Bahnstorming Speeds
Discussion
From what I've seen the autobahns seem relatively safe with drivers showing good lane discipline, awareness and consideration at higher speeds.
I can't help but think roads like this in the UK (not that we ever will) would just end up a free for all of carnage, cars weaving all over the place, Audi RS's racing Golf Rs, supercars on hire getting maxed out, drivers sticking to middle/fast lanes at 80 etc.
I guess the Germans have grown up with it and perhaps don't see it as a novelty, but they seem to have a better nation of drivers.
I can't help but think roads like this in the UK (not that we ever will) would just end up a free for all of carnage, cars weaving all over the place, Audi RS's racing Golf Rs, supercars on hire getting maxed out, drivers sticking to middle/fast lanes at 80 etc.
I guess the Germans have grown up with it and perhaps don't see it as a novelty, but they seem to have a better nation of drivers.
Retro.74 said:
From what I've seen the autobahns seem relatively safe with drivers showing good lane discipline, awareness and consideration at higher speeds.
I can't help but think roads like this in the UK (not that we ever will) would just end up a free for all of carnage, cars weaving all over the place, Audi RS's racing Golf Rs, supercars on hire getting maxed out, drivers sticking to middle/fast lanes at 80 etc.
I guess the Germans have grown up with it and perhaps don't see it as a novelty, but they seem to have a better nation of drivers.
I don't think the stats follow what you're saying I can't help but think roads like this in the UK (not that we ever will) would just end up a free for all of carnage, cars weaving all over the place, Audi RS's racing Golf Rs, supercars on hire getting maxed out, drivers sticking to middle/fast lanes at 80 etc.
I guess the Germans have grown up with it and perhaps don't see it as a novelty, but they seem to have a better nation of drivers.
Retro.74 said:
Jimjimhim said:
I don't think the stats follow what you're saying
Really? Surprised, but I guess my experience driving over there is relatively minimal. I will stand by my thoughts of such roads in UK tho braddo said:
I'd say the stats do follow what he's saying, in that road fatalities increase when there aren't speed limits.
Strong claim. Any evidence ?I'd have thought that if there were any solid evidence for this,
unrestricted autobahns would have been limited years ago.
Or do the voters preferences trump road safety in Germany ?
braddo said:
The unrestricted autobahns have higher KSI stats than the restricted ones and the UK has significantly lower KSI stats than Germany (and virtually every other country with a large population).
Interestingly, even though speeds are high on German autobahns, other countrieswith limits have higher KSI figures. Belgium, Chechia, Finland, Slovenia, Switzerland,
Taiwan and the US in the figures I've seen.
Does being forced to drive slowly make you a better driver ?
cerb4.5lee said:
E90_M3Ross said:
The overall stopping performance from the E92 M3 brakes are really not far off the F82 M4. Where they aren't so good is doing it over and over again. I've got Ferodo DS2500 pads on mine, with uprated fluid (Motul RBF 660) and it's made a big difference.
I always remember having to abort an overtake once in the E92 M3, because a car was coming the other way that I'd not spotted. So I had to stamp on the brakes...and they failed miserably on me! So I've always been a bit harsh on it brakes wise after that experience that is all. I don't remember being especially disappointed with them generally in any other situation though in fairness. My STi with its 6 piston Brembo's were great but there must have been something a bit too compliant in the hub as hard cornering would sometimes knock the pistons back and sometimes give a brief heart flutter on the first push of the pedal.
dcb said:
braddo said:
I'd say the stats do follow what he's saying, in that road fatalities increase when there aren't speed limits.
Strong claim. Any evidence ?A quick google and here's one article mentioning a higher proportion of deaths happen on the unrestricted parts of the autobahn network.
https://www.lianhall.com.au/debunking-the-myth-the...
braddo said:
It isn't a strong claim, it's obvious. Why do you think autobahns have speed limits in busier areas?
A quick google and here's one article mentioning a higher proportion of deaths happen on the unrestricted parts of the autobahn network.
https://www.lianhall.com.au/debunking-the-myth-the...
Yes, a completely unbiased article isn't it...A quick google and here's one article mentioning a higher proportion of deaths happen on the unrestricted parts of the autobahn network.
https://www.lianhall.com.au/debunking-the-myth-the...
Referring back to the OP, an FK8 is incredibly stable at high speeds. Mine was rock solid at an indicated 160 mph last summer on a lovely empty autoroute at 6am.It is a very capable car. I am happy at anything upto 140 mph but life gets busy over that and of course it all depends upon which motorway you are on. A previous 996 seemed to wake up once 130 mph was reached and wanted to travel at that speed all day long.The faster you went the happier it seemed to be.
Going super fast in cooking models is always interesting as they are not engineered for max speed cruising.
Going super fast in cooking models is always interesting as they are not engineered for max speed cruising.
grumpynuts said:
Going super fast in cooking models is always interesting as they are not engineered for max speed cruising.
I disagree.A cooking VW Golf is engineered to cruise at max speed in a refined, safe and comfortable manner.
I’m just leaving work here in Germany, in 10 minutes my cooking Golf will be lolloping along at max speed.
braddo said:
It isn't a strong claim, it's obvious. Why do you think autobahns have speed limits in busier areas?
A quick google and here's one article mentioning a higher proportion of deaths happen on the unrestricted parts of the autobahn network.
https://www.lianhall.com.au/debunking-the-myth-the...
The raw figures are less telling than they might be, the derestricted parts are those that ought (all else be equal, which obviously isn't the case) to be the safest - ie. the wider, straighter, better-sighted and junction-free parts of the network. A quick google and here's one article mentioning a higher proportion of deaths happen on the unrestricted parts of the autobahn network.
https://www.lianhall.com.au/debunking-the-myth-the...
Hit 200kph/125mph in my B8 S4 a couple of years back on the autobahn east of Hannover. Was rock steady and stable.
Didn't go beyond it as had wife and kids in the car and they would have complained...
Had the pleasure of a passenger drive at 10:30pm once from Frankfurt to Blelefeld once with a native German driver in a C220d (so nothing special).
We cruised at 220kph-240kph majority of the way, with the odd foray 250-255kph..
Whilst there was no traffic as such - there were roadworks, with very limited advance warning, and so you had to slow down fast for those..
Didn't go beyond it as had wife and kids in the car and they would have complained...
Had the pleasure of a passenger drive at 10:30pm once from Frankfurt to Blelefeld once with a native German driver in a C220d (so nothing special).
We cruised at 220kph-240kph majority of the way, with the odd foray 250-255kph..
Whilst there was no traffic as such - there were roadworks, with very limited advance warning, and so you had to slow down fast for those..
Edited by HiAsAKite on Friday 21st June 20:35
Gary C said:
Yes, a completely unbiased article isn't it...
Well, good luck finding an 'unbiased article' that says unrestricted autobahns are safer than the limited ones. 
Don't shoot the messenger. I enjoyed some autobahn last weekend, although only got to 130mph very briefly due to the masses of traffic even on a Sunday. And rain, and roadworks... To be expected in the Rhine-Ruhr region however.
AmyRichardson said:
braddo said:
It isn't a strong claim, it's obvious. Why do you think autobahns have speed limits in busier areas?
A quick google and here's one article mentioning a higher proportion of deaths happen on the unrestricted parts of the autobahn network.
https://www.lianhall.com.au/debunking-the-myth-the...
The raw figures are less telling than they might be, the derestricted parts are those that ought (all else be equal, which obviously isn't the case) to be the safest - ie. the wider, straighter, better-sighted and junction-free parts of the network. A quick google and here's one article mentioning a higher proportion of deaths happen on the unrestricted parts of the autobahn network.
https://www.lianhall.com.au/debunking-the-myth-the...
Which would make sense really, howling past trucks and slower traffic with a 100mph speed differential can go wrong very quickly.
I did quite a few jaunts across Germany in the Alfa 166.
At 100mph the passengers didn't even notice anything different from UK cruising and the engine sitting on 4k revs was right on song and ready to accelerate if needed. I would say 100-120mph that car was happy all day, and just as quiet and stable than at 70mph. I also checked mpg after a long 100-120mph section as an experiment and it didn't drop much from 75mph speeds, 26mpg as opposed to 29mpg (3.0 24v V6).
However, at these speeds on certain sections of the autobahn, one really has to watch the rear view mirror as stuff is flying up behind regularly at 130mph. Once in the dark with a couple of mates at 120mph I wasn't concentrating on looking behind while occupying lane three and a motor-cycle flew past on the inside, he must have been doing 150mph...
As for high speeds, a curve in the road is a challenge. I had a clear 3 lane section once and tried to push the 166 to see what it would do. At 146 on the GPS and still pulling, the road curved and I bottled it and backed off, which was a shame as it would definitely have cleared 150mph a few seconds later.
At 100mph the passengers didn't even notice anything different from UK cruising and the engine sitting on 4k revs was right on song and ready to accelerate if needed. I would say 100-120mph that car was happy all day, and just as quiet and stable than at 70mph. I also checked mpg after a long 100-120mph section as an experiment and it didn't drop much from 75mph speeds, 26mpg as opposed to 29mpg (3.0 24v V6).
However, at these speeds on certain sections of the autobahn, one really has to watch the rear view mirror as stuff is flying up behind regularly at 130mph. Once in the dark with a couple of mates at 120mph I wasn't concentrating on looking behind while occupying lane three and a motor-cycle flew past on the inside, he must have been doing 150mph...
As for high speeds, a curve in the road is a challenge. I had a clear 3 lane section once and tried to push the 166 to see what it would do. At 146 on the GPS and still pulling, the road curved and I bottled it and backed off, which was a shame as it would definitely have cleared 150mph a few seconds later.
Last time driving in Germany was just over 2 years ago doing a round trip to the East of Poland in our Macan.
As so many have mentioned driving very fast is tiring but there is always the top speed challenge, just under 160mph was my best effort but sticking around 120mph seemed the sweet spot and very few cars passed us.
As so many have mentioned driving very fast is tiring but there is always the top speed challenge, just under 160mph was my best effort but sticking around 120mph seemed the sweet spot and very few cars passed us.
courty said:
As for high speeds, a curve in the road is a challenge. I had a clear 3 lane section once and tried to push the 166 to see what it would do. At 146 on the GPS and still pulling, the road curved and I bottled it and backed off, which was a shame as it would definitely have cleared 150mph a few seconds later.
There are some autobahn bends that appear tighter than those on UK motorways. There was one somewhere in a hilly area of SW Germany that was particularly nerve-wracking. Sharper than it looked, possibly less cambered than a UK Mway. Entering at 120mph, it then appeared to tighten. A heavy car that felt a bit light at the front at speed wasn't ideal in that scenario. Staying on the gas was the only option and all was fine, but there was very little margin of safety.
Bends can obviously appear tighter at speed, but having experienced some sustained fairly high speed UK motorway rides (as a passenger)back in the 1990s, UK motorways do appear to have been designed for high speeds.
I'm not interested in sustained very high speed driving. Too many unpredictable and uncontrollable factors for my liking plus the very high levels of concentration required make it tiring.
Passengers aren't keen. I know I'm not when in that seat. I feel I have to concentrate as much as the driver.
Finally despite the concentration there's the boredom of predominantly straight lines and just one gear. Give me three or four sessions of mentalness on a track any day.
Passengers aren't keen. I know I'm not when in that seat. I feel I have to concentrate as much as the driver.
Finally despite the concentration there's the boredom of predominantly straight lines and just one gear. Give me three or four sessions of mentalness on a track any day.
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