RE: 2024 Mazda MX-5 RF vs. Toyota GR86
Discussion
Banning ICE is not the answer. In a democracy we let the market decide and the eco loons can buy what they want without forcing everyone else into the same inferior products with a crap range and charging network. This govt mandated nonsense will get extended anyway as is clearly unworkable, plus going down the wrong route (EV=Betamax).
Both fine cars and excellent choices. Neither should be banned.
Both fine cars and excellent choices. Neither should be banned.
I was behind an RF one day and wished I could have one. Small, compact, beautifully curved with echoes of Corvette C3 but the defining colour is Soul Red. The fact Mazda made a 60s proportioned car is brilliant, in an era of blobs.
Then I suddenly realised I could have one. There are many out there with miniscule mileages around the 20k mark but I picked up a 184ps 2019 sub 40k mile car for 5k less. In retrospect, maybe I should have waited for better paint but what the hell. Even a neighbour in her 80s came down to have a look at it.
Why Mazda made this car in so many dull colours is a puzzle. The Soul Red gives it hints of Ferrari from some angles and dull greys and blues do it no favours. The downside is the Soul Red gets more chips than Harry Ramsden's.
The drive is great. The gearshift is direct. For me, the throttle is a bit too far right - the number of times I have tried pulling away using the brake, thinking there was something wrong...
Getting in and out is not the easiest but at nearly 65 years of age, it's now or never. A graceful exit was never on the cards.
The party piece is the lightweight electric roof. It never gets old and you can buy a "one shot" switch to save your finger.
I've had a similar car in the past, a rather larger Corvette C4 and the party piece on that was the V8 and the targa so the Mazda's thrummy four pot was never going to be it's highlight, despite the 7500rpm redline. Coming from a line of turbos, the breadth of the rev range is impressive but it sometimes feels like it just takes too long to get there and I do miss the rush of the 1.6 turbo in the Fiesta ST and even the Insignia.
Downside is storage space. My son has a 2000 MR2 that seems like a station wagon in comparison. The MX5 has no glove box and no door pockets and a centre console compartment no bigger than a pair of sunglasses. A small cubby between the seats ( and one behind the drivers seat) are barely sufficient but there is always the squarish boot for a pair of rucksacks.
So, overall, it has no practicality but who cares? The Toyota would be far more practical but I wouldn't be looking back after parking it, to take in the curves. So even if the GR proved a better drive, it remains a bland looking proposition.
Then I suddenly realised I could have one. There are many out there with miniscule mileages around the 20k mark but I picked up a 184ps 2019 sub 40k mile car for 5k less. In retrospect, maybe I should have waited for better paint but what the hell. Even a neighbour in her 80s came down to have a look at it.
Why Mazda made this car in so many dull colours is a puzzle. The Soul Red gives it hints of Ferrari from some angles and dull greys and blues do it no favours. The downside is the Soul Red gets more chips than Harry Ramsden's.
The drive is great. The gearshift is direct. For me, the throttle is a bit too far right - the number of times I have tried pulling away using the brake, thinking there was something wrong...
Getting in and out is not the easiest but at nearly 65 years of age, it's now or never. A graceful exit was never on the cards.
The party piece is the lightweight electric roof. It never gets old and you can buy a "one shot" switch to save your finger.
I've had a similar car in the past, a rather larger Corvette C4 and the party piece on that was the V8 and the targa so the Mazda's thrummy four pot was never going to be it's highlight, despite the 7500rpm redline. Coming from a line of turbos, the breadth of the rev range is impressive but it sometimes feels like it just takes too long to get there and I do miss the rush of the 1.6 turbo in the Fiesta ST and even the Insignia.
Downside is storage space. My son has a 2000 MR2 that seems like a station wagon in comparison. The MX5 has no glove box and no door pockets and a centre console compartment no bigger than a pair of sunglasses. A small cubby between the seats ( and one behind the drivers seat) are barely sufficient but there is always the squarish boot for a pair of rucksacks.
So, overall, it has no practicality but who cares? The Toyota would be far more practical but I wouldn't be looking back after parking it, to take in the curves. So even if the GR proved a better drive, it remains a bland looking proposition.
LuS1fer said:
I was behind an RF one day and wished I could have one. Small, compact, beautifully curved with echoes of Corvette C3 but the defining colour is Soul Red. The fact Mazda made a 60s proportioned car is brilliant, in an era of blobs.
Then I suddenly realised I could have one. There are many out there with miniscule mileages around the 20k mark but I picked up a 184ps 2019 sub 40k mile car for 5k less. In retrospect, maybe I should have waited for better paint but what the hell. Even a neighbour in her 80s came down to have a look at it.
Why Mazda made this car in so many dull colours is a puzzle. The Soul Red gives it hints of Ferrari from some angles and dull greys and blues do it no favours. The downside is the Soul Red gets more chips than Harry Ramsden's.
The drive is great. The gearshift is direct. For me, the throttle is a bit too far right - the number of times I have tried pulling away using the brake, thinking there was something wrong...
Getting in and out is not the easiest but at nearly 65 years of age, it's now or never. A graceful exit was never on the cards.
The party piece is the lightweight electric roof. It never gets old and you can buy a "one shot" switch to save your finger.
I've had a similar car in the past, a rather larger Corvette C4 and the party piece on that was the V8 and the targa so the Mazda's thrummy four pot was never going to be it's highlight, despite the 7500rpm redline. Coming from a line of turbos, the breadth of the rev range is impressive but it sometimes feels like it just takes too long to get there and I do miss the rush of the 1.6 turbo in the Fiesta ST and even the Insignia.
Downside is storage space. My son has a 2000 MR2 that seems like a station wagon in comparison. The MX5 has no glove box and no door pockets and a centre console compartment no bigger than a pair of sunglasses. A small cubby between the seats ( and one behind the drivers seat) are barely sufficient but there is always the squarish boot for a pair of rucksacks.
So, overall, it has no practicality but who cares? The Toyota would be far more practical but I wouldn't be looking back after parking it, to take in the curves. So even if the GR proved a better drive, it remains a bland looking proposition.
Man, that's brilliant! Well bought, enjoy!!!! Then I suddenly realised I could have one. There are many out there with miniscule mileages around the 20k mark but I picked up a 184ps 2019 sub 40k mile car for 5k less. In retrospect, maybe I should have waited for better paint but what the hell. Even a neighbour in her 80s came down to have a look at it.
Why Mazda made this car in so many dull colours is a puzzle. The Soul Red gives it hints of Ferrari from some angles and dull greys and blues do it no favours. The downside is the Soul Red gets more chips than Harry Ramsden's.
The drive is great. The gearshift is direct. For me, the throttle is a bit too far right - the number of times I have tried pulling away using the brake, thinking there was something wrong...
Getting in and out is not the easiest but at nearly 65 years of age, it's now or never. A graceful exit was never on the cards.
The party piece is the lightweight electric roof. It never gets old and you can buy a "one shot" switch to save your finger.
I've had a similar car in the past, a rather larger Corvette C4 and the party piece on that was the V8 and the targa so the Mazda's thrummy four pot was never going to be it's highlight, despite the 7500rpm redline. Coming from a line of turbos, the breadth of the rev range is impressive but it sometimes feels like it just takes too long to get there and I do miss the rush of the 1.6 turbo in the Fiesta ST and even the Insignia.
Downside is storage space. My son has a 2000 MR2 that seems like a station wagon in comparison. The MX5 has no glove box and no door pockets and a centre console compartment no bigger than a pair of sunglasses. A small cubby between the seats ( and one behind the drivers seat) are barely sufficient but there is always the squarish boot for a pair of rucksacks.
So, overall, it has no practicality but who cares? The Toyota would be far more practical but I wouldn't be looking back after parking it, to take in the curves. So even if the GR proved a better drive, it remains a bland looking proposition.
3.5 months in to ownership of my GR86 and I'm still relishing every drive. Interesting to note some people's negatives about it on here but I think it's mostly subjective.
First thing I did was unplug the fake engine noise. Not as difficult as everyone makes it look on YouTube. Simply pop out the glove box and you have easy access to the plug. I can't pretend the noise is enthralling but at least it's an honest noise, rather than electronic. Personally I prefer an induction note, rather than a loud exhaust and there are a few aftermarket options out there to amplify it, which I shall explore.
I'm also quite tall so I then swapped the standard seat for a Bride bucket seat, and now sit a good 3 inches lower. For me this has transformed the car. The pedal placement, reach the to the gear stick and steering wheel, along with a 'knees-higher-than-bum' driving position, makes it feel properly special.
Personally I love the way it looks and is a big step up over the old GT86 in that respect. I wasn't interested in anything Toyota had made until this point but this really piqued my interest.
I managed to get a cancelled order so mine was new from the dealer. I've had a few different things in the past and most directly comparable would be a 987.1 Cayman S. I was seriously considering a 987.2 or a 981, BMW M4 or even a 997 911 but having had a few German cars in the past, with constant worry of engine warning lights and chocolate engines, a new car with a warranty, for peanuts a month, was an easy decision in the end. As already said, the residuals should be OK too.
I know I am missing out on power compared to the Germans but, for my local B roads, it's the perfect size and never feels slow. I'm too old to care about 0-60 times etc and don't really plan on taking it to the track. As a modern car to enjoy on the road, it is just about perfect.
First thing I did was unplug the fake engine noise. Not as difficult as everyone makes it look on YouTube. Simply pop out the glove box and you have easy access to the plug. I can't pretend the noise is enthralling but at least it's an honest noise, rather than electronic. Personally I prefer an induction note, rather than a loud exhaust and there are a few aftermarket options out there to amplify it, which I shall explore.
I'm also quite tall so I then swapped the standard seat for a Bride bucket seat, and now sit a good 3 inches lower. For me this has transformed the car. The pedal placement, reach the to the gear stick and steering wheel, along with a 'knees-higher-than-bum' driving position, makes it feel properly special.
Personally I love the way it looks and is a big step up over the old GT86 in that respect. I wasn't interested in anything Toyota had made until this point but this really piqued my interest.
I managed to get a cancelled order so mine was new from the dealer. I've had a few different things in the past and most directly comparable would be a 987.1 Cayman S. I was seriously considering a 987.2 or a 981, BMW M4 or even a 997 911 but having had a few German cars in the past, with constant worry of engine warning lights and chocolate engines, a new car with a warranty, for peanuts a month, was an easy decision in the end. As already said, the residuals should be OK too.
I know I am missing out on power compared to the Germans but, for my local B roads, it's the perfect size and never feels slow. I'm too old to care about 0-60 times etc and don't really plan on taking it to the track. As a modern car to enjoy on the road, it is just about perfect.
Edited by Leftfootwonder on Saturday 15th June 12:00
Within a month of ownership of my 2019 RF 2.0 I had Eibach Pro springs fitted along with 15mm spacers so it now visibly sits more "squat" and has less body roll on tight corners but still plenty of clearance for city centre speed bumps. I also had the Android Auto / Apple Carplay upgrade fitted as it didn't have the factory option (just £60 for the hardware plus £100 for fitting because I didn't want to be prizing off interior panels and unscrewing the infotainment display myself - money well spent considering that Mazda charge £45 just for a map update for their sat-nav system).
Other than that I can't think of much that I'd change other than trying to source a set of the optional Recaros (found a set on eBay, the seller wanted £2k, I'll keep looking!) and a set of PS5s when the Bridgestones need replacing.
My only gripe is the wind noise on the RF with the roof down. It's not unbearable, even at 70mph, and it could be argued that if it's an issue I should've got the roadster, however it's my only car so I wanted an all-year round vehicle as for 8 months of the year the roof will be up.
Other than that I can't think of much that I'd change other than trying to source a set of the optional Recaros (found a set on eBay, the seller wanted £2k, I'll keep looking!) and a set of PS5s when the Bridgestones need replacing.
My only gripe is the wind noise on the RF with the roof down. It's not unbearable, even at 70mph, and it could be argued that if it's an issue I should've got the roadster, however it's my only car so I wanted an all-year round vehicle as for 8 months of the year the roof will be up.
Both great cars, but what hasnt been mentioned is the following.
Pretty much anyone can fit in and drive a GR86. The same cannot be said for the MX5. For me and I suspect, many others, this will remain one of the biggest question marks in the history of car design and sales strategy. We are constantly reminded about the scale and volume of sales worldwide of this fantastic little car. Surely though, the elephant in the room here is, how many more millions would they have sold, if they had given it about an inch more headroom, and/or an inch or two more legroom, or at the very least given it a height adjustable seat?? Would any of that really have made a SIGNIFICANT addition to weight etc, which is what we’re always told??
They’d have sold so many more if they’d just made it a fraction bigger inside. This is the tragedy for me of the MX5; a fantastic small beautiful car, compromised by cramped interior space and thereby rendering it only saleable to those of small to average build/height. Tragic!!
Pretty much anyone can fit in and drive a GR86. The same cannot be said for the MX5. For me and I suspect, many others, this will remain one of the biggest question marks in the history of car design and sales strategy. We are constantly reminded about the scale and volume of sales worldwide of this fantastic little car. Surely though, the elephant in the room here is, how many more millions would they have sold, if they had given it about an inch more headroom, and/or an inch or two more legroom, or at the very least given it a height adjustable seat?? Would any of that really have made a SIGNIFICANT addition to weight etc, which is what we’re always told??
They’d have sold so many more if they’d just made it a fraction bigger inside. This is the tragedy for me of the MX5; a fantastic small beautiful car, compromised by cramped interior space and thereby rendering it only saleable to those of small to average build/height. Tragic!!
Leftfootwonder said:
3.5 months in to ownership of my GR86 and I'm still relishing every drive. Interesting to note some people's negatives about it on here but I think it's mostly subjective.
First thing I did was unplug the fake engine noise. Not as difficult as everyone makes it look on YouTube. Simply pop out the glove box and you have easy access to the plug. I can't pretend the noise is enthralling but at least it's an honest noise, rather than electronic. Personally I prefer an induction note, rather than a loud exhaust and there are a few aftermarket options out there to amplify it, which I shall explore.
I'm also quite tall so I then swapped the standard seat for a Bride bucket seat, and now sit a good 3 inches lower. For me this has transformed the car. The pedal placement, reach the to the gear stick and steering wheel, along with a 'knees-higher-than-bum' driving position, makes it feel properly special.
Personally I love the way it looks and is a big step up over the old GT86 in that respect. I wasn't interested in anything Toyota had made until this point but this really piqued my interest.
I managed to get a cancelled order so mine was new from the dealer. I've had a few different things in the past and most directly comparable would be a 987.1 Cayman S. I was seriously considering a 987.2 or a 981, BMW M4 or even a 997 911 but having had a few German cars in the past, with constant worry of engine warning lights and chocolate engines, a new car with a warranty, for peanuts a month, was an easy decision in the end. As already said, the residuals should be OK too.
I know I am missing out on power compared to the Germans but, for my local B roads, it's the perfect size and never feels slow. I'm too old to care about 0-60 times etc and don't really plan on taking it to the track. As a modern car to enjoy on the road, it is just about perfect.
Couldn’t have put it better myself. First thing I did was unplug the fake engine noise. Not as difficult as everyone makes it look on YouTube. Simply pop out the glove box and you have easy access to the plug. I can't pretend the noise is enthralling but at least it's an honest noise, rather than electronic. Personally I prefer an induction note, rather than a loud exhaust and there are a few aftermarket options out there to amplify it, which I shall explore.
I'm also quite tall so I then swapped the standard seat for a Bride bucket seat, and now sit a good 3 inches lower. For me this has transformed the car. The pedal placement, reach the to the gear stick and steering wheel, along with a 'knees-higher-than-bum' driving position, makes it feel properly special.
Personally I love the way it looks and is a big step up over the old GT86 in that respect. I wasn't interested in anything Toyota had made until this point but this really piqued my interest.
I managed to get a cancelled order so mine was new from the dealer. I've had a few different things in the past and most directly comparable would be a 987.1 Cayman S. I was seriously considering a 987.2 or a 981, BMW M4 or even a 997 911 but having had a few German cars in the past, with constant worry of engine warning lights and chocolate engines, a new car with a warranty, for peanuts a month, was an easy decision in the end. As already said, the residuals should be OK too.
I know I am missing out on power compared to the Germans but, for my local B roads, it's the perfect size and never feels slow. I'm too old to care about 0-60 times etc and don't really plan on taking it to the track. As a modern car to enjoy on the road, it is just about perfect.
Edited by Leftfootwonder on Saturday 15th June 12:00
Coming from an Elise Cup I really couldn’t be bothered about sub 4 second 0 to 60 time pub talk. This car gives me the buzz that the Elise did in the corners but also is practical for longer driving holidays. It will be in my ownership for some time.
Minimarvel said:
That comparison does highlight just how expensive the MX5 has become. That might be the decider when the day comes to finally buy my perfect three car garage.
.
I know that I sound like a grumpy old man, but I also found the price of the MX-5 as a real eye opener too. .
Groaver said:
Had a BRZ, got fed up with the engine's weakness, though loved everything else.
After another car went to the MX-5.
Far easier to live with as a daily driver.
That GR86 is tempting though something's lost in the looks over the old one.
Still, both fantastic cars in these times.
After another car went to the MX-5.
Far easier to live with as a daily driver.
That GR86 is tempting though something's lost in the looks over the old one.
Still, both fantastic cars in these times.
I really like the older school stuff like these for sure.
I wish I fitted in an MX5 whereas the GR86 can genuinely fit a 6’3” human and still have room for easy heal and toe.
I absolutely love mine, it’s way more than the sum of its humble parts. Great write up, long may they live.
It’s worth touching on the huge aftermarket for both cars that add a whole new dimension to the ownership and driving experience. The basic car is great but there’s a huge amount of reasonably priced and easy to DIY potential to dip into if you’re partial to it.
I absolutely love mine, it’s way more than the sum of its humble parts. Great write up, long may they live.
It’s worth touching on the huge aftermarket for both cars that add a whole new dimension to the ownership and driving experience. The basic car is great but there’s a huge amount of reasonably priced and easy to DIY potential to dip into if you’re partial to it.
mackie1 said:
I wish I fitted in an MX5 whereas the GR86 can genuinely fit a 6’3” human and still have room for easy heal and toe.
I absolutely love mine, it’s way more than the sum of its humble parts. Great write up, long may they live.
It’s worth touching on the huge aftermarket for both cars that add a whole new dimension to the ownership and driving experience. The basic car is great but there’s a huge amount of reasonably priced and easy to DIY potential to dip into if you’re partial to it.
There are a few mods I would like to do but I’m too old for that s*it now. Also I’m concerned that it may affect the warranty and also put off future buyers too. I absolutely love mine, it’s way more than the sum of its humble parts. Great write up, long may they live.
It’s worth touching on the huge aftermarket for both cars that add a whole new dimension to the ownership and driving experience. The basic car is great but there’s a huge amount of reasonably priced and easy to DIY potential to dip into if you’re partial to it.
Just look at the price of unmodded Mk4 Supra compared to modded versions. Stock cars tend to be a rarity and are far more sought after when they get older. Mine will be staying stock apart from an HKS exhaust which can be changed fairly easily.
911Spanker said:
Obviously not the same as you have the endless new car Vs used car argument.
But for similar cash I have a 3.9 911 and a modded 130i. No 7 year warranty of course but putting running costs aside and purely considering driving enjoyment, they kill the GR.
Nice, do like the 130i, just got a m135i myself which a great daily with some mods. But for similar cash I have a 3.9 911 and a modded 130i. No 7 year warranty of course but putting running costs aside and purely considering driving enjoyment, they kill the GR.
Anyway need to try a GR, I wasn't impressed with the gt86 but I had a dc2 at the time, and the ND has very poor steering feel for an mx5.
Composite Guru said:
There are a few mods I would like to do but I’m too old for that s*it now. Also I’m concerned that it may affect the warranty and also put off future buyers too.
Just look at the price of unmodded Mk4 Supra compared to modded versions. Stock cars tend to be a rarity and are far more sought after when they get older. Mine will be staying stock apart from an HKS exhaust which can be changed fairly easily.
I’m limiting myself to basic bolt ons for now and not touching the drivetrain since there’s a 10 year warranty I don’t really want to squander. I’ll probably keep it forever but as it stands I can put it back to standard in a weekend if I want to.Just look at the price of unmodded Mk4 Supra compared to modded versions. Stock cars tend to be a rarity and are far more sought after when they get older. Mine will be staying stock apart from an HKS exhaust which can be changed fairly easily.
OPC100 said:
No losers here. These are two of my three favourite cars. Add the GR Yaris and that's it for me. Perfect cars for UK roads. Where I live anyway. 
Maybe a Caterham too.
Obviously the Caterham is very compromised. However as something to just jump into and drive...they definitely take some beating I reckon. They seem to put a smile on peoples faces when they see them as well I've found. It is a happy car. Maybe a Caterham too.
I've never driven either a GT/GR86...or the MX-5. But I'd love to try both though, because they both have a lot of ingredients that I really like with a car.
I think that well-sorted suspension and drivetrain mods won’t devalue these cars in the future, but iffy bodykits certainly would.
They are not especially precious or rare and they have a huge scope for tuning, with relatively low powered and no quite amazing sounding NA 4 pots.
The GR Supra and the LC500, a class and two classes above in terms of bulk and price, if not fun, are the ones that don’t need any meddling, even minor one, and they are already not available to order in UK.
My 35k would be on importing a Honda S660, with plenty of change for tuning, but not sure about fitting inside.
They are not especially precious or rare and they have a huge scope for tuning, with relatively low powered and no quite amazing sounding NA 4 pots.
The GR Supra and the LC500, a class and two classes above in terms of bulk and price, if not fun, are the ones that don’t need any meddling, even minor one, and they are already not available to order in UK.
My 35k would be on importing a Honda S660, with plenty of change for tuning, but not sure about fitting inside.
mainaman said:
I think that well-sorted suspension and drivetrain mods won’t devalue these cars in the future, but iffy bodykits certainly would.
They are not especially precious or rare and they have a huge scope for tuning, with relatively low powered and no quite amazing sounding NA 4 pots.
The GR Supra and the LC500, a class and two classes above in terms of bulk and price, if not fun, are the ones that don’t need any meddling, even minor one, and they are already not available to order in UK.
My 35k would be on importing a Honda S660, with plenty of change for tuning, but not sure about fitting inside.
I would say 1400 GR86 was rare compared to other cars. That number will diminish over the next few years due to accidents etc. They are not especially precious or rare and they have a huge scope for tuning, with relatively low powered and no quite amazing sounding NA 4 pots.
The GR Supra and the LC500, a class and two classes above in terms of bulk and price, if not fun, are the ones that don’t need any meddling, even minor one, and they are already not available to order in UK.
My 35k would be on importing a Honda S660, with plenty of change for tuning, but not sure about fitting inside.
Both good cars and quite different in their driving styles.
Had one of the last Mx5's 2013 model year before the big revamp.
Drove the later one but much preferred my Sportech 2.0 in fairness.
Never been a fan of the looks of either of the tested pair of cars.
But that's subjective and hell they can't be that bad as they sell pretty well !
Prices are higher but that's all relative too.
Do miss my old Mx5 but my age (65) and dodgy joints killed that off.
Had one of the last Mx5's 2013 model year before the big revamp.
Drove the later one but much preferred my Sportech 2.0 in fairness.
Never been a fan of the looks of either of the tested pair of cars.
But that's subjective and hell they can't be that bad as they sell pretty well !
Prices are higher but that's all relative too.
Do miss my old Mx5 but my age (65) and dodgy joints killed that off.
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