Making cars easier to service

[CampDavid]

After a decent sized shunt pre Christmas I have replaced my girlfriend's car with a Renault Megane. PH it isn't but it's safe, comfy and cheap to run.

What it isn't though is easy to perform basic tasks on.

Replacing a front indicator light is a nightmare, a serious undertaking which requires you to precisely the right length arms, or be it with a couple of extra joints. A mate of mine has had a relay go on his laguna. Not a problem, however it's almost impossible to access and when you do find it, the replacement job is done blind.

This got me thinking - why the hell are new cars so needlessly impossible to work on. The probably answer is bad design and keeping dealer service departments busy and profitable but I'm not sure it should be allowed.

Would it not be a superb idea to protect buyers and to stop this kind of crap by building in some new type approval rules. All bulbs should be easily replaceable, ditto relays and fuses and I'd even go as far to say that a basic service and consumable change should be achievable with a fairly standard tool kit, a jack and a couple of sets of axel stands.

[Kentish]

My car is easy to replace fuses and relays on but any bulb in the headlight involves removing the entire headlight and motor assembly.

To ease the process, it also helps if you loosen the front wings.

Crazy.

[CampDavid]

What cars that on?

You see my point though - how hard would it be to engineer a headlight where the bulbs were easy to replace?

[trickywoo]

I always try to buy cars based on how easy they are to work on.

Modern designers don't give a thought toward service items and if they do I suspect its of the cynical 'see a dealer' type.

An e39 5 series is easy to work on.

[Lucas North]

I'm really glad that both my cars, replacing the headlight bulbs is a 30second job. You can see everything going on.

I dread sometimes buying a newer car.

[JohnnyRims]

trickywoo said:

I always try to buy cars based on how easy they are to work on.

Modern designers don't give a thought toward service items and if they do I suspect its of the cynical 'see a dealer' type.

An e39 5 series is easy to work on.

Part of this problem might be that it's not something car buyers seem to give any thought to when purchasing the car. I'd like to see WhatCar and the like pick three fairly standard jobs and then list the price to carry out that work at that marques main dealer. Might make for some interesting reading and encourage manufacturers to simplify some of their designs.

[HellDiver]

French cars tend to be impossible to work on. I honestly think the manufacturers build them to be disposable.

The Mk3 Mondeo is easy to work on - oil change in 5 mins without even having to jack, bulb replacement is simple as removing two rods makes the lamp come out complete, even the engine on mine is still blessed with a throttle cable, plug leads and other things that can be fixed by a numpty with a hammer and a screwdriver.

[Waugh-terfall]

How old is the Megane..?

I've got an MY03, took me almost exactly 2hrs to change both dipped beam bulbs last month...

[CampDavid]

Waugh-terfall said:

How old is the Megane..?

I've got an MY03, took me almost exactly 2hrs to change both dipped beam bulbs last month...

It's a late 2004. I gave up after about 2 minutes - it was dark and I figured I could do it in the morning but it just started working again.

Seriously though - it's ridiculous.

[D1bram]

Current cars don't seem too bad, replaced a headlight lamp on my Astra this weekend and it was very readily accessible, but a Fiat Stilo I owned previously was horrendous to change head light lamps on.

I used to return it to the dealer, who would remove the pront bumper to allow replacement. On the bright side they were instructed by Fiat to carry out this for the cost of the lamp only.

Legally and for safety we should be replacing defective lamps at the earliest possible safe opportunity, but in reality many vehicles simply do not allow this.

[Dino D]

You missed this episode then:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXCZ2v-nIF4

[Waugh-terfall]

CampDavid said:

Waugh-terfall said:

How old is the Megane..?

I've got an MY03, took me almost exactly 2hrs to change both dipped beam bulbs last month...

It's a late 2004. I gave up after about 2 minutes - it was dark and I figured I could do it in the morning but it just started working again.

Seriously though - it's ridiculous.

Ridiculous and painful, I sliced the underside of my wrist up to half way to my elbow on something sharp and metal on the near side, had some sore bruising too, don't know how... I find if you put your arm in to the hole, hug the front of the car, you can just about get a hand in (drivers side only) in above the light, get that in as well and hold a small but bright torch in your mouth and look down from above, it makes is ever so slightly easier...

ETA: I had a bad earth on my OS tail lamp, took it off to investigate and I can tell you now that it's the EASIEST thing to change a bulb!

Edited by Waugh-terfall on Monday 17th January 14:46

[CampDavid]

Waugh-terfall said:

CampDavid said:

Waugh-terfall said:

How old is the Megane..?

I've got an MY03, took me almost exactly 2hrs to change both dipped beam bulbs last month...

It's a late 2004. I gave up after about 2 minutes - it was dark and I figured I could do it in the morning but it just started working again.

Seriously though - it's ridiculous.

Ridiculous and painful, I sliced the underside of my wrist up to half way to my elbow on something sharp and metal on the near side, had some sore bruising too, don't know how... I find if you put your arm in to the hole, hug the front of the car, you can just about get a hand in (drivers side only) in above the light, get that in as well and hold a small but bright torch in your mouth and look down from above, it makes is ever so slightly easier...

ETA: I had a bad earth on my OS tail lamp, took it off to investigate and I can tell you now that it's the EASIEST thing to change a bulb!

Edited by Waugh-terfall on Monday 17th January 14:46

Mine was on the passenger side but it was the indicator. Basically you need to find your way to the headlamp bulb and then hook a left and head into the wing.

fking idiotic

[CampDavid]

Dino D said:

You missed this episode then:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXCZ2v-nIF4

I saw it actually.

I bought the Megane as it did what I wanted a car to do for the square route of no money at all while being incredibly high spec and with only 40k miles.

I did think that the bulbs would be a pain but it's not that so much, it's more that they're needlessly so badly designed

[Waugh-terfall]

Just wait until a window motor goes

[CampDavid]

Waugh-terfall said:

Just wait until a window motor goes

That's it.

I'm not at work at the moment so I'll go out and wash it and take some photos tomorrow and it's in the classifieds.

[Waugh-terfall]

CampDavid said:

Waugh-terfall said:

Just wait until a window motor goes

That's it.

I'm not at work at the moment so I'll go out and wash it and take some photos tomorrow and it's in the classifieds.

Something I should've done, but in fairness it's not been bad, but take a look at my My Garage for a run down on mine, bearing in mind that earlier cars are meant to be worse (and I've been lucky)

[Turbodiesel1690]

Renaults are notoriously awkward to work on, I know of at least 1 local mechanic who just refuses to touch them

[CampDavid]

Waugh-terfall said:

CampDavid said:

Waugh-terfall said:

Just wait until a window motor goes

That's it.

I'm not at work at the moment so I'll go out and wash it and take some photos tomorrow and it's in the classifieds.

Something I should've done, but in fairness it's not been bad, but take a look at my My Garage for a run down on mine, bearing in mind that earlier cars are meant to be worse (and I've been lucky)

That image is awesome!

I'm probably over reacting and all that but it's one of those things that will worry me a bit. Ours is a 1.6vvt and it barely has enough power to pull a greased stick out of a pigs arse - I've no idea how your 1.4 gets anywhere!

[Waugh-terfall]

CampDavid said:

Waugh-terfall said:

CampDavid said:

Waugh-terfall said:

Just wait until a window motor goes

That's it.

I'm not at work at the moment so I'll go out and wash it and take some photos tomorrow and it's in the classifieds.

Something I should've done, but in fairness it's not been bad, but take a look at my My Garage for a run down on mine, bearing in mind that earlier cars are meant to be worse (and I've been lucky)

That image is awesome!

I'm probably over reacting and all that but it's one of those things that will worry me a bit. Ours is a 1.6vvt and it barely has enough power to pull a greased stick out of a pigs arse - I've no idea how your 1.4 gets anywhere!

Thanks, I made that for my Dad and his wallet!

Aaah, mine's not bad really, it's surprised a few people on runs before, really needs grabbing by the scruff of it's neck whilst being a bit brave, it's tidy handler though!