RE: 2021 ULEZ expansion | PH Explains

[rampageturke]

S600BSB said:

Similar schemes should be introduced in other major cities - Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester, Nottingham etc - based on audits of air quality. Issue has got to be tackled and ULEZs would help.

Bristol is introducing one, and it's great and all, local pollution is a st. But they're ballsing it up honestly. The first major carpark you come to right off the motorway is Cabot Circus. Great, the carpark is barely inside what you'd consider the main "part" of Bristol if you're shopping and you don't have to go near any heavy pedestrian parts to get in/out of the car park.

You'd think it would be great to get everyone out of their cars at this point and walk around/get bus etcetc

Nope, the biggest car park is right in the corner of the emission zone for no reason other than greed. You have to pay a charge and then you have to pay for parking if you're unfortunate enough to have a slightly older car.

[big_rob_sydney]

rampageturke said:

S600BSB said:

Similar schemes should be introduced in other major cities - Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester, Nottingham etc - based on audits of air quality. Issue has got to be tackled and ULEZs would help.

Bristol is introducing one, and it's great and all, local pollution is a st. But they're ballsing it up honestly. The first major carpark you come to right off the motorway is Cabot Circus. Great, the carpark is barely inside what you'd consider the main "part" of Bristol if you're shopping and you don't have to go near any heavy pedestrian parts to get in/out of the car park.

You'd think it would be great to get everyone out of their cars at this point and walk around/get bus etcetc

Nope, the biggest car park is right in the corner of the emission zone for no reason other than greed. You have to pay a charge and then you have to pay for parking if you're unfortunate enough to have a slightly older car.

Surely that is par for the course from greedy governments?

The only surprise is when people are surprised.

[aeropilot]

sidesauce said:

Given the results in lowering of NOx emission levels as well as noticable increased air quality in London, expansion as far as the M25 is pretty likely to happen I'd say - it's definitely spreading as far as Heathrow's £15 CC from 2026 with the opening of the third runway:-

Opening of the third runway in 2026

3rd runway getting built is pretty much dead in the water now........it's likely never going to happen now....

But that minor fact won't stop the introduction of the Heathrow ULEZ zone coming into force of course

[Type R Tom]

croyde said:

Friends who have cars but are not car enthusiasts are in for a shock today. Talked to one at the weekend that lives in the zone and he didn't know what ULEZ meant when I mentioned it.

Vox Pop on LBC just now and plenty of drivers were clueless.

A lot of money is going to be made from fines over the next few weeks.

Oh, and now Insulate Britain have blocked Bishopsgate.

I've got to get out of this crazy town after 59 years.

I do find the comments from people saying they have no idea. This has been advertised for at least 12 months in various media outlets. I've been aware of the plan for over 3 years and I don't even live in London.

I guess it's the same as the people who say they aren't consulted about things when they threw the letter away with the kebab leaflets.

[aeropilot]

Type R Tom said:

croyde said:

Friends who have cars but are not car enthusiasts are in for a shock today. Talked to one at the weekend that lives in the zone and he didn't know what ULEZ meant when I mentioned it.

Vox Pop on LBC just now and plenty of drivers were clueless.

A lot of money is going to be made from fines over the next few weeks.

Oh, and now Insulate Britain have blocked Bishopsgate.

I've got to get out of this crazy town after 59 years.

I do find the comments from people saying they have no idea. This has been advertised for at least 12 months in various media outlets. I've been aware of the plan for over 3 years and I don't even live in London.

I guess it's the same as the people who say they aren't consulted about things when they threw the letter away with the kebab leaflets.

But you're posting on a car forum........the people that are clueless, are likely never even been near a car forum in their lives.
A good mate of mine lives in Ealing about 400m west of the A406 boundary and changed his car last years out of neccesity as his elderly Mum lives inside the boundary on the other side of the A406 and he has to do a lot of running around for her.
At the time he told me his next door neighbour, who is utterly clueless about cars, or DIY and almost anything not asscociated with his profession of being a concert pianist .....also didn't known about or even understand about it, when my mate asked him if he was changing his car which wouldn't be ULEZ compliant.

[2gins]

Blib said:

I suppose that, everything else being equal, if you approach the Ace along the North Circ. in a non compliant car from the West there'd be no charge while coming fom the east you would be charged as technically the slip road and fly- over are just within the zone.

Of course, driving home again.....

Can't believe it would work like this, is this confirmed? I'd expect the slip roads to be classed as the A406, which is not in the zone. So you'd be charged if you came off the A406 and then went towards the centre, but not if you went the other way and headed out of town.

Otherwise, why not make the dividing line the central reservation? Anyone going clockwise, no charge. anticlockwise, bend over. They could alternate the days to make it even easier to understand.

[Type R Tom]

aeropilot said:

Type R Tom said:

croyde said:

Friends who have cars but are not car enthusiasts are in for a shock today. Talked to one at the weekend that lives in the zone and he didn't know what ULEZ meant when I mentioned it.

Vox Pop on LBC just now and plenty of drivers were clueless.

A lot of money is going to be made from fines over the next few weeks.

Oh, and now Insulate Britain have blocked Bishopsgate.

I've got to get out of this crazy town after 59 years.

I do find the comments from people saying they have no idea. This has been advertised for at least 12 months in various media outlets. I've been aware of the plan for over 3 years and I don't even live in London.

I guess it's the same as the people who say they aren't consulted about things when they threw the letter away with the kebab leaflets.

But you're posting on a car forum........the people that are clueless, are likely never even been near a car forum in their lives.
A good mate of mine lives in Ealing about 400m west of the A406 boundary and changed his car last years out of neccesity as his elderly Mum lives inside the boundary on the other side of the A406 and he has to do a lot of running around for her.
At the time he told me his next door neighbour, who is utterly clueless about cars, or DIY and almost anything not asscociated with his profession of being a concert pianist .....also didn't known about or even understand about it, when my mate asked him if he was changing his car which wouldn't be ULEZ compliant.

I would question how good this person is at general life admin, this has been on the radio, papers, TV, posters, road signs, etc. TFL even wrote to people with non compliant cars.

It doesn't surprise me though, as someone who deals with the public I know what they can be like. I have had people tell me they didn't get a letter that I have personally posted through their door.

[audikentman]

HardtopManual said:

I ride a bike to work from just north of Bounds Green to the City. The air quality really hits you as you get near the north circ; it is atrocious, and remains so until you hit Zone 1, where it seems to improve.

I think the ULEZ charge is the wrong way to go about cleaning things up; it disproportionately affects the poor, being a fixed cost for those who don't have money to spend on a newer car.

I would have thought not having a ULEZ would affect the poorest most, they are the people who have to walk and cycle so are more affected by polluting vehicles.

The cost of buying a ULEZ compliant vechicle is from about 3k.

[okgo]

audikentman said:

I would have thought not having a ULEZ would affect the poorest most, they are the people who have to walk and cycle so are more affected by polluting vehicles.

The cost of buying a ULEZ compliant vechicle is from about 3k.

The poor are not cycling, possibly walking, but mostly using buses and driving I'd have said (depending on their level of poor).

[aeropilot]

Type R Tom said:

aeropilot said:

Type R Tom said:

croyde said:

Friends who have cars but are not car enthusiasts are in for a shock today. Talked to one at the weekend that lives in the zone and he didn't know what ULEZ meant when I mentioned it.

Vox Pop on LBC just now and plenty of drivers were clueless.

A lot of money is going to be made from fines over the next few weeks.

Oh, and now Insulate Britain have blocked Bishopsgate.

I've got to get out of this crazy town after 59 years.

I do find the comments from people saying they have no idea. This has been advertised for at least 12 months in various media outlets. I've been aware of the plan for over 3 years and I don't even live in London.

I guess it's the same as the people who say they aren't consulted about things when they threw the letter away with the kebab leaflets.

But you're posting on a car forum........the people that are clueless, are likely never even been near a car forum in their lives.
A good mate of mine lives in Ealing about 400m west of the A406 boundary and changed his car last years out of neccesity as his elderly Mum lives inside the boundary on the other side of the A406 and he has to do a lot of running around for her.
At the time he told me his next door neighbour, who is utterly clueless about cars, or DIY and almost anything not asscociated with his profession of being a concert pianist .....also didn't known about or even understand about it, when my mate asked him if he was changing his car which wouldn't be ULEZ compliant.

I would question how good this person is at general life admin

He's clueless about anything that isn't a concert piano. Some of the stuff my mate tells me is comical.
Mate's neighbour was looking at getting replacement windows fitted, and didn't want to pay for a FENSA registered....(my mate said your mad) but he insisted it wasn't worth the extra money........fast forward a few months, my mate send me a photo of the front of his neighbours house, with the whole upper bay window front facade lying in the front garden, as the cowboys fitters didn't understand or check the way the 1930's build of the bay windows worked structurally.........and removed the bottom bay.....which also removed the facade and the upper bay window at the same time as the whole lot crashed into the garden......!!

[croyde]

It's a bit insulting that people, ie good intelligent friends of mine, are called stupid because they don't know what a ULEZ, LEZ or CC is.

They are just not anal about cars like we are

It's why we get to use the bus lanes because the majority just see them and avoid them, not realising that if you look closely there are times when they are legal to use.

For many people cars are white goods just like a fridge, and unlike me, they won't even realise that that dodgy washer/drier was subject to a recall

I personally have not seen any ULEZ stuff on telly or the rare times I have been on the tube. Sure there have been ads on LBC but many don't listen to the radio as they prefer iTunes or Spotify.

I don't recall seeing anything as I drive but then, I tend to concentrate on the road not on posters, especially on the motorbike.

I only really know about the ULEZ because of my addiction to PH.

LBC is acting today as if this is completely new and has taken everyone by surprise.

BTW I didn't get a letter but do get lots of pizza and kebab leaflets.

Edited by croyde on Monday 25th October 11:34

[Wide arse]

It is really frustrating that everything is against the motorist these days. Its all about cyclist, who pay nothing to use the roads (I am also a cyclist) where traffic is now at a standstill because of cycle lanes, bus lanes which take over the road and stop any traffic getting round them when the bus is stopped at a bus stop.
The increase in Residential zones for people who live in London but want the quiet of the countryside...... To top things off I cant use back roads now because of these residential zones, yet the traffic is horrendous on the main roads because the Mayor of London cant be bothered to fix Hammersmith Bridge which has caused insane disruption over the last few years. Sadly the British motorist will only grumble on forums and not do anything about it. Lets get rid of this mayor before he ruins it for everyone.

[2gins]

Wide arse said:

It is really frustrating that everything is against the motorist these days. Its all about cyclist, who pay nothing to use the roads (I am also a cyclist) where traffic is now at a standstill because of cycle lanes, bus lanes which take over the road and stop any traffic getting round them when the bus is stopped at a bus stop.
The increase in Residential zones for people who live in London but want the quiet of the countryside...... To top things off I cant use back roads now because of these residential zones, yet the traffic is horrendous on the main roads because the Mayor of London cant be bothered to fix Hammersmith Bridge which has caused insane disruption over the last few years. Sadly the British motorist will only grumble on forums and not do anything about it. Lets get rid of this mayor before he ruins it for everyone.

Don't go on the cyclists don't pay to use the roads one. You just disproved it yourself.

As for Hammersmith Bridge - that'll never reopen to motor vehicles.

[Barrie c 66]

Wide arse said:

It is really frustrating that everything is against the motorist these days. Its all about cyclist, who pay nothing to use the roads (I am also a cyclist) where traffic is now at a standstill because of cycle lanes, bus lanes which take over the road and stop any traffic getting round them when the bus is stopped at a bus stop.
The increase in Residential zones for people who live in London but want the quiet of the countryside...... To top things off I cant use back roads now because of these residential zones, yet the traffic is horrendous on the main roads because the Mayor of London cant be bothered to fix Hammersmith Bridge which has caused insane disruption over the last few years. Sadly the British motorist will only grumble on forums and not do anything about it. Lets get rid of this mayor before he ruins it for everyone.

It's not just the Mayor, it's the whole political class and senior civil servants.
They seem to have a pathological dislike of the personal freedom that having a car gives you.

[btdk5]

audikentman said:

I would have thought not having a ULEZ would affect the poorest most, they are the people who have to walk and cycle so are more affected by polluting vehicles.

The cost of buying a ULEZ compliant vechicle is from about 3k.

You can buy a Mazda 6 for about £700. It’s compliant.

[Type R Tom]

Wide arse said:

It is really frustrating that everything is against the motorist these days. Its all about cyclist, who pay nothing to use the roads (I am also a cyclist) where traffic is now at a standstill because of cycle lanes, bus lanes which take over the road and stop any traffic getting round them when the bus is stopped at a bus stop.
The increase in Residential zones for people who live in London but want the quiet of the countryside...... To top things off I cant use back roads now because of these residential zones, yet the traffic is horrendous on the main roads because the Mayor of London cant be bothered to fix Hammersmith Bridge which has caused insane disruption over the last few years. Sadly the British motorist will only grumble on forums and not do anything about it. Lets get rid of this mayor before he ruins it for everyone.

You destroy your argument in the first sentence. I think you need to be reported to HMRC as you pay no tax

The cycling paradox - cycling is only for white middle class men / cyclists don't pay for the roads!

[valiant]

Hammersmith Bridge is owned by the local council who are solely responsible for its maintenance (or lack of).

TfL have no responsibilities towards it as it isn’t a ‘red route’ and, like I said, it’s the local council’s problem. The fact that repairing it would cost the council it’s entire roads budget has led to the mayor, TfL, national government and the local council to come up with a solution. Unfortunately, covid has completely knackered TfLs finances so help can only go so far. The Mayor has zero authority to make the council repair it and he doesn’t get on all that well with the government who are more interested in point scoring than actually contributing to the bridge’s repair/replacement.

Point your ire at Grant Schapps. He’s the man who has the biggest say in repairing that poxy bridge

[croyde]

btdk5 said:

audikentman said:

I would have thought not having a ULEZ would affect the poorest most, they are the people who have to walk and cycle so are more affected by polluting vehicles.

The cost of buying a ULEZ compliant vechicle is from about 3k.

You can buy a Mazda 6 for about £700. It’s compliant.

I got rid of my car, a known quantity, that I'd owned for 23 years.

Last week I bought a compliant car for £400. It was very clean, no rot, good as new inside and decent tyres.

One day of ownership and it broke down and is now in a garage awaiting a new alternator and battery. Garage saying £140 for battery and £500 for ordering and fitting the alternator.

Cheap cars are cheap for a reason, they are a lottery unless you are a good mechanic.

[Hungry Pigeon]

My 2003 6L V12 DB7 Vantage Volante is ULEZ compliant!

[btdk5]

croyde said:

btdk5 said:

audikentman said:

I would have thought not having a ULEZ would affect the poorest most, they are the people who have to walk and cycle so are more affected by polluting vehicles.

The cost of buying a ULEZ compliant vechicle is from about 3k.

You can buy a Mazda 6 for about £700. It’s compliant.

I got rid of my car, a known quantity, that I'd owned for 23 years.

Last week I bought a compliant car for £400. It was very clean, no rot, good as new inside and decent tyres.

One day of ownership and it broke down and is now in a garage awaiting a new alternator and battery. Garage saying £140 for battery and £500 for ordering and fitting the alternator.

Cheap cars are cheap for a reason, they are a lottery unless you are a good mechanic.

You bought a car for £400 and you’re moaning that it needed some light work??

I live within the ulez zone and whilst I feel sorry for the financial hardship the zone will bring to some people I fully support it. Air quality is more important than some ratty old diesel.

And as illustrated it is very generous on petrol cars.