Alonso and Vettel deserve better

Alonso and Vettel deserve better

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Discussion

TazLondon

Original Poster:

322 posts

225 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
quotequote all
Firstly, I'm a Lewis Hamilton fan so favour him winning in F1.

However, currently, the only competition he has is with his team-mate, Rosberg.

As each month goes by, the career twilights for Alonso and Vettel draw ever closer. It's such a waste of huge talent that they're not in cars that can race against Hamilton and Rosberg.

I'd love to see at least 4, even better if it were 6-8 drivers jostling for the top spot at each race. I feel we really need at least Alonso and Vettel in a car that's as fast as the Mercedes.

768

14,839 posts

102 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
quotequote all
There's a lot of world champions kicking around at the moment. F1's about more than individual driver track performance though, however much that isn't always particularly exciting.


Personally I don't take to Vettel and particularly Alonso so struggle to be too bothered there, but I get the general sentiment.

Edited by 768 on Sunday 31st July 09:45

London424

12,899 posts

181 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
quotequote all
Seb is 29, how is that the twilight of his career?!

swisstoni

17,865 posts

285 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
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I don't feel sorry for them at all. Nobody held a gun to their heads to drive the heaps they are in at the moment.
And both, particularly Vettel, are having their credentials reviewed in the light of their recent performances in poorer equipment.

blueg33

37,977 posts

230 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
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Most drivers would do better with better equipment that's life in F1.

I can't see the point of the thread. Plus why single out those two, what about Kimi and JB, both ex world champs.

cgt2

7,139 posts

194 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
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It appears Alonso was right about Ferrari though.

McLaren have actually made significant progress if you look at where they were last year and it's quite possible they may be on a par with or even ahead of Ferrari next year.

The question is whether it will come good in time for Alonso to win again or will Stoffel be the beneficiary of all the development done by two world champions.

HTP99

23,147 posts

146 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
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What did Murray Walker say; "You make your own luck"

LDN

8,974 posts

209 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
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Vettel has the look of a man... who is slowly coming around to a situation, that Alonso outlined when he left Ferrari for McLaren. That being that Ferrari just don't have it in them to make a car capable of the WCC / WDC. And whilst Alonso has been trundling around in the mclaren, what has Vettel achieved at Ferrari? Through no fault of his own... Alonso was right to leave Ferrari and take a risk at joint another team.

Vettel must see Red Bull now becoming the 'second' team after Mercedes and wonder what the hell he could / should do. There'll be no allegiance to Ferrari if they don't come good over the next couple of years; none whatsoever.

davepoth

29,395 posts

205 months

Sunday 31st July 2016
quotequote all
cgt2 said:
It appears Alonso was right about Ferrari though.

McLaren have actually made significant progress if you look at where they were last year and it's quite possible they may be on a par with or even ahead of Ferrari next year.

The question is whether it will come good in time for Alonso to win again or will Stoffel be the beneficiary of all the development done by two world champions.
This. Looking at Hungary, you can see that the chassis is not bad at all.

2017 is going to be a bit of a step change for all the teams, and might allow someone else to steal a march by finding the crucial gap in the regulations that Mercedes did with the split turbo.

Redlake27

2,255 posts

250 months

Monday 1st August 2016
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Alonso's patience may pay off - as stated earlier in thread, they have the potential to pass Ferrari.

Ferrari will come good. It is just how long it will take to turn around the supertanker. It could be like 1996-2000 again.

The problem for Seb is that there is nowhere to go. He has to stick at it.


Smollet

11,414 posts

196 months

Monday 1st August 2016
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F1 history is full of drivers who warrant better cars so there's nothing new here. I wonder how long the OP has been a follower of the sport and Vettel is in the twilight of his career? He's younger than Hamilton. rofl

aeropilot

36,221 posts

233 months

Monday 1st August 2016
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LDN said:
Vettel has the look of a man... who is slowly coming around to a situation, that Alonso outlined when he left Ferrari for McLaren. That being that Ferrari just don't have it in them to make a car capable of the WCC / WDC. And whilst Alonso has been trundling around in the mclaren, what has Vettel achieved at Ferrari? Through no fault of his own... Alonso was right to leave Ferrari and take a risk at joint another team.

Vettel must see Red Bull now becoming the 'second' team after Mercedes and wonder what the hell he could / should do. There'll be no allegiance to Ferrari if they don't come good over the next couple of years; none whatsoever.
The problem with Ferrari is as ever, the politics of the Team. They bizarrely let Costa go a few years back, and now Allison has gone, it would seam over similar in-team political issues. I don't think Vettel is a happy bunny there at the moment.
Ferrari aren't going to come good any time soon. It took the hard headed brilliant arrogance of Todt/Brawn/Schumacher to drag them out of a 20 year wasteland.....and they are gone and they have reverted to type and I don't see Ferrari challenging for a WDC/WCC anytime soon, or anytime in the future.



cgt2

7,139 posts

194 months

Monday 1st August 2016
quotequote all
aeropilot said:
It took the hard headed brilliant arrogance of Todt/Brawn/Schumacher to drag them out of a 20 year wasteland.....and they are gone and they have reverted to type and I don't see Ferrari challenging for a WDC/WCC anytime soon, or anytime in the future.
The key aspect was how Jean Todt completely insulated the team from any outside influence, so they were never affected by the usual Ferrari politics.

With Marchionne it is the complete opposite.

Smollet

11,414 posts

196 months

Monday 1st August 2016
quotequote all
cgt2 said:
The key aspect was how Jean Todt completely insulated the team from any outside influence, so they were never affected by the usual Ferrari politics.

With Marchionne it is the complete opposite.
Having an Italian in charge has never worked well for Ferrari. Too much Lambrusco and linguine politics.

aeropilot

36,221 posts

233 months

Monday 1st August 2016
quotequote all
Smollet said:
cgt2 said:
The key aspect was how Jean Todt completely insulated the team from any outside influence, so they were never affected by the usual Ferrari politics.

With Marchionne it is the complete opposite.
Having an Italian in charge has never worked well for Ferrari. Too much Lambrusco and linguine politics.
Even worse when said Italian has no motorsport background. He's treating the F1 team like any other corporate industry division, and we've seen how well that's worked in the past with other teams.

Derek Smith

46,328 posts

254 months

Monday 1st August 2016
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I think McLaren deserve better. Both drivers could have gone elsewhere. Alonso was the master of his own downfall.

But given the glory days of McLaren Honda, Dennis must have been hoping for more.


TheHighlander

1,315 posts

204 months

Monday 1st August 2016
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
I think McLaren deserve better. Both drivers could have gone elsewhere. Alonso was the master of his own downfall.

But given the glory days of McLaren Honda, Dennis must have been hoping for more.
Fully agree with the above.

Better times are coming for McLaren I think aswell.

I also hope Button sticks around, he's good for the sport.

epom

12,205 posts

167 months

Monday 1st August 2016
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Fat contracts helped both make their decisions. I wouldn't feel too sorry for them.

Trevatanus

11,197 posts

156 months

Monday 1st August 2016
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TheHighlander said:


I also hope Button sticks around, he's good for the sport.
I also hope that Button sticks around, sadly I have a feeling that this will be his last year, and not through his choice.

Sam All

3,101 posts

107 months

Monday 1st August 2016
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Massa is past his best, and a seat at Williams for one of these guys would also help.