911 996 to do 12k per year?
Discussion
Hi, having run a 2002 BMW E46 330ci sport for the past 12 years which is up to 203k. I'm contemplating scratching an itch I've had for years now.
I'm thinking of changing for a 996 and have a budget of around £15k.
I do 12-14k per year and have use of another car if needs be.
Am I being unrealistic with my expectations? What would running costs typically be for a 15 year old porker and would it stand up to the use?
Anyone looking to get out of one in the near future?
I'm thinking of changing for a 996 and have a budget of around £15k.
I do 12-14k per year and have use of another car if needs be.
Am I being unrealistic with my expectations? What would running costs typically be for a 15 year old porker and would it stand up to the use?
Anyone looking to get out of one in the near future?
Kettmark said:
Hi, having run a 2002 BMW E46 330ci sport for the past 12 years which is up to 203k. I'm contemplating scratching an itch I've had for years now.
I'm thinking of changing for a 996 and have a budget of around £15k.
I do 12-14k per year and have use of another car if needs be.
Am I being unrealistic with my expectations? What would running costs typically be for a 15 year old porker and would it stand up to the use?
Anyone looking to get out of one in the near future?
After running my Boxster for nearly double 12K miles/year since 2002 you can do 12K miles easy per year with the 996.I'm thinking of changing for a 996 and have a budget of around £15k.
I do 12-14k per year and have use of another car if needs be.
Am I being unrealistic with my expectations? What would running costs typically be for a 15 year old porker and would it stand up to the use?
Anyone looking to get out of one in the near future?
Budget for an oil/filter service every 5K miles and other fluid services on schedule. Be sure the brake fluid (and if a manual equipped car the clutch fluid) is flushed/bled every 2 years.
With a proper alignment I can get 20K miles from the rear tires, double that from the fronts.
I don't recall brake life but it is very good. (My 2003 Turbo got 120K miles from its front brakes. The rears look to be able to go another 60K miles.)
What you can't really schedule is what could possible require attention as the miles accumulate. I'm talking about for instance a fuel pump, water pump, radiator leaks or a failed radiator fan motor. Oh, and an AOS. Over the years and miles (now over 306K) my Boxster has gone through 3 of these.
You can put the miles on the car but you have to be vigilant and on the lookout for any signs of something going amiss. For instance any odor of antifreeze, that's a leak. Could be the cap. Could be the coolant tank. Could be the water pump. Could be a radiator. Possibly even an AOS. But you can't just ignore the odor and continue to drive the car. The car needs to be carefully inspected and the source of the odor identified and addressed.
Same with say a noise. It could be an idler roller bearing (my Boxster's are original but the Turbo has required these be replaced twice now in 150K miles). Could be a water pump, as proved to be the case with my Boxster.
My point is you have to listen to the, use your eyes and your nose, too, and be on the lookout for any signs of problems. It is always best to address sooner rather than later.
You have a 2nd car so there's no excuse to continue to push the 996 when it is giving you signs it needs some TLC.
Watch the trash build up in the radiator ducts. These cars are basically vacuum cleaners when the radiator fans are running and they suck in the leaves and trash.
Also, keep the body water drains free of trash build up. A blocked body water drain can have water in the cabin and this is never a good thing.
After rain or a good car wash check the bottoms of the doors for any signs of moisture. Door membranes get old and leak and let water collect in the door. This can leak into the cabin or just stay in the door and wreck havoc with the door/window electronics/electircs.
I'm doing just over 18k a year in my 996.
Shop around and you can pick up a full set of Michelin PS4 for around £600. I managed to squeeze 16k miles out of my last set of rears. Fronts have 25k on them and still at 4mm.
These cars are coming up to an age where most will be due a suspension refresh. Whilst not cheap, this is well worth doing. A day out at CG transformed the ride quality of mine.
Similarly the cooling system will no doubt be due an overhaul too. Budget on new rads and condensers, and the often overlooked coolant expansion tank. The cost of that tank for an early (mk 1) 996 is a whopping £450 and is quite a fiddly job to do. I speak from experience.
If you keep on top of these things, and are capable of doing the basic servicing along with discs and pads yourself (even independent garages seem to charge around £1k for what equates to £300 worth of parts and a couple of hours of your time), these cars aren't prohibitively expensive to run.
Every drive is enjoyable in the 996. I'm just disappointed I didn't buy one years ago. As a reliable fun car for racking up huge mileages in comfort with reasonable economy, there's nothing I can think of that would even come close.
Shop around and you can pick up a full set of Michelin PS4 for around £600. I managed to squeeze 16k miles out of my last set of rears. Fronts have 25k on them and still at 4mm.
These cars are coming up to an age where most will be due a suspension refresh. Whilst not cheap, this is well worth doing. A day out at CG transformed the ride quality of mine.
Similarly the cooling system will no doubt be due an overhaul too. Budget on new rads and condensers, and the often overlooked coolant expansion tank. The cost of that tank for an early (mk 1) 996 is a whopping £450 and is quite a fiddly job to do. I speak from experience.
If you keep on top of these things, and are capable of doing the basic servicing along with discs and pads yourself (even independent garages seem to charge around £1k for what equates to £300 worth of parts and a couple of hours of your time), these cars aren't prohibitively expensive to run.
Every drive is enjoyable in the 996. I'm just disappointed I didn't buy one years ago. As a reliable fun car for racking up huge mileages in comfort with reasonable economy, there's nothing I can think of that would even come close.
Edited by Rocketsocks on Thursday 15th December 20:14
Go for it! Great choice, as they seem to be more reliable when used more regularly.
Get the car inspected well before purchase (bore-score and IMS/RMS checks if possible), service it religiously, don't labour the engine and you'll have a blast.
Early 3.4s are slightly more reliable, but I personally prefer the extra torque of the 3.6; feels nice and over-engined.
Get the car inspected well before purchase (bore-score and IMS/RMS checks if possible), service it religiously, don't labour the engine and you'll have a blast.
Early 3.4s are slightly more reliable, but I personally prefer the extra torque of the 3.6; feels nice and over-engined.
I agree with the sentiments above.
I came from a 330d in to my 3.4 996 and average 15 – 18k per annum.
I had a new clutch and brake lines and a major service when I bought it, and at the same time upgraded the IMS bearing.
Over the last year (18k) I’ve had
Front suspension refresh (option)
2 x new rads – (needed)
New expansion tank cap (needed)
AC refresh (option)
New rear pads and discs (needed)
Interior rattles addressed (option)
Brake fluid and gearbox oil done (needed)
A major service
Low temperature thermostat (option)
Lining up to have the rear suspension refreshed early in the new year and another oil change.
All of the above done at a friendly, sensibly priced independent.
Running costs wise I’m getting about 21mpg on super unleaded, rear Michelin PS2’s are lasting about 10k at £450 fitted which seem to be about 3 sets for every set of fronts.
I don’t regret the decision at all. The fuel costs are about twice of that of the 330d, but I get my mileage paid so it’s not a huge issue. It does however make commuting enjoyable again (well almost!) and is very comfortable all year with the climate / heated seats etc when sitting in traffic, but will put a smile on your face when the mood takes you.
I’d say go for it, but as others have said keep an eye and ear on things and take a little more care than you would with something younger.
I came from a 330d in to my 3.4 996 and average 15 – 18k per annum.
I had a new clutch and brake lines and a major service when I bought it, and at the same time upgraded the IMS bearing.
Over the last year (18k) I’ve had
Front suspension refresh (option)
2 x new rads – (needed)
New expansion tank cap (needed)
AC refresh (option)
New rear pads and discs (needed)
Interior rattles addressed (option)
Brake fluid and gearbox oil done (needed)
A major service
Low temperature thermostat (option)
Lining up to have the rear suspension refreshed early in the new year and another oil change.
All of the above done at a friendly, sensibly priced independent.
Running costs wise I’m getting about 21mpg on super unleaded, rear Michelin PS2’s are lasting about 10k at £450 fitted which seem to be about 3 sets for every set of fronts.
I don’t regret the decision at all. The fuel costs are about twice of that of the 330d, but I get my mileage paid so it’s not a huge issue. It does however make commuting enjoyable again (well almost!) and is very comfortable all year with the climate / heated seats etc when sitting in traffic, but will put a smile on your face when the mood takes you.
I’d say go for it, but as others have said keep an eye and ear on things and take a little more care than you would with something younger.
The Curn said:
I agree with the sentiments above.
I came from a 330d in to my 3.4 996 and average 15 – 18k per annum.
I had a new clutch and brake lines and a major service when I bought it, and at the same time upgraded the IMS bearing.
Over the last year (18k) I’ve had
Front suspension refresh (option)
2 x new rads – (needed)
New expansion tank cap (needed)
AC refresh (option)
New rear pads and discs (needed)
Interior rattles addressed (option)
Brake fluid and gearbox oil done (needed)
A major service
Low temperature thermostat (option)
Lining up to have the rear suspension refreshed early in the new year and another oil change.
All of the above done at a friendly, sensibly priced independent.
Running costs wise I’m getting about 21mpg on super unleaded, rear Michelin PS2’s are lasting about 10k at £450 fitted which seem to be about 3 sets for every set of fronts.
I don’t regret the decision at all. The fuel costs are about twice of that of the 330d, but I get my mileage paid so it’s not a huge issue. It does however make commuting enjoyable again (well almost!) and is very comfortable all year with the climate / heated seats etc when sitting in traffic, but will put a smile on your face when the mood takes you.
I’d say go for it, but as others have said keep an eye and ear on things and take a little more care than you would with something younger.
What sort of price did you pay for all those items ? Rough price will do. Seriously considering one as the depreciation makes it an overall realistic ownership proposition as long as the running costs aren't too ruinous. I came from a 330d in to my 3.4 996 and average 15 – 18k per annum.
I had a new clutch and brake lines and a major service when I bought it, and at the same time upgraded the IMS bearing.
Over the last year (18k) I’ve had
Front suspension refresh (option)
2 x new rads – (needed)
New expansion tank cap (needed)
AC refresh (option)
New rear pads and discs (needed)
Interior rattles addressed (option)
Brake fluid and gearbox oil done (needed)
A major service
Low temperature thermostat (option)
Lining up to have the rear suspension refreshed early in the new year and another oil change.
All of the above done at a friendly, sensibly priced independent.
Running costs wise I’m getting about 21mpg on super unleaded, rear Michelin PS2’s are lasting about 10k at £450 fitted which seem to be about 3 sets for every set of fronts.
I don’t regret the decision at all. The fuel costs are about twice of that of the 330d, but I get my mileage paid so it’s not a huge issue. It does however make commuting enjoyable again (well almost!) and is very comfortable all year with the climate / heated seats etc when sitting in traffic, but will put a smile on your face when the mood takes you.
I’d say go for it, but as others have said keep an eye and ear on things and take a little more care than you would with something younger.
This is very rough costs as don't have invoices to hand but as a guide;
Essentials
Major Service - £299
Brake Fluid - Free with above
Gearbox Oil with Millers - £70
Rear Pads & Discs - £300
Both front rads - £350
Coolant Tank Cap - £20
Rear Michelin PS2's (N3 rated) - £450
Total c£1490 over 1 year / £18k
Nice to haves;
Low Temp Thermostat / Coolant Flush / Renewal - £115
A/C refresh with new pipe (hole in old one) £300
Front Suspension (Lower Arms, Tie Rods, Geometry) £400
Interior rattles (remove door card and centre transmission console & investigate) - £125. Best £125 I've ever spent!!! So, so , so much nicer now!
£940 ish
Essentials
Major Service - £299
Brake Fluid - Free with above
Gearbox Oil with Millers - £70
Rear Pads & Discs - £300
Both front rads - £350
Coolant Tank Cap - £20
Rear Michelin PS2's (N3 rated) - £450
Total c£1490 over 1 year / £18k
Nice to haves;
Low Temp Thermostat / Coolant Flush / Renewal - £115
A/C refresh with new pipe (hole in old one) £300
Front Suspension (Lower Arms, Tie Rods, Geometry) £400
Interior rattles (remove door card and centre transmission console & investigate) - £125. Best £125 I've ever spent!!! So, so , so much nicer now!
£940 ish
Still deliberating but have recently spent a fair amount getting wheels returned, new tyres all round & water pump + viscous fan replaced.
BMW about to turn over 204k. Love it to bits.
Worth about £1500 on a good day so no depreciation.
I need to get out& try some 996's to make my mind up..
BMW about to turn over 204k. Love it to bits.
Worth about £1500 on a good day so no depreciation.
I need to get out& try some 996's to make my mind up..
I bought my 996 C4 just coming up six years ago with 66k on the clock. It's now at 190k and although this last year has been expensive, it's still cracking value. I've had the engine rebuilt, the only thing I think I didn't do was address the oval-isation of the bores but the nikasil lining was immaculate but that does mean a cloud of smoke on start up which soon disappears. Shows 316.5 bhp on the dyno following the EVOMSit mapping so can't argue with that. New stainless exhaust looks and sounds the business and given it is parked in the street, you really wouldn't know the mileage. I'd buy another in a heartbeat, you won't regret it.
Kettmark said:
Are you planning keeping it?
Is it a manual or auto? The BMW is a steptronic so I've got use to a self shifter. My thoughts are a manual suits a 911 more than an auto box but not sure I could go back to changing gears. I do affair amount of town driving too currently
Yes, for now, although the mileage is going through the roof, I know all the history, I know what work I have had done and what needs still to be done. Give it a good clean and it looks great although of course, the closer you get to the easier you can see the imperfections. Is it a manual or auto? The BMW is a steptronic so I've got use to a self shifter. My thoughts are a manual suits a 911 more than an auto box but not sure I could go back to changing gears. I do affair amount of town driving too currently
It's a manual, when I had the engine work done I put in a new clutch and flywheel but it is still heavy on the left leg but nothing so bad. I did test drive one with the old Techtronic or whatever it's called, hated it!
anonymous said:
[redacted]
This. 100% They're built to be used hard - not carelessly - but to their ability.Any old car comes with risk - the sensible view is to 'life' components and go through the car systematically. Also, don't be afraid to buy a car that appears a little 'baggy' that's cheaper as you'll be replacing the same parts on the more expensive car that is played out to be 'perfect'. Suspension components fail with age and use on these, and realistically it's a good grand or so to go through and replace all of the arms and links to make the car feel good again - they hide a multitude of sins even on very knackered components.
Three essential things to consider for both 996-986 imho, if you are after buying a high mile model for proper usage:
1 - Oil / lubrication (Are there any leaks? if so, how much? a minor leak is fine but better to sort this out asap)
2 - Cooling system (Are the radiators, fans, themorstat and water pump being replaced recently? If not why not replacing them and refresh the whole coolant, ideally also get a new coolant tank. The full refresh is not that expensive and in my opinion it should last another 100k easily)
3 - Exhaust system (Cats, muffler, o2 sensors and shields..Are they OK condition, if not which ones to replace? Again the good refresh on the exhaust system should cover loads of miles and no annoying rattles while you enjoy the flat6 )
And finally, for manuals, once you replace the clutch-flywheel have a look at IMS and upgrade necessary..The rest is pretty solid I think just basic minor service and ideally oil change every 5k.
1 - Oil / lubrication (Are there any leaks? if so, how much? a minor leak is fine but better to sort this out asap)
2 - Cooling system (Are the radiators, fans, themorstat and water pump being replaced recently? If not why not replacing them and refresh the whole coolant, ideally also get a new coolant tank. The full refresh is not that expensive and in my opinion it should last another 100k easily)
3 - Exhaust system (Cats, muffler, o2 sensors and shields..Are they OK condition, if not which ones to replace? Again the good refresh on the exhaust system should cover loads of miles and no annoying rattles while you enjoy the flat6 )
And finally, for manuals, once you replace the clutch-flywheel have a look at IMS and upgrade necessary..The rest is pretty solid I think just basic minor service and ideally oil change every 5k.
No need to upgrade IMS when you change clutch. Just take out dust seals:
http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=108257&si...
http://www.911uk.com/viewtopic.php?t=108257&si...
A mate has a beautiful one owner 90k mile c4 coupe , sunroof delete silver with a flicker of rose/ pink in it. Had a factory engin when just out of warranty! Still going to the main dealer for everything! Last year had a full suspension re fresh and all rads etc,It has barely spent a night outside in its life! Two years ago the opc offered him 8 K for it! The car was mine but he decided to keep it a bit longer, he is thinking of going down the Bentley route now, so may be up for grabs again, only issue I have is that it's an auto !
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