Outlandish nitrogen claims from Quick Phit

[Dog Star]

Dunno why I'm writing "Quick Phit" - I can't see how it contravenes "name and shame rules" as it's on their own website.

However it seems that nitrogen in your tyres has a dramatic effect, more than I've seen discussed on PH before.....

http://www.kwik-fit.com/tyre-search.asp

Bullsh!tters said:

Have your tyres filled with Nitrogen and increase tyre life by up to 25%, improve road holding and handling and increase fuel economy by up to 5%!

Filling your tyres with nitrogen may seem odd but that's exactly what motor sport and aviation professionals have been doing for years. Nitrogen is completely safe for use in tyres. By using it in a mixture with oxygen to inflate your tyres the theory is that it's possible to negate the issue of slow deflation, due to the larger nitrogen molecules taking longer to migrate from the tyre into the atmosphere through the tyre wall.

Having a tyre that does not deflate means you will improve fuel consumption and will probably improve safety standards too. It's not yet standard practice but Nitrogen could well be here to stay as a result.

Nitrogen inflation should only be carried out by professionals and should not be directly inhaled.

The first paragraph needs reporting to the ASA - although it does use the get-out "up to" (ie. "not more than").

Using in a "mixture with oxygen" - what? You mean "air"?

As to the bit about the molecules - I really don't think the difference is possibly detectable.

My contempt for these sharks grows daily - preying on people who don't know better and playing the "safety card".

[Carfiend]

A mix of Nitrogen and Oxygen you say? Is there a dash of Carbon Dioxide in there as well?

That sounds familiar some how.

[STW2010]

The size (diameter) of a Nitrogen molecule is calculated as 300 pm (pico metres) whereas Oxygen is 292 pm

I'll let someone else dissect the rest of that bks.

[Dr G]

Other half's dad fell for this recently, I bit my tongue. Hard.

[Deva Link]

Sorry to disappoint you, but it's all true I'm afraid.

Although the bit about using nitrogen mixed with oxygen is a bit odd, to be fair.

[Farrant]

Didn't Nissan do this with the GTR? They said they filled the tyres with nitrogen because 'normal' air is less stable or summat, I'm quoting of Top Gear mind, so may not be entirely true.

[Bissel]

they will claim that the reduced tyre deflation caused by larger nitrogen molecules means that you don't drive without optimum tyre pressure hence increased tyre life and mpg.


and for my next bit of science bodgery






we wouldna have global warming if it wasn't for those darn pirates

[GadgeS3C]

I think they meant:

Have your tyres filled with Nitrogen correctly inflated and increase tyre life by up to 25%, improve road holding and handling and increase fuel economy by up to 5%!

Nuff said!

[GadgeS3C]

Bissel said:

they will claim that the reduced tyre deflation caused by larger nitrogen molecules means that you don't drive without optimum tyre pressure hence increased tyre life and mpg.


and for my next bit of science bodgery






we wouldna have global warming if it wasn't for those darn pirates

That suggests we need more pirating. Ready for it shipmates? The planet needs you!

[Hugo a Gogo]

OMG! I'm inhaling Nitrogen right now!

[zollburgers]

It's a claim that has to be put into context.

Having correctly inflated tyres filled with normal air (a result of checking them regularly) will give you the exact same results as having nitrogen filled tyres that are not checked regularly.

It's similar to me claiming that I saved the lives of 1000 people today but NOT running them over when I was out in the car. Using their same marketing technique I would be a hero.

[vescaegg]

Bissel said:

they will claim that the reduced tyre deflation caused by larger nitrogen molecules means that you don't drive without optimum tyre pressure hence increased tyre life and mpg.


and for my next bit of science bodgery






we wouldna have global warming if it wasn't for those darn pirates

[Dog Star]

GadgeS3C said:

I think they meant:

Have your tyres filled with Nitrogen correctly inflated and increase tyre life by up to 25%, improve road holding and handling and increase fuel economy by up to 5%!

Nuff said!

I know - but it's complete cobblers - it's no different to saying "extend your lifespan by up to 50 years by not sticking a loaded shotgun in your mouth and pulling the trigger"!

Or even fill them with helium to make them lighter - which is technically true, but undetectable.

[CraigyMc]

Carfiend said:

A mix of Nitrogen and Oxygen you say? Is there a dash of Carbon Dioxide in there as well?

That sounds familiar some how.

I imagine that like me, you were mis-taught the constituents of air at school.

CO2 isn't the 3rd biggest component of air - that would be Argon, which is about 1% of the total. CO2 is somewhere less than 0.1%

I always thought the point of putting nitrogen in tyres was to make it drier - no moisture = more consistent pressures hot v.s cold.

I think one of the lessons from Stepneygate in F1 was that they were using CO2 for a totally different reason - the gas itself played a heat transfer role to get heat from rims/discs into the rubber.

C

[Whitean3]

CraigyMc said:

I always thought the point of putting nitrogen in tyres was to make it drier - no moisture = more consistent pressures hot v.s cold.

That Quik Fit advert is a complete load of b0llocks. Size of N atoms to O atoms is negligible. CraigyMc has the correct answer above as to why you would use nitrogen rather than air in your tyres.

You wouldn't notice any difference whatsoever on a road car in normal driving, and I suspect even an ardent trackdayer in a GT3 would not notice any difference in lap times either. As some other PHer wrote above, making sure your tyre pressures are right will have a far grerater effect on tyre longevity, fuel economy etc etc.

ASA for that advert. It's misleading and plaing WRONG from a scientific perspective.

[rhinochopig]

Despite their rubbish advert, there is a grain of truth to it.

A tyre filled with dry nitrogen will be more much more stable (pressure wise) against temperature changes than one filled with air, so in theory the tyre (excluding leakage) will retain the correct pressure for longer, thus optimising tyre life and economy.

Normal air - because of the moisture content - is less stable so tyre pressure will change with temperature thus the tyre will spend longer at less than optimum pressure.

It's noticeable after a couple of laps on a TD.

[Carfiend]

CraigyMc said:

I imagine that like me, you were mis-taught the constituents of air at school.

In the same way they mis-taught that electricity flows from positive to negative.

[pilchardthecat]

vescaegg said:

Bissel said:

they will claim that the reduced tyre deflation caused by larger nitrogen molecules means that you don't drive without optimum tyre pressure hence increased tyre life and mpg.


and for my next bit of science bodgery






we wouldna have global warming if it wasn't for those darn pirates

Have another

Very good.

[pilchardthecat]

Full account of the pirate/warming hypothosis

http://www.venganza.org/about/open-letter/

[boredofmyoldname]

How long before kwik fit start selling this lot.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VW-GOLF,-POLO-ELECTRIC-SUPER...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/3x-FUEL-GAS-SAVER-VOLVO-C70-...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/TDI-PD-Tuning-Chip-VW-Audi-S...