Diesel Performance
Discussion
Hi All
I own a BMW 330CI, and racing other cars on the public highway is not something I would say I ever do...Please dont think I am a boyracer, but I wanted to tell you all about a recent experience...
The other day it was late at night, no other traffic on the road, when I saw an Audi A4 2.0 TDI, we were in between roundabouts (say 1 mile stretch) on a set of dual carriageways. He (well could be a woman!) hurried off, so out of interest I was curious how quickly I could get past him (childish I know!)...and to be honest, I was a little frustrated...I did indeed get past him, but it was not as quick as I thought....and he had me working somewhat!
No real point to this post just to say there are some fantastic performing diesels out there, even the more modest 2.0 engines...After we got to the next roundabout we slowed, and went on our way back to normal speeds...
But I was thinking if I was in the Audi, I would have been rather pleased to have not given up too much pace to a "much faster car"
I bet drivers of these diesels must sometimes smile when drivers like me, in cars which do half their MPG have to really try to out perfrom them!!!
I own a BMW 330CI, and racing other cars on the public highway is not something I would say I ever do...Please dont think I am a boyracer, but I wanted to tell you all about a recent experience...
The other day it was late at night, no other traffic on the road, when I saw an Audi A4 2.0 TDI, we were in between roundabouts (say 1 mile stretch) on a set of dual carriageways. He (well could be a woman!) hurried off, so out of interest I was curious how quickly I could get past him (childish I know!)...and to be honest, I was a little frustrated...I did indeed get past him, but it was not as quick as I thought....and he had me working somewhat!
No real point to this post just to say there are some fantastic performing diesels out there, even the more modest 2.0 engines...After we got to the next roundabout we slowed, and went on our way back to normal speeds...
But I was thinking if I was in the Audi, I would have been rather pleased to have not given up too much pace to a "much faster car"
I bet drivers of these diesels must sometimes smile when drivers like me, in cars which do half their MPG have to really try to out perfrom them!!!
HellDiver said:
330Ci - 230hp, 0-60 6.5s.
Audi A4 2.0 TDI - 140 or 170hp, 0-60 9.7s or 8.6s
You're doing something wrong if you're having difficulty passing an A4. Or your car is broken.
What I'm sure he's meaning is he's having to give it some revs before making a noticeable impact, what with the diesel having the grunt low down and already there so to speak.Audi A4 2.0 TDI - 140 or 170hp, 0-60 9.7s or 8.6s
You're doing something wrong if you're having difficulty passing an A4. Or your car is broken.
I had a 200hp 1.9CDTI Astra. I raced a Vectra VXR with 280hp at a track day. He could only keep up with me until 80mph, when I ran out of gears. I beat him out of the corner along the back straight, but he was well ahead when we were arriving at the complex, braking heavily from 125. I caught him again in the twisties, but again on the long straight I was toast.
How were you driving your 330i? Were you just accelerating with the TDI 'in gear' or ringing the BMW's neck at 7000rpm? Was it E46 or E9x?
My N52-engined 330i is similar in terms of peak torque (320Nm) to most 2.0TDI units, and consequently I drive it in a rather diesel-like manner when pottering about in town or to/from work, i.e. high gears, low revs, and it's all rather lazy and effortless. And quite economical. Of course if I wanted to drive like that *all the time* I'd probably have a diesel :-)
What this does mean is that if your average 2.0 TDI driver draws alongside me and we both accelerate, and I don't bother to change down (manual so no kick-down, performance is actually rather similar.
This can lead to situations where it's easy for one to think "eh? where's my extra 100bhp!" but of course the obvious answer is that it hasn't arrived yet.
I quite like these situations, especially where the TDI driver is 'trying it on', as it's quite satisfying to stay level with the TDI until he hits 4000rpm and then 'shoots backwards'
My N52-engined 330i is similar in terms of peak torque (320Nm) to most 2.0TDI units, and consequently I drive it in a rather diesel-like manner when pottering about in town or to/from work, i.e. high gears, low revs, and it's all rather lazy and effortless. And quite economical. Of course if I wanted to drive like that *all the time* I'd probably have a diesel :-)
What this does mean is that if your average 2.0 TDI driver draws alongside me and we both accelerate, and I don't bother to change down (manual so no kick-down, performance is actually rather similar.
This can lead to situations where it's easy for one to think "eh? where's my extra 100bhp!" but of course the obvious answer is that it hasn't arrived yet.
I quite like these situations, especially where the TDI driver is 'trying it on', as it's quite satisfying to stay level with the TDI until he hits 4000rpm and then 'shoots backwards'
Edited by theboss on Sunday 16th January 17:47
HellDiver said:
330Ci - 230hp, 0-60 6.5s.
Audi A4 2.0 TDI - 140 or 170hp, 0-60 9.7s or 8.6s
You're doing something wrong if you're having difficulty passing an A4. Or your car is broken.
Not at all.Audi A4 2.0 TDI - 140 or 170hp, 0-60 9.7s or 8.6s
You're doing something wrong if you're having difficulty passing an A4. Or your car is broken.
1. You don't know the Audi wasn't chipped.
2. Maths and physics
Part of the BMW's good 0-60mph time is it's RWD traction and part of the Audi's poor 0-60mph time is its lack of traction being FWD with a torquey engine.
I suspect their 20-80mph times are far closer to begin with.
Then you have to consider the situation. You don't know how far ahead the Audi was. Or how well each car was driven.
So lets assume there is a 1.5-2.0 sec difference between the cars 20-80mph.
If the Audi accelerates 1.5 seconds earlier than the BMW, then the BMW needs to out accelerate them by 1.5 seconds just to keep pace - to maintain the gap and not fall behind. TO gain they need to be out accelerating them by a much higher amount, say 2-3 seconds. Even your 0-60mph stats struggle to provide this.
wackojacko said:
Most impressive diesels I've been in are a Remapped 3.0 tdi Q7 523ftlb ;P
Was that really just a remap, or possibly more? I'm not doubting the capabilities of the 240bhp VAG unit but am curious.Thats 550Nm standard --> 710Nm mapped. For comparison the x35 units are generally 580Nm --> 700Nm
Edited by theboss on Sunday 16th January 19:50
robert78 said:
I bet drivers of these diesels must sometimes smile when drivers like me, in cars which do half their MPG have to really try to out perfrom them!!!
Yes, we do! Replying to some other posts, it need not have been chipped - in gear times for diesels are much better than their 0-60 times suggest.
I have both a diesel and turbo petrol car and have been on the giving and receiving end of the very same thing - problem with the turbo petrol is that low down pick up is relatively poor. So if you were not preparing for the outdrag and started in too high a gear, the diesel has a got a huge hop on you before you get your petrol care spinning.
I love diesels - you get most of the performance available to you most of the time without having to stir the gearbox.
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