potentially looking at doing some more trackwork with the car (It's done 1 day at Bedford so far in 35 odd degree heat)

I've seen that people switch out steels for ceramics such as surface transforms, but my question is: Is there a steel replacement for PCCB discs? was thinking of using a set of steels for the track and keeping the life in the PCCBs for road? I feel as though it may be more "cost effective"

Is this something people do? Is it even worth doing? Should I keep the PCCBs on and just replace when needed ?

Let me know if its a good idea or if I should get off the sauce (I've never had a car with ceramics before so unsure on "real world wear" with track days etc

Hey Freddy… yes there are a few steel options for OEM PCCB equipped cars..

PFC and Girodisc both do rotor packages in PCCB sizes… (410F/390R]

A lot of people do just run PCCB with better pads… e.g. Pagid RSC1, MR(Pagid) or Endless,… other options might also exist.

It really comes down to how much you want to stomach for initial outlay or if you need to do replacement of PCCB rotors… do you want to foot that bill? …
How many days are you thinking you’ll do?… if it’s just a handful… then maybe stick with OEM PCCB rotors and update the pads for better performance and rotor life. If you’re doing more than 5 hard days, you might want to have a look at the alternatives.. just because of the potential cost.

My 718 GT4 car is on PCCB and I have been typically doing 10-15 days per year, so I will take the OEM rotors off and change to ST + RSC1 over the winter. I feel like this is the only option where you are ‘not just throwing money away’ and overall TCO is lowest… because they can be resurfaced and will have a decent resale value if/when you change cars… and the OEM rotors are preserved.

Edited by TDT on Thursday 8th September 18:34

[isaldiri]

F12DDE said:

Hi Guys

Got a 718 GT4 with PCCBs from factory, but potentially looking at doing some more trackwork with the car (It's done 1 day at Bedford so far in 35 odd degree heat)

I've seen that people switch out steels for ceramics such as surface transforms, but my question is: Is there a steel replacement for PCCB discs? was thinking of using a set of steels for the track and keeping the life in the PCCBs for road? I feel as though it may be more "cost effective"

Is this something people do? Is it even worth doing? Should I keep the PCCBs on and just replace when needed ?

Let me know if its a good idea or if I should get off the sauce (I've never had a car with ceramics before so unsure on "real world wear" with track days etc

I think the main question is how many trackdays you're planning to be doing and how long you are intending to keep the car. If it's just a couple a year (say <5) then I'd say an early change of pads when say half worn to RSC1s or something like that would likely be enough rather than going through the whole pita of changing to steel rotors.

[ChrisW.]

I would agree with this ...

The current PCCB's are pretty good and ST's only make sense if you are going to do a lot of trackdays and you are wearing pads quickly, hence the saving in the extra pad longevity of the ST's also makes financial sense.

This is because the ST's run so much cooler than PCCB's and in the way that the solid carbon disc dissipates the heat throughout the whole hub and wheel assembly, rather than just into the airflow and brake pad ...

[F12DDE]

Thanks for the reply's everyone

I'm by no means setting any lap records in my car, and probably only going to do 5 days per year at most, but I am looking at keeping the car long term, unless the economy gets to a place where I can no longer afford to do so, or if Porsche decide to let me have something more spicy! I'm hopefully going to do one this month (holding on for weather reports) and then next year I'm hoping to do both Spa and potentially Nürburgring.

Do you think its worth me just upgrading the pads then, in that case? Manthey ones with braded lines?

[Taffy66]

F12DDE said:

Thanks for the reply's everyone

I'm by no means setting any lap records in my car, and probably only going to do 5 days per year at most, but I am looking at keeping the car long term, unless the economy gets to a place where I can no longer afford to do so, or if Porsche decide to let me have something more spicy! I'm hopefully going to do one this month (holding on for weather reports) and then next year I'm hoping to do both Spa and potentially Nürburgring.

Do you think its worth me just upgrading the pads then, in that case? Manthey ones with braded lines?

The GT4 with PCCBs are the most over braked cars you can currently buy so no real need to upgrade pads if you only do a few track days. The PCCBs on the GT4 are identical to the 991.2GT2 RS which has nearly 300HP more power and more weight.
If you have the previous gen Porsche pads made by Pagid with high Copper content and not the new gen rubbish pads with low Copper as fitted to 992GT3s then you'll be fine.
If you're determined to fit better pads then you need to fit Pagid RSC 1s which are the least aggressive pads you can buy with Track/Road use. Don't know what composition the MR pads are but they're also made by Pagid and I suspect more aggressive then the RSC 1s
Pagid RSC1s are what Tim Harvey fits to his 991.2 RS WP Manthey which lives on track so they're more than sufficient.

[dashobbit]

F12DDE said:

Thanks for the reply's everyone

I'm by no means setting any lap records in my car, and probably only going to do 5 days per year at most, but I am looking at keeping the car long term, unless the economy gets to a place where I can no longer afford to do so, or if Porsche decide to let me have something more spicy! I'm hopefully going to do one this month (holding on for weather reports) and then next year I'm hoping to do both Spa and potentially Nürburgring.

Do you think its worth me just upgrading the pads then, in that case? Manthey ones with braded lines?

If you haven’t driven tracks extensively, there is both no need and no point in changing from factory

You won’t wear the PCCBs

The Manthey pads have better feel, but they’re about 1.5k a time

Just drive it

[LaSource]

isaldiri said:

I think the main question is how many trackdays you're planning to be doing and how long you are intending to keep the car. If it's just a couple a year (say <5) then I'd say an early change of pads when say half worn to RSC1s or something like that would likely be enough rather than going through the whole pita of changing to steel rotors.

This ^^

It is a funny one with brakes.
If you are a high volume tracker and a fast driver, you will use brakes more over the year.
If you are a beginner/modest driver, you will use brakes more because learners lean on brakes more.

But I guess how many track days and how long you intend to keep the car are paramount. Many people will do a few trackdays (say up to 5) and then sell the car on and let the next guy worry about the margin left. Not the politest thing, but that is why lots of new GT cars have PCCBs....

[F12DDE]

Looks like I shouldn't have anything to worry about then for the foreseeable future

Thank you for the comments guys, like I said, my first car with ceramics that I'm tracking so was unsure on how wear would be

[Snowy999]

I suppose someone should say that if you track you probably have a higher risk of picking something up and damaging a disc eg a spin in the gravel and a chip to a disc = at £5k plus VAT. Not going to happen with steels.

If you are keeping the car for fun, change to Girodisc/OEM steels and keep the PCCBs in your wardrobe in a nice box for resale.

You may not worry about the economic costs.....I would love to the try the Surface Transforms on my car one day ('only' £12k) The overbraking on the steels is already brilliant for sprints and hill climbing etc. once you get confident (it took me a while) they really do stop you.

I am not a regular tracker but would tell you that it's just a thing you have to do.....and you may find that 1/2 grows to 10 before you know it.

My old GT4 is just stellar fun at Silverstone or Spa even if the new ones and GT3s overtake me.....