Garage wrecked my Range Rover engine… please help

[nosha123]

Hey Everyone.
So.. the long story cut short for the sake of this thread...
I have a prized Range Rover Sport 5l turbo autobiography (Petrol). Reg 2016. Been regularly serviced and maintained. 90,000 miles.

• orange engine warning light came on whilst driving to work one morning
• I took car to 'garage 1' who ran a diagnostic and said cylinders 3,5 and 7 were mis firing and this was likely a timing chain issue or a timing tensioner issue but this was a specialist job and they cannot do it
• I rang around and found a garage with the name 'Land Rover specialist' in their name, so called ahead, booked it in and took it straight there driving super carefully.
• I parked outside slightly over-shooting their entrance, gave them the keys and one of their staff, knowing it was coming in for timing chain repairs, drove the car down the road, did a U-turn and back up, then around the back to their inspection bay.
• Repair quote was doubled in price once I sat down in their reception but had little choice but to leave car with them as didnt want to risk driving further.
• They commenced repairs next day - engine still ran, but obviously with the timing being out, it sounded more like a tractor than a Range Rover sport. I was shown a video of engine running and slack timing chain and gave consent for repairs to proceed.
• They did NOT run their own diagnostics and instead chose to use Garage 1 report
• They said they needed to do a compression test
• They then called back to say they couldn't do a compression test as engine no longer turned. They had seized it.

They then started saying they would get prices for a new engine - at which point I lost my st and asked how could it now need a new engine when it came in for a new timing chain.

I told them to stop all works as they had damaged my car. And they made me pay them £800 for the time to strip the engine down and gave me my car back with half of the engine and the components chucked in the boot of the car (the boot was literally piled high with engine parts!)

I got the car recovered to another garage for an engine rebuild and now need to try to prove garage 2 were negligent.

Any tips?
I am looking at a £10,000 bill minimum... Car is on finance with £28k still owing...

[nosha123]

thank you (I think) for the response so far...

So garage 1 was about 10 min drive away from garage 2.
So it wasn't that far to drive it.
The engine warning light was amber not red - which lead me to believe that it wasn't a 'stop driving the car now and pull over' situation. SO I did what felt like the most sensible thing and took it straight to a garage - I just didnt realise that first garage was not going to be able to do the repairs.

The engine was running when I arrived. and when I left it there.
The engine still ran during their own inspections - albeit they knew it was now a timing chain issue - so they COULD have chosen to not start the engine if they knew the seriousness of the issue.

The engine seized, according to my own private engineer, because they manually rotated the engine backwards whilst it still had the slack timing chain installed....
The pistons and valves all then smashed on the cylinder head and broke off leaving the engine completely seized.

My private engineer had to remove the cylinder head to pick out the broken pieces... and said there is no way that I could have caused that damage as I was able to drive it and the engine seizing would have been instantaneous

[nosha123]

Engine light was not flashing on and off. It came on and stayed on and was orange not red

[nosha123]

I also dont agree that they had to run the engine as they had already driven it, and heard it, and they had the diagnostics showing which cylinders were mis-firing.
So why did they need to run the engine?
They could tell the timing chain was loose from a visual inspection without running the engine
They also didnt run their own diagnostics which I believe is not best practice. A garage told me they would never use another garages reports and would do their own.
Why did they need to do a compression test?
And why did they need to manually rotate the engine backwards - another 2 garages have told me this is a big NO NO when preparing a timing chain as you need to have very precise specialist tools to position the chain correctly

[nosha123]

"Depending on the severity of the issue, the engine management light will illuminate either orange or red. While it’s sometimes possible to drive with an orange engine management light turned on (this may be yellow in some cars), a red engine management light signifies a serious issue and you should pull over in a safe location immediately"

[nosha123]

and
"What to do if the engine management light is orange
An orange, amber or yellow engine management light signifies a non-critical engine issue. If everything seems normal from behind the wheel, you should be fine to continue driving to your destination where the issue should be investigated."

[nosha123]

Trevor555 said:

Your own private engineer? A proper garage?

You'll need a report from a garage, preferably a VAT registered one (I only say this as it seems to be the benchmark for warranty companies)

That report will be your evidence to support any demands/claim.

Send that report to the garage, give them an opportunity to rectify the problem, give them some sort of deadline.

Yes I had the car recovered to a 4x4 engine rebuild specialist and I paid him to inspect the engine and the various parts in the boot of the car.

He wrote:
"Vehicle recovered into us with the engine in a heavily stripped state.
1.Centre induction & supercharger removed.
2.Camshaft fixings all loose & timing chains removed.
3.Rear of car filled with stripped engine parts.
Work carried out to carry out inspection.
1.Unable to rotate engine fully by hand in either direction.
2.Camera put down spark plug holes. Damage found on rear two cylinders on l/h bank.
3.L/h cylinder head removed. 3 valves found with heads broken off & consequential damage to pistons & cylinder head.
4.Engine will now rotate by hand.
5.In our opinion because of unknown procedures carried out from previous garage we would be recommending replacement engine."

Garage 2 told me verbally they had installed the new timing chain - but this was also not true and the part does not appear on the invoice I paid them for the time they spent dismantling.

[nosha123]

SturdyHSV said:

You said they sent you a video of it running with the slack timing chain? Had they disassembled it enough to inadvertantly remove the oil pump pickup, or the drive to the oil pump, and have ultimately run it with no oil pressure and thus spun some bearings and seized it?

The private engineer did then say verbally to me when I went to see the car at his garage, that the level of damage of the broken pistons or valves (Ic ant recall which and am not a tech person Sorry!), were smashed and that Garage 2 must have revved the engine significantly to break them and cause such damage to the cylinder head.

And yes - in the videos I have from garage 2.. the engine is running and they show the slack timing chain only slightly visible down a hole so assume that is via the oil pump thing you refer to. I can post video here if it helps

[nosha123]

BlackStang5point0 said:

5l turbo you sure about that..??

Uh yes.. why do you doubt it???

Have you not heard of them before?
They are made by Land Rover.

And they are a super car (not the SVR one which stands for SPECIAL VEHICLE)

[nosha123]

I think I'm done thanks chaps... thanks!

I can tell I'm in a very male dominated environment by the tone of the majority of these posts... (not all I hasten to add but the grown ups seem to be in the minority here)

A lot of you seem to come on here to take the piss and belittle people, in an effort to make you feel better about your own day and to boost your egos.

That isn't an environment I enjoy being around... so thanks for your contributions... I was hoping - given the name of the site - that some of you might have technical engine experience and could verbalise that - but a lot of you resorted to cheap shots and sarcasm.. which I think says a lot about you...

Byeeeeeeee

(oh and just a little tip from a female who you probably perceive as dumb and stupid, and out of my depth... if you have nothing nice to say.. then shut the fk up)