RE: Porsche Cayman S (987.1) | Spotted

RE: Porsche Cayman S (987.1) | Spotted

Tuesday 5th November

Porsche Cayman S (987.1) | Spotted

Worried about engine issues with a classic Cayman? Buy one with a brand new Hartech flat six...


Believe it or not, next year marks 20 years since the introduction of the Porsche Cayman. Perfect time, it might be argued, for the electric 718 to arrive, celebrating the big anniversary with a big debut and a commitment to a compact Porsche sports car for the future. Certainly there are some reasons to be hopeful that Porsche could make a battery-powered two-seater feel great. 

For a lot of us, however, the impending double-decade birthday might be all the incentive required to take the plunge on one of Porsche’s 21st-century heroes. We all know by now why an early Cayman might appeal: a naturally aspirated flat-six, hydraulic steering, a fabulous chassis and compact, exploitable dimensions are just the start. This is to say nothing of the alluring used asking prices and a design that’s ageing perhaps better than some expected. What was the new sports car to beat became (and continues to be) a very appealing secondhand option all these years. 

But we also all know why an old Cayman of this era might not appeal. The stories of bore scoring and IMS are well documented by now and, if only afflicting a few cars, are significant enough issues to put some off. If not quite the plague the naysayers will tell you it is, it was undoubtedly a problem with early 987s and 997s. Some cars you’ll get lucky with, some you won’t. This 2005 Cayman S was one of the unfortunate cars, with significant bore scoring to cylinders five and six discovered earlier this year. 

So why on earth point it out as a worthwhile place for almost £20k? Because the problem has been sorted. More than sorted in fact: this Cayman was subject to a full Hartech rebuild in May this year. When testing everything worked, there was a vibration traced back to the flywheel, so that was replaced with the clutch over the summer. All in, more than £15k was spent on the powertrain refresh, and the Hartech engine work was covered by a two-year warranty. 

Understandably, the owner who shelled out that much planned to keep their car for a good while, having owned and enjoyed the car since early 2021. However, for whatever reason, they’re not able to keep it, meaning there’s a Cayman S for sale with basically a brand new Hartech 3.4-litre flat six, plus clutch and flywheel, for £18,995. It’s less than £4k more than was spent on it over the summer. There’s still probably no such thing as a Porsche bargain, but you have to say it looks like a lot of sports car for the cash. 

It’s being offered by the dealer who sold it in 2021 and commissioned the recent Hartech work. Still less than 80,000 miles old and with good spec - PASM, short shift, Bose stereo - it’s gotta be a great project for whoever takes it on next. The 19-inch wheels have been refurbed, but the ad suggests that there are a few cosmetic blemishes inside and out. So it could be the ideal base for either perfecting your polishing skills and making a mechanically fresh minter from it, or running with the flaws and perhaps making a circuit-focused build from it, safe in the knowledge of a fresh engine. Very tempting either way. And just the thing to mark 20 years of a brilliant little Porsche in a few weeks time.   


SPECIFICATION | PORSCHE CAYMAN S (987)

Engine: 3,386cc, flat-six
Transmission: 6-speed manual, rear-wheel drive
Power (hp): 299@6,250rpm
Torque (lb ft): 251@4,400-6,000rpm
MPG: 26.6
CO2: 254g/km
First registered: 2005
Recorded mileage: 77,000
Price new: £43,930
Yours for: £18,995

See the original advert here





Author
Discussion

rossub

Original Poster:

4,835 posts

197 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
Must have failed to spot the rusty wheel nuts while spending £15k on the engine.

Jon_S_Rally

3,672 posts

95 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
rossub said:
Must have failed to spot the rusty wheel nuts while spending £15k on the engine.
I bet you're fun at parties.

Motormouth88

368 posts

67 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
That’s a crazy amount to drop on that old boat, even if the engine is alright

Taz73

221 posts

19 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
Flat six classics, they've been written about on here before as being great to deal with, that along with the rebuild should make this a confident buy.

ducnick

1,927 posts

250 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
When I look at Porsches I have to question if the perception of Germanic quality is warranted . Bore scoring and IMS failure at 80k miles suggests their engines at least are no better built than a landrover product with their chocolate crank shafts.
Presumably the engine was rebuilt with better quality bearings to prevent the IMS bearing issues reoccurring, but what about the bore scoring? Presumably that’s a basic design flaw that can’t be so easily fixed, or did the factory fit the wrong size rings or wrong pistons?

CarlosSainz100

582 posts

127 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
I know it's had the engine rebuild but that is top money for one of these; and why didn't the dealer get the car buffed and polished if as the advert says it needs it?

Chubbyross

4,631 posts

92 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
That’s £4k over what it’s worth. Shop around and there will be much better bargains.

IroningMan

10,299 posts

253 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
ducnick said:
When I look at Porsches I have to question if the perception of Germanic quality is warranted . Bore scoring and IMS failure at 80k miles suggests their engines at least are no better built than a landrover product with their chocolate crank shafts.
Presumably the engine was rebuilt with better quality bearings to prevent the IMS bearing issues reoccurring, but what about the bore scoring? Presumably that’s a basic design flaw that can’t be so easily fixed, or did the factory fit the wrong size rings or wrong pistons?
It can’t be easily fixed, no, but it is fixed by the Hartech rebuild, which involves a different cylinder liner design together with a hatful of other changes, way beyond the scope of a conventional rebuild/refresh, and addresses the weaknesses of the original.

Personally I’d buy a 987.2 instead, and indeed that’s what I did, but the Gen 1 cars have their fans.

supacool1

550 posts

186 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
Jon_S_Rally said:
rossub said:
Must have failed to spot the rusty wheel nuts while spending £15k on the engine.
I bet you're fun at parties.
I know...right...? Also stop eye banging peoples nuts.

BigChiefmuffinAgain

1,218 posts

105 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
You do wonder a bit about the back history of a car like this. Someone spent an awful lot of money on it and then once all the work is done, decides to sell it ? With dealer mark up they probably could have got more not doing the work and selling as spares ? And then the way the car is being presented is not great. You sort of think someone said enough is enough and just gave up on it. Would want to know why....

greenarrow

3,963 posts

124 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
Does seem quite a lot of money for a 19 year old car sports car, even one which has had a full engine rebuild. For example, a quick search on Autocar threw up a 54,000 mile 2003 986 Boxster S with the IMS done and FSH, for £9,995. Almost half the price for a 2 year old car with lower mileage and only a little less power.....think the Boxster remains the good value Porsche option for now.

Heathwood

2,798 posts

209 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
It may have had a rebuild but that’s pretty much 987.2 S money. I know which I’d go for.

jimmsy

448 posts

134 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
BigChiefmuffinAgain said:
You do wonder a bit about the back history of a car like this. Someone spent an awful lot of money on it and then once all the work is done, decides to sell it ? With dealer mark up they probably could have got more not doing the work and selling as spares ? And then the way the car is being presented is not great. You sort of think someone said enough is enough and just gave up on it. Would want to know why....
I think mentally it can be easier to get it fixed up and sell then tell yourself you're recouping some of the costs. If you sell with issues mentally you feel like you're losing money.

I've also had it with cars where you want to fix it to enjoy it, but once you've gone through the stress, especially if you think you've spent a load of money to fix it, then suddenly something else pops up - a clutch in this case - then you fall out of love with the car and resent it.

VeeReihenmotor6

2,341 posts

182 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
That has been for sale for an age and some more.

987.2 money and not far off a 981. Both younger cars where the buyer will get +5 years of use before getting the age of this one.

You can also get a 997 911, without rebuild or a 996 911 with a rebuild for the same money. Even though the Cayman is the better handling car most people want a 911 to scratch the itch.

The dealer is good though, I've inquired about something else in the past and they were very helpful and accomodating.

WeirdNeville

6,005 posts

222 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
My 987.1 came with a new and revised block fitted by Porsche in 2018, was £14k 18 months ago and I don't regret a penny.

It skims in before the March 06 tax rise, has 20k on the engine and 70k on the car (now, bought with 62k), and I've added Cayman R suspension, an LSD, braided lines and a GT3 master cylinder which sorts the brake pedal feel. Absolutely great to drive, reassuring even in bad conditions and absolutely outstanding on road trips and the nurburgring (20 laps done). Also, surprisingly practical. A road bike goes in the back just fine.



I'm keeping this one!

911Spanker

1,870 posts

23 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
I have a 996 with a 3.9.engine. It rocks.

I wouldn't swap it for a 997.2 S at all..It's a far more engaging car IME.

This Cayman looks OK but I would always go 911 personally.

WeirdNeville

6,005 posts

222 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
ducnick said:
When I look at Porsches I have to question if the perception of Germanic quality is warranted . Bore scoring and IMS failure at 80k miles suggests their engines at least are no better built than a landrover product with their chocolate crank shafts.
Presumably the engine was rebuilt with better quality bearings to prevent the IMS bearing issues reoccurring, but what about the bore scoring? Presumably that’s a basic design flaw that can’t be so easily fixed, or did the factory fit the wrong size rings or wrong pistons?
IMS was never an issue on these. And was nothing to do with the pistons. The bore scoring issue is too boring to recount but likely involves short journeys in cars left to sit, as well as the 20k mile service interval offered by Porsche for the early cars. It's about 5% of cars affected allegedly.

GM182

1,314 posts

232 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
911Spanker said:
I have a 996 with a 3.9.engine. It rocks.

I wouldn't swap it for a 997.2 S at all..It's a far more engaging car IME.

This Cayman looks OK but I would always go 911 personally.
I watched JayEmm's video at Hartech a couple of month's ago - that 3.9 engine sounds like a great piece of work. How long have you had it? Any issues?

Re the Cayman. I always think I want one but the convertible option of the Boxster is always preferable to me despite the Cayman's better looks and ultimate driving purity.

rossub

Original Poster:

4,835 posts

197 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
Jon_S_Rally said:
rossub said:
Must have failed to spot the rusty wheel nuts while spending £15k on the engine.
I bet you're fun at parties.
Nah, I’m always in the Kitchen wink

rossub

Original Poster:

4,835 posts

197 months

Tuesday 5th November
quotequote all
supacool1 said:
I know...right...? Also stop eye banging peoples nuts.
No idea what you’re on about