Does a low top speed in a performance car bother you?
Discussion
Spa has some long straights that take a while in a Caterham, Cadwell not so much. 125mph in a road car is plenty. Nomme de Plum said:
Why is that important? Surely it doesn’t take much talent, if any, to drive fast in a straight line on a motorway just being mindful of other road users.
Very odd attitude to think there is something special about it.
I agree entirely! All those idiots up the Metropolitan Police Driving Academy drawing fat salaries in exchange for giving out police advanced-driving permits for motorway work have it all wrong. They should take a leaf from your book, call the motorway cops into a classroom and simply write 'there's nothing special about driving fast in a straight line' on the blackboard. Said police could then go straight to work, saving time, trouble and ratepayers' money. Very odd attitude to think there is something special about it.
You could go up to Santa Pod and say the same thing on top-fuel day! It's a great idea: go forth and preach the gospel of 'no need to learn if you don't have to turn'.
Dunbar871 said:
Nomme de Plum said:
Dunbar871 said:
Little reminder on why top speed is important, before this forum fully converts into Mumsnet... 
Why is that important? Surely it doesn’t take much talent, if any, to drive fast in a straight line on a motorway just being mindful of other road users. Very odd attitude to think there is something special about it.
hand that PH card in TODAY
Missy Charm said:
I'd be disappointed by a 500 BHP car that was no faster, all said and done, than a twenty-year-old Mondeo with an ordinary petrol engine. I'd wonder what the point of it all was...
Literally the only place that would be relevant would be on a empty autobahn, so essentially never. Take the Cyberstar. It'd be so far ahead of a Mondeo if they set off at the same time it'd take 5 miles or more for it to catch up with its "ordinary petrol engine".
You're not sustaining 125 in the UK for anymore than a few seconds anywhere, even on track.
Even in France the days of cruising at medium to high 3 figure speeds are long gone now unfortunately.
Literally a non-issue unless you've got a few very specific use cases.
Missy Charm said:
Nomme de Plum said:
Why is that important? Surely it doesn’t take much talent, if any, to drive fast in a straight line on a motorway just being mindful of other road users.
Very odd attitude to think there is something special about it.
I agree entirely! All those idiots up the Metropolitan Police Driving Academy drawing fat salaries in exchange for giving out police advanced-driving permits for motorway work have it all wrong. They should take a leaf from your book, call the motorway cops into a classroom and simply write 'there's nothing special about driving fast in a straight line' on the blackboard. Said police could then go straight to work, saving time, trouble and ratepayers' money. Very odd attitude to think there is something special about it.
You could go up to Santa Pod and say the same thing on top-fuel day! It's a great idea: go forth and preach the gospel of 'no need to learn if you don't have to turn'.
You are comparing road with track and they are not remotely similar but I expect you know that.
Furthermore those drag cars are as much about the engineering as the drive itself. We have drag car team based just up the road from me.
MikeM6 said:
raspy said:
It's clearly a bragging contest down the pub. My car can do 155mph, and if I pay to get the limiter removed, it could do 168mph. Blah!
That is quite condescending, what if someone does value their cars top speed? Why judge them so?I do value the top speed of my car, I gain some enjoyment from knowing what it is capable of, even if I don't use it. I appreciate the capacity, it's not even about bragging to others.
I love cars, I love the sensation of acceleration, the feeling of a well driven powerful car. I love a car that feels faster than it is, but I also gain enjoyment out of the fact that my car could do 200mph, even if it never has or will.
My watch won't reach it's maximum depth either.
Honestly, it's like the Greens and their (now published) anti car stance have infected PH.
ChocolateFrog said:
Missy Charm said:
I'd be disappointed by a 500 BHP car that was no faster, all said and done, than a twenty-year-old Mondeo with an ordinary petrol engine. I'd wonder what the point of it all was...
Literally the only place that would be relevant would be on a empty autobahn, so essentially never. Take the Cyberstar. It'd be so far ahead of a Mondeo if they set off at the same time it'd take 5 miles or more for it to catch up with its "ordinary petrol engine".
You're not sustaining 125 in the UK for anymore than a few seconds anywhere, even on track.
Even in France the days of cruising at medium to high 3 figure speeds are long gone now unfortunately.
Literally a non-issue unless you've got a few very specific use cases.
Top speed is really a non issue in the U.K. and most of Europe and the USA where I’m currently situated.
I really enjoy the chance to reach some decent speeds on the autobahn, there was one moment on our last trip when the sun came out and the road unravelled across a shallow valley in a long constant-radius curve, we were speeding past the other traffic and it felt like playing Outrun. Max reached on the trip was 179mph or so, hope to go out a bit later in the day on next trip to try and get near 200.
I've also hit ~150 at Bedford.
So yeah, I'd feel I'm missing out hitting a limiter at 112 or 125.
At the same time speeds above 125mph are only one facet of high performance driving. A very lightweight car could be lots of fun without a high top speed, and might be a better and more fun car in other ways for not needing to be engineered for ultra-high speeds.
I think in cars with a "GT" capability I like the capacity to reach high speeds, they're more likely to be taking on a continental trip. Conversely if it's going to be track and/or B-road driving only, it's not a big deal.
Specifically for EVs I probably wouldn't bother driving that fast. I notice the dent in range doing triple-digit speeds in a petrol car, it wouldn't be worth holding an electric car at max output for ten minutes and then having to go and charge for half an hour. (The Cyberster would empty its 77 kWh battery in 12 minutes if sustaining its max output of 503hp / 375 kW). So for an EV it would just be part of the overall pros and cons of the car that it's pointless trying to do high speed cruising anyway.
So it's part of the enjoyment of some performance cars, I value it but I'd be prepared to sacrifice it in exchange for other benefits.
I've also hit ~150 at Bedford.
So yeah, I'd feel I'm missing out hitting a limiter at 112 or 125.
At the same time speeds above 125mph are only one facet of high performance driving. A very lightweight car could be lots of fun without a high top speed, and might be a better and more fun car in other ways for not needing to be engineered for ultra-high speeds.
I think in cars with a "GT" capability I like the capacity to reach high speeds, they're more likely to be taking on a continental trip. Conversely if it's going to be track and/or B-road driving only, it's not a big deal.
Specifically for EVs I probably wouldn't bother driving that fast. I notice the dent in range doing triple-digit speeds in a petrol car, it wouldn't be worth holding an electric car at max output for ten minutes and then having to go and charge for half an hour. (The Cyberster would empty its 77 kWh battery in 12 minutes if sustaining its max output of 503hp / 375 kW). So for an EV it would just be part of the overall pros and cons of the car that it's pointless trying to do high speed cruising anyway.
So it's part of the enjoyment of some performance cars, I value it but I'd be prepared to sacrifice it in exchange for other benefits.
Given that observation about the impact high speeds have on range with EVs I can see why they have speed limiters, but then I still can't think of EVs as performance cars!
Both my BMW have 155mph limiters, but apparently they only interfere in 6th and if you are looking for Vmax you'd still be in 5th anyway as they are manuals.
I'll never get close to the limiter in the UK, I just like knowing if I ever go to Germany and find the right Autobahn or visit the Isle Of Man my right foot would be the limiter!
Both my BMW have 155mph limiters, but apparently they only interfere in 6th and if you are looking for Vmax you'd still be in 5th anyway as they are manuals.
I'll never get close to the limiter in the UK, I just like knowing if I ever go to Germany and find the right Autobahn or visit the Isle Of Man my right foot would be the limiter!
Mr Tidy said:
Given that observation about the impact high speeds have on range with EVs I can see why they have speed limiters, but then I still can't think of EVs as performance cars!
Both my BMW have 155mph limiters, but apparently they only interfere in 6th and if you are looking for Vmax you'd still be in 5th anyway as they are manuals.
I'll never get close to the limiter in the UK, I just like knowing if I ever go to Germany and find the right Autobahn or visit the Isle Of Man my right foot would be the limiter!
Try a Taycan and you may change your view on their potential as a performance car. Both my BMW have 155mph limiters, but apparently they only interfere in 6th and if you are looking for Vmax you'd still be in 5th anyway as they are manuals.
I'll never get close to the limiter in the UK, I just like knowing if I ever go to Germany and find the right Autobahn or visit the Isle Of Man my right foot would be the limiter!
Any car driven ten tenths will suck petrol like there’s no tomorrow. Single figure mpg was easily achievable in my Supercharged Honda Engined Exige when tracked.
I would not be buying an EV for track work though but nor would I have had any of the larger GT cars for the same purpose. Horses for courses.
It depends on the type of performance car. In something like the aforementioned Caterham or a supermini-based hot hatch it'd be a lot less of a concern than in a sports or big GT car. Having said that, one of my friends had an electric Mini and the 93mph top speed, together with the abysmal range above 80mph are a couple of the many reasons I'd never own one. That brings me to the point that in a lot of EVs it's not so much the top speed as the performance drop off at 80+ mph that disappoints.
I would speculate that this has something to do with the apparent desire of the authorities to make every UK Motorway a permanent 50mph average speed limit but then some posters on here would start steaming enough that they could charge their own appliances.
I would speculate that this has something to do with the apparent desire of the authorities to make every UK Motorway a permanent 50mph average speed limit but then some posters on here would start steaming enough that they could charge their own appliances.
Clivey said:
It depends on the type of performance car. In something like the aforementioned Caterham or a supermini-based hot hatch it'd be a lot less of a concern than in a sports or big GT car. Having said that, one of my friends had an electric Mini and the 93mph top speed, together with the abysmal range above 80mph are a couple of the many reasons I'd never own one. That brings me to the point that in a lot of EVs it's not so much the top speed as the performance drop off at 80+ mph that disappoints.
I would speculate that this has something to do with the apparent desire of the authorities to make every UK Motorway a permanent 50mph average speed limit but then some posters on here would start steaming enough that they could charge their own appliances.
A mini is essentially a city car. The speed limit is 70mph so why does the range impact at a constant 80 matter that much.I would speculate that this has something to do with the apparent desire of the authorities to make every UK Motorway a permanent 50mph average speed limit but then some posters on here would start steaming enough that they could charge their own appliances.
Your last paragraph is verging on conspiratorial nonsense.
I’d have a problem with it - 125 in a modern performance car would be an irritant.
Beyond that, it really depends upon the car; one of my most enjoyable cars has a top speed of about 70, at which point it’s vaguely terrifying. Love it.
I have another car that is 190+ in theory, but it gathers speed rather quickly, and a capped limit would annoy. All those that have cars with that level of performance know, it is very easy, enjoyable (and safe) to hit 140mph+ in quite a few situations.
Artificial caps are what annoy. Even more annoying is a cap that is too low - a Volvo will never feature on my drive.
As to the dirge that suggested anything I over 70 is unnecessary - well, have a word pal.
Beyond that, it really depends upon the car; one of my most enjoyable cars has a top speed of about 70, at which point it’s vaguely terrifying. Love it.
I have another car that is 190+ in theory, but it gathers speed rather quickly, and a capped limit would annoy. All those that have cars with that level of performance know, it is very easy, enjoyable (and safe) to hit 140mph+ in quite a few situations.
Artificial caps are what annoy. Even more annoying is a cap that is too low - a Volvo will never feature on my drive.
As to the dirge that suggested anything I over 70 is unnecessary - well, have a word pal.
raspy said:
cerb4.5lee said:
We've been discussing the top speed on another thread about the new electric MG Roadster, and its top speed is only a 125mph, yet it has over 500bhp though.
For me personally I'd want it to go quicker than a 125mph, and I don't like Volvo anymore because they limit their cars to only a 112mph as well.
So would a low top speed in a performance car bother you?
No because the limit is 70mph here. For me personally I'd want it to go quicker than a 125mph, and I don't like Volvo anymore because they limit their cars to only a 112mph as well.
So would a low top speed in a performance car bother you?
TX.
To some extent, yes. I love over-engineering. If my car is built to Vmax at 120mph, if I'm hitting triple digits then I'm getting towards its limits. Whereas, if my car is designed with a Vmax of 200mph, then it's just going for a jog at 120mph.
Before you complain about me using nerdy terms, I work in aerospace, where delta speeds, margins, V1, N1 etc are all run of the mill terms.
I remember, years ago, travelling on the autobahn in an MX-5 with a 325i. A few PHers on the trip too. The MX-5 was running at close to top speed, we were getting bounced around and you could see the headlight scatter sending SOS messages for us to slow down.
Meanwhile the 3-series was effortlessly cruising at 110mph, the headlight scatter was almost nonexistant, and there was an irrational hatred towards the BMW because the occupants were doing the journey in a smooth, air-conditioned, comfortable journey. Compared to our leaky MX-5 where we were being thrown around a noisy, hot cabin, and having most of our possessions in the back of the BMW that we were quickly failing to bother to keep up with.
Okay, there was no point in sharing this.
Before you complain about me using nerdy terms, I work in aerospace, where delta speeds, margins, V1, N1 etc are all run of the mill terms.
I remember, years ago, travelling on the autobahn in an MX-5 with a 325i. A few PHers on the trip too. The MX-5 was running at close to top speed, we were getting bounced around and you could see the headlight scatter sending SOS messages for us to slow down.
Meanwhile the 3-series was effortlessly cruising at 110mph, the headlight scatter was almost nonexistant, and there was an irrational hatred towards the BMW because the occupants were doing the journey in a smooth, air-conditioned, comfortable journey. Compared to our leaky MX-5 where we were being thrown around a noisy, hot cabin, and having most of our possessions in the back of the BMW that we were quickly failing to bother to keep up with.
Okay, there was no point in sharing this.
Nomme de Plum said:
A mini is essentially a city car. The speed limit is 70mph so why does the range impact at a constant 80 matter that much.
Your last paragraph is verging on conspiratorial nonsense.
My wife used to have a Mini JCW that was used for a 64-mile round trip commute and the last time I drove a city car, it was a Seat Ibiza rental that we used to travel all over Northern Portugal, up to the Spanish border and down to the Caramulo Motorfestival. An Electric Mini wouldn't even have had the range for my wife to visit family on her way home from work without needing a charge.Your last paragraph is verging on conspiratorial nonsense.
Just because a car is small doesn't mean that it has to be confined to cities or short journeys and many supermini owners may have to travel long distances in them. It'd be a ridiculous state of affairs (not to mention a waste of resources) if they had to buy a larger car just to get enough range to make those journeys tolerable.
As for my last comment, I did drop a pretty big hint that it was a joke (although these days it wouldn't surprise me if there turned-out to be correct) but evidently some people on here take themselves way too seriously...
MikeM6 said:
I do value the top speed of my car, I gain some enjoyment from knowing what it is capable of, even if I don't use it. I appreciate the capacity, it's not even about bragging to others.
My watch won't reach it's maximum depth either.
I agree with this....My watch won't reach it's maximum depth either.
It's borderline mad to need your watch to be able to survive the Mariana Trench or deep space - the same for your car to be capable of Warp Factor II. However - it's the thought of it that's enticing. Limit that possibility and a bit of magic is lost.
samoht said:
Specifically for EVs I probably wouldn't bother driving that fast. I notice the dent in range doing triple-digit speeds in a petrol car, it wouldn't be worth holding an electric car at max output for ten minutes and then having to go and charge for half an hour. (The Cyberster would empty its 77 kWh battery in 12 minutes if sustaining its max output of 503hp / 375 kW). So for an EV it would just be part of the overall pros and cons of the car that it's pointless trying to do high speed cruising anyway.
Although due to the limiter, it won’t be using anywhere near full power at 125mph. Probably more like quarter power, so that 12mins flat out becomes more like 45mins.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff