964 Project - Right on or write off...?
Discussion
Folks,
Here's one for you...
Had a look at a project 964 C2 that was CAT C for "cosmetic" reasons (apparently). Got to a fair price based on the long list of issues - subject to an inspection...
The inspection revealed some potentially major issues - the wheelbase appears to be out by 10mm from side to side, the front turret appears to be out of place and the engine has some "issues". Clearly the car is now much further back in its project lifecycle - i.e. it would need jigging potentially and a rebuild before sorting out the other bits. The seller has indicated he would be willing to renegotiate of course - and as I mentioned, any inspection would highlight these things so the penny has dropped and he has realised that he has a major issue...
My question - if I was a betting man, how much should I assume for the jig work needed to get the car straight. I'm sure there are track cars that have had shunts and get straightened - and as the body etc is AOK (i.e. it doesn't need new panels) its just a guestimate of the work to get it "square" that would be useful. Ironically the seller has put KW V3's on it, retrimmed the interior etc - but failed to check that actual chassis was square... I'm assuming circa £10k for an engine rebuild btw.
My gut feel is to run to the hills - but then again, if the seller is in "fire sale" mode, there may be a deal to be had.. The project would be a bigger one - but this potentially would enable me to do some of the subtle mods I had planned (colour change, etc)
Thoughts on a postcard gratefully received!!
Palfers
Here's one for you...
Had a look at a project 964 C2 that was CAT C for "cosmetic" reasons (apparently). Got to a fair price based on the long list of issues - subject to an inspection...
The inspection revealed some potentially major issues - the wheelbase appears to be out by 10mm from side to side, the front turret appears to be out of place and the engine has some "issues". Clearly the car is now much further back in its project lifecycle - i.e. it would need jigging potentially and a rebuild before sorting out the other bits. The seller has indicated he would be willing to renegotiate of course - and as I mentioned, any inspection would highlight these things so the penny has dropped and he has realised that he has a major issue...
My question - if I was a betting man, how much should I assume for the jig work needed to get the car straight. I'm sure there are track cars that have had shunts and get straightened - and as the body etc is AOK (i.e. it doesn't need new panels) its just a guestimate of the work to get it "square" that would be useful. Ironically the seller has put KW V3's on it, retrimmed the interior etc - but failed to check that actual chassis was square... I'm assuming circa £10k for an engine rebuild btw.
My gut feel is to run to the hills - but then again, if the seller is in "fire sale" mode, there may be a deal to be had.. The project would be a bigger one - but this potentially would enable me to do some of the subtle mods I had planned (colour change, etc)
Thoughts on a postcard gratefully received!!
Palfers
Thanks folks. Keep the ideas coming!!!
Re selling it on, I genuinely want to build a project with my 8yr old and essentially "'keep it forever' rather than flipping it. I'd like a project to keep him interested and entertained and get his hands a bit oily / greasy / dusty (and mine too!) I'm thinking a sort of 'home grown Singer' type of thing - knowing that it wont be a carbon bodied beauty - but comfortable in the fact that if e.g. I want to flare the arches by 75mm I can do it in steel and properly...! A bit mad I know - but it's the logical next step from my 8yr old spending all his spare time configuring stuff on the McLaren / Fezza / Lambo websites...!!!
The family business has access to a fair amount of "heavy equipment" re blasting, powder coating, wet painting, metalshop, etc - so other than parts, the bulk of the investment would be my time and begging favours from the inlaws!!!.... I'd never write a business case for it (it would be negative…!) but might be fun if the donor car was priced appropriately...!
Cheers
Palfers
Re selling it on, I genuinely want to build a project with my 8yr old and essentially "'keep it forever' rather than flipping it. I'd like a project to keep him interested and entertained and get his hands a bit oily / greasy / dusty (and mine too!) I'm thinking a sort of 'home grown Singer' type of thing - knowing that it wont be a carbon bodied beauty - but comfortable in the fact that if e.g. I want to flare the arches by 75mm I can do it in steel and properly...! A bit mad I know - but it's the logical next step from my 8yr old spending all his spare time configuring stuff on the McLaren / Fezza / Lambo websites...!!!
The family business has access to a fair amount of "heavy equipment" re blasting, powder coating, wet painting, metalshop, etc - so other than parts, the bulk of the investment would be my time and begging favours from the inlaws!!!.... I'd never write a business case for it (it would be negative…!) but might be fun if the donor car was priced appropriately...!
Cheers
Palfers
ras62 said:
How did the inspection highlight the chassis was bent?
They measured a few key points... Wheelbase first - where a discrepancy which set off the alarm bells... then a few underbody measurement points as per the Porsche guidance (there's a 964 measurement sheet in the workshop manual) and found a number of discrepancies which led them to conclude that things weren't 100% square & true... :-(alfapork said:
IMO in 20 years time you'll regret "saving" a few quid starting with a cat-C shell.....
I think that's sage advice... The more I think of it, the more my head is overtaking my heart.... A sound, no histories chassis is surely the basis for a project as you say....That said, I did buy my Cobra sight unseen (although I did reserve the right to get a full refund within 2 weeks if anything cropped up..) Thankfully, it was fab (and still is!) and still puts a smile on my face regardless... I might even go and polish a wheel spinner in a minute!!!
palfers123 said:
I think that's sage advice... The more I think of it, the more my head is overtaking my heart.... A sound, no histories chassis is surely the basis for a project as you say....
It depends on what you do with it. The three Cat C cars that I know of that were turned into out and out track cars..stripped out, repainted, caged, KW clubsport suspension, big brakes, buckets, harnesses, etc (two of which are now raced), you would be lucky to pick up for less than £60K if they came up for sale.I decided to walk away - lots of seemingly major issues over and above the description in the advert... Feel free to PM me if anybody wants any insight if they are thinking of looking at the car... It's clearly right for somebody - just not me.... Caveat Emptor!
Despite the car not being right for me, I was really impressed with the service from Dave Griffiths Racing - who did the inspection. Genuinely helpful, tempered my "emotional attachment" and kept my feet firmly on the ground. Ben stayed late to do the inspection to meet my (unreasonable...) requests and has suffered perhaps 7 or 8 calls on the topic. Highly recommended and perhaps the best £300 I've spent in recent months.
Palfers
Despite the car not being right for me, I was really impressed with the service from Dave Griffiths Racing - who did the inspection. Genuinely helpful, tempered my "emotional attachment" and kept my feet firmly on the ground. Ben stayed late to do the inspection to meet my (unreasonable...) requests and has suffered perhaps 7 or 8 calls on the topic. Highly recommended and perhaps the best £300 I've spent in recent months.
Palfers
palfers123 said:
Paynewright said:
Is it the one that has appeared on ebay for £30k?
Yep...Even smashed up ones are going for silly money. I've been looking for a LHD shell for the last couple of years and nothing reasonable has come up. WRT to this car, if you're willing to do the work and intend to keep for a long time, I'd be tempted put in a cheeky bid and fix it - by cheeky I mean what you think it would break for.
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