An epidemic of insanely slow drivers

[Muddle238]

What annoys me about crossings is when a pedestrian having pushed the button to cross, sees a gap in traffic before they get a green man to cross. They cross on a red man, then as they're walking away, the timer sequence from their original button push finally commands traffic to stop. Except traffic has now stopped for a pedestrian who has wandered off...

To activate the green man, it should require a constant press, until the green man appears. This prevents the chavs and oiks from casually pressing it as they walk past, with absolutely no intention of actually crossing, but forcing traffic to stop.

[KTMsm]

simon_harris said:

KTMsm said:

Because we're expected to blindly follow rules without question

Because "they" know better

I had a discussion with a slow driver, I agree to slow to 20 around schools at start and end times (or if I can see loads of kids) but not at other times

He said you should drive past at 20 all the time - in case there is a child - the next day, on our bikes with comms, I saw a child on the pavement

I shouted that he was a manic and should have slowed to 20 as there was a child

He couldn't understand what I was on about - It seems you only have to slow down for children that are around schools

the argument as I understand it is that for some reason children still hang around school grounds even out of school hours - hence the full time 20mph requirement.

But they also hang around parks, cafes, town centres...

and they generally don't have a 20 limit

[8IKERDAVE]

Muddle238 said:

What annoys me about crossings is when a pedestrian having pushed the button to cross, sees a gap in traffic before they get a green man to cross. They cross on a red man, then as they're walking away, the timer sequence from their original button push finally commands traffic to stop. Except traffic has now stopped for a pedestrian who has wandered off...

To activate the green man, it should require a constant press, until the green man appears. This prevents the chavs and oiks from casually pressing it as they walk past, with absolutely no intention of actually crossing, but forcing traffic to stop.

That is a great idea! It is infuriating watching people just press it without even looking. They then realise it's clear and there was no need to stop all the traffic but go anyway. I genuinly only ever press the button if the road is stupidly busy and it's the only way of getting over otherwise I'll wait for a gap in the traffic.

[bigothunter]

KTMsm said:

simon_harris said:

KTMsm said:

Because we're expected to blindly follow rules without question

Because "they" know better

I had a discussion with a slow driver, I agree to slow to 20 around schools at start and end times (or if I can see loads of kids) but not at other times

He said you should drive past at 20 all the time - in case there is a child - the next day, on our bikes with comms, I saw a child on the pavement

I shouted that he was a manic and should have slowed to 20 as there was a child

He couldn't understand what I was on about - It seems you only have to slow down for children that are around schools

the argument as I understand it is that for some reason children still hang around school grounds even out of school hours - hence the full time 20mph requirement.

But they also hang around parks, cafes, town centres...

and they generally don't have a 20 limit

You have just made the case for 20 limits wherever groups of children congregate, similar to the blanket 20 limit in Wales.

[Whataguy]

8IKERDAVE said:

Muddle238 said:

What annoys me about crossings is when a pedestrian having pushed the button to cross, sees a gap in traffic before they get a green man to cross. They cross on a red man, then as they're walking away, the timer sequence from their original button push finally commands traffic to stop. Except traffic has now stopped for a pedestrian who has wandered off...

To activate the green man, it should require a constant press, until the green man appears. This prevents the chavs and oiks from casually pressing it as they walk past, with absolutely no intention of actually crossing, but forcing traffic to stop.

That is a great idea! It is infuriating watching people just press it without even looking. They then realise it's clear and there was no need to stop all the traffic but go anyway. I genuinly only ever press the button if the road is stupidly busy and it's the only way of getting over otherwise I'll wait for a gap in the traffic.

There are a few smart crossings about with people sensors that will cancel the button if they have left/crossed already.

I expect costs are putting off replacing all the old crossings with them.

[DonkeyApple]

Muddle238 said:

What annoys me about crossings is when a pedestrian having pushed the button to cross, sees a gap in traffic before they get a green man to cross. They cross on a red man, then as they're walking away, the timer sequence from their original button push finally commands traffic to stop. Except traffic has now stopped for a pedestrian who has wandered off...

To activate the green man, it should require a constant press, until the green man appears. This prevents the chavs and oiks from casually pressing it as they walk past, with absolutely no intention of actually crossing, but forcing traffic to stop.

I don't think we can blame the pedestrian though. They don't know that a gap will appear when they get to the crossing so must press the button. And of course, should a gap appear they have no ability to cancel their request.

What, instead, is that one would expect new crossings to have more intelligent systems that will bring forward their change when they detect a suitable gap as well as cancel their change if there is no one waiting.

[FiF]

Pica-Pica said:

LennyM1984 said:

When we lived in Germany, an old lady called me an ahole for crossing on a red man on a totally deserted fairly residential street in a well-to-do part of town. I didn't do it in front of kids as my colleagues pointed out - quite rightly - that it set a bad example and they may try to do the same without being able to judge the traffic

There is an attained age when you consider your children to be able to understand and judge traffic speeds. It is probably late primary school. By the time they are in their early teens, they become a bit reckless/show-offy anyway, and it is too late. Best to teach them some judgement earlier.

An ex-colleague of mine was born and brought up in an area of Sweden where there was very little traffic. When he came to the University at Uppsala he used the same technique he'd used in his middle of nowhere home village. This was basically wait at the side of the road until there were no vehicles in sight. Certainly one of the most intelligent people ever met, maybe even THE cleverest, but we had to teach him how to judge distance and speed to decide more appropriate decisions on crossing.

[I-am-the-reverend]

RSTurboPaul said:

I have visited Cambridge quite a lot, which appears to have a high population of students from 'the far east', where one might consider 'the greater good' to form a larger/stronger element of the societal base [because communism].

It was striking / amusing / quite depressing to see many of the (presumably very intelligent, if they are studying at Cambridge) students stand for minutes at the sides of completely empty roads, waiting for the green man to come up, instead of just quickly and independently assessing the zero risk present and acting accordingly.

I lived in Cambridge in 1996, and the general level of idiocy weas remarkable. Not just the six fingered inbred bumpkin locals but the supposed intellectuals with not an ounce of common sense.

I still liked the place though. It's not a toilet like Oxford.

[I-am-the-reverend]

.....and I never, ever push the button at crossings. Why the fk should a train of cars stop for me?

I wait my turn, let them go and cross when safe. It's simple courtesy, surely?

[Monkeylegend]

I-am-the-reverend said:

.....and I never, ever push the button at crossings. Why the fk should a train of cars stop for me?

I wait my turn, let them go and cross when safe. It's simple courtesy, surely?

Nooooooooooooo, there is great fun to be had pressing the cross button when there is only you there to cross and it is clear to cross.

[fourthpedal]

DonkeyApple said:

I don't think we can blame the pedestrian though. They don't know that a gap will appear when they get to the crossing so must press the button. And of course, should a gap appear they have no ability to cancel their request.

What, instead, is that one would expect new crossings to have more intelligent systems that will bring forward their change when they detect a suitable gap as well as cancel their change if there is no one waiting.

Indeed - the pedestrians are not to blame. The ridiculous timings on most pedestrian crossings are a very significant factor here too - of course pedestrians are going to look for gaps if they have to wait up to 5 minutes (I've timed a few) - and there's some good research backing that claim up: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/... . Some countries paid attention to that research and have tweaked timings to match, some haven't.

[HTP99]

I-am-the-reverend said:

.....and I never, ever push the button at crossings. Why the fk should a train of cars stop for me?

I wait my turn, let them go and cross when safe. It's simple courtesy, surely?

My late dad, a retired Policeman, always had an issue with pedestrian crossings for that same reason, he always said they were woefully inefficient due to a train of cars from both sides having to stop for sometimes just 1 person to cross, he much preffered the idea of small bridges for pedestrians, meaning no reason for cars to stop and to keep the flow of traffic going, he knew it would never happen though.

[M4cruiser]

standards said:

Master Bean said:

FiF said:

808 Estate said:

Recently I have seen people slowing doown in L1 on a motorway prior to taking the off slip. This results in traffic in L1 concertinaing down to 50 mph.

Yep, that was one of the things my eldest brother, long time on traffic, drilled into me, maintain pace, be established in lane 1 in good time, signal left for slip road absolutely no later than the 300 yd sign, maintain pace, enter slip road, then and only then start to knock speed off. (Caveat, assumes no queuing traffic on exit slip to compromise that plan.)

I was taught to signal between the 300 and 200 signs.

Both police driving schools I inflicted myself on went with FiF’s big brother and the 300 yard marker general rule (assuming road speed was motorway velocity).

Edited by standards on Wednesday 19th June 20:05

That last bit is the most relevant. "assuming road speed was motorway velocity)."
I've also heard from police drivers that 300 yard marker is latest where you signal. But then I thought about it, that would be for police drivers on blue lights, still doing 120mph in lane 3 at that point.
For the rest of us, especially if already in lane 1 and trundling along at 55mph behind an LGV, what's the point in signalling left for 12 seconds. Yet you do see some doing this. Even worse, if in a stationary queue, signalling left for 10 minutes.
I take a deeper thinking view. If there's another lorry on my tail, then I try to work out which way the lorry is going. If he's taking the same exit as me then I signal just after the 100 yard marker. But if he's staying on the motorway then I don't signal! Because as soon as I do he will step on the gas and almost nudge me out of the way.

Like most things in driving, you can apply common sense for safety reasons, unless it's mandated in law. The 300 yards isn't mandated.

[M4cruiser]

I-am-the-reverend said:

.....and I never, ever push the button at crossings. Why the fk should a train of cars stop for me?

I wait my turn, let them go and cross when safe. It's simple courtesy, surely?

Brilliant, that's what I usually do.
Even better I ignore the crossing and go up the road a bit.
Also with zebras, because as a pedestrian I can't understand how they work.

[irc]

I-am-the-reverend said:

.....and I never, ever push the button at crossings. Why the fk should a train of cars stop for me?

I wait my turn, let them go and cross when safe. It's simple courtesy, surely?

Because on many roads you would wait hours. Seems like simple courtesy for lights to be used to allocate peds a share of the time. Just because they are on foot does not mean their time is less valuable.

[BunkMoreland]

swindler said:

I see more people in London standing helplessly at request crossings without having pressed the button. It's fascinating to observe how long they wait, and wait.
There also seems to be more people who continue to wait when the green man shows because they haven't registered it. Bewildering.

I go the other way, I rarely press the button and will wait for a gap in traffic I do press it occasionally though and will wait rather than be a tt about it

Muddle238 said:

What annoys me about crossings is when a pedestrian having pushed the button to cross, sees a gap in traffic before they get a green man to cross. They cross on a red man, then as they're walking away, the timer sequence from their original button push finally commands traffic to stop. Except traffic has now stopped for a pedestrian who has wandered off...

To activate the green man, it should require a constant press, until the green man appears. This prevents the chavs and oiks from casually pressing it as they walk past, with absolutely no intention of actually crossing, but forcing traffic to stop.

Or perhaps the option to cancel it as you cross. But that would encourage people to cross when the red man is showing and the lobotomised members of society would be up in arms!

[Mr Tidy]

swindler said:

There also seems to be more people who continue to wait when the green man shows because they haven't registered it. Bewildering.

They're probably the same people who sit in their cars not moving when traffic lights turn green.

[swisstoni]

Mr Tidy said:

swindler said:

There also seems to be more people who continue to wait when the green man shows because they haven't registered it. Bewildering.

They're probably the same people who sit in their cars not moving when traffic lights turn green.

Both need returning to the factory.

[theplayingmantis]

M4cruiser said:

I-am-the-reverend said:

.....and I never, ever push the button at crossings. Why the fk should a train of cars stop for me?

I wait my turn, let them go and cross when safe. It's simple courtesy, surely?

Brilliant, that's what I usually do.
Even better I ignore the crossing and go up the road a bit.
Also with zebras, because as a pedestrian I can't understand how they work.

Don't bite folks

You played a guide game m4 but you've jumped the shark now with it.

[Red Devil]

Foss62 said:

Every road we drive on in the UK (with the exception at certain times on the IOM) has speed limits and they are what they are on the day. Most people at least pay lip service to obeying whatever is on the signs and generally speaking it’s a reasonable strategy.

I
The IOM is not, and never has been, part of the United Kingdom. Like Jersey and Guernsey it is a self-governing Crown Dependency with its own Parliament (the Tynwald), government and laws. That explains why there is no equivalent of the UK NSL on the island: the Diagram 671 sign means the road is derestricted. Just like it was in the UK prior to 1965.