Caterham F1 2015 car

[ajprice]

They will be allowed to run their 2014 car next year, if they find a buyer.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/30272621

Sneaky gits, they've been openly testing that car for over a year!

[furtive]

Oooh they are allowed to run the worst car on the grid again. That will get the buyers queuing up!

[Jasandjules]

furtive said:

Oooh they are allowed to run the worst car on the grid again. That will get the buyers queuing up!

Well, it would be a lot of advertising for them....

And of course, estate agent speak "room for modernisation".....

[ukaskew]

Silly question maybe, but why did they need special permission, aren't the regs fairly static? Or is there some rule whereby even if the regs are the same, they must retire the cars at the end of the season and build new ones?

[Tc24]

ukaskew said:

Silly question maybe, but why did they need special permission, aren't the regs fairly static? Or is there some rule whereby even if the regs are the same, they must retire the cars at the end of the season and build new ones?

Assume mainly for nose regs, i.e. saves them having to get a new frontal crash structure designed and tested at short notice if the buyer only takes over a month or 2 before the new season.

[Prancing Hippo]

Any rumours on what's happening at Marussia?

[Likes Fast Cars]

There was something posted about an auction of Marussia assets.

[Likes Fast Cars]

furtive said:

Oooh they are allowed to run the worst car on the grid again. That will get the buyers queuing up!

Well somebody has to get the wooden spoon.

[Jasandjules]

Prancing Hippo said:

Any rumours on what's happening at Marussia?

Well I saw Max on the Sky F1 show say that there is some interest and as long as they are not liquidated they are in with a shout of getting to Aus and the points (and money for them).

But as above, have now seen what looks like an Auction of the whole kit, which would make it rather difficult to take a car to Aus?!?

[Agent Orange]

furtive said:

Oooh they are allowed to run the worst car on the grid again. That will get the buyers queuing up!

There were 11 teams on the grid in 2014. With Marussia gone that leaves 10.

According to some (Joe Saward)....

The "top 10" teams in the WCC receive prize money for regularly being in the top 10 (twice over a 3 year period to qualify). With only 10 teams left and others dangling by a thread you'd feel fairly confident finished at least 10th out of 10.

With that will come a payment of $57M. $40M for finishing within top 10 and $17M for 10th place.

Caterham were so keen to make Abu Dhabi with its double points because a point paying finish would've netted them 10th for 2014. Given they also finished 10th in 2012 the $40M payment for being a top 10 team would've been paid.

Haas F1 don't join until 2016 so Caterham have a decent chance of being 10th for 2015 and 2016 and collecting $40M + $17M + $17M = $74M.

Some reports have Caterham F1 being tentatively sold for $35M earlier this year so you'd have to conclude they'd be worth less now.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/motorsport/formul...

Someone, somewhere will considered this a bargain route into the F1 circle. They likely won't care about the results but it'll buy them a place on the grid amongst the other billionaires only for it to be sold at end of 2016.

[TheArchitect]

Jasandjules said:

Prancing Hippo said:

Any rumours on what's happening at Marussia?

Well I saw Max on the Sky F1 show say that there is some interest and as long as they are not liquidated they are in with a shout of getting to Aus and the points (and money for them).

But as above, have now seen what looks like an Auction of the whole kit, which would make it rather difficult to take a car to Aus?!?

Looks like it's all going for auction around the 16/17th December reading some other threads.

[groomi]

ukaskew said:

Silly question maybe, but why did they need special permission, aren't the regs fairly static? Or is there some rule whereby even if the regs are the same, they must retire the cars at the end of the season and build new ones?

I believe it's mostly due to the engine. The 2015 Renault engine is quite significantly different in terms of installation packaging and won't fit in the 2014 chassis without significant (ie. Expensive) alteration. Under the rules no engine manufacturer is allowed to have more than one engine spec homologated, so they needed unaminous agreement to rUN the 2014 engine.

[andyps]

Agent Orange said:

There were 11 teams on the grid in 2014. With Marussia gone that leaves 10.

According to some (Joe Saward)....

The "top 10" teams in the WCC receive prize money for regularly being in the top 10 (twice over a 3 year period to qualify). With only 10 teams left and others dangling by a thread you'd feel fairly confident finished at least 10th out of 10.

With that will come a payment of $57M. $40M for finishing within top 10 and $17M for 10th place.

Caterham were so keen to make Abu Dhabi with its double points because a point paying finish would've netted them 10th for 2014. Given they also finished 10th in 2012 the $40M payment for being a top 10 team would've been paid.

Haas F1 don't join until 2016 so Caterham have a decent chance of being 10th for 2015 and 2016 and collecting $40M + $17M + $17M = $74M.

Some reports have Caterham F1 being tentatively sold for $35M earlier this year so you'd have to conclude they'd be worth less now.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/motorsport/formul...

Someone, somewhere will considered this a bargain route into the F1 circle. They likely won't care about the results but it'll buy them a place on the grid amongst the other billionaires only for it to be sold at end of 2016.

At the Abu Dhabi race the Caterham administrator said he was trying to establish if they would be entitled to the money for finishing 10th in the championship if Marussia did not return as he wasn't certain. So it seems that despite all the terms being in the Concorde agreement it is not clear on this situation. The outcome of that must make a very large impact on the value of Caterham and I can't see anyone buying the team until Bernie clarifies what money they will, or won't, get.

[Redlake27]

groomi said:

ukaskew said:

Silly question maybe, but why did they need special permission, aren't the regs fairly static? Or is there some rule whereby even if the regs are the same, they must retire the cars at the end of the season and build new ones?

I believe it's mostly due to the engine. The 2015 Renault engine is quite significantly different in terms of installation packaging and won't fit in the 2014 chassis without significant (ie. Expensive) alteration. Under the rules no engine manufacturer is allowed to have more than one engine spec homologated, so they needed unaminous agreement to rUN the 2014 engine.

Indeed. The nose regulations are changing too (thankfully) but that should be an easy fix. In the past, apart from the years with major regulation changes, it was quite common to see recycling of cars.

Among top teams, the McLaren MP4/17D was a car in its fourth 'facelift' and second season, and Williams stretched out the dominant FW11 for a couple of years too (although not as long as some of the best 70s cars such as the McLaren M23 and Lotus 72 which lasted half a decade!)

[Agent Orange]

andyps said:

At the Abu Dhabi race the Caterham administrator said he was trying to establish if they would be entitled to the money for finishing 10th in the championship if Marussia did not return as he wasn't certain. So it seems that despite all the terms being in the Concorde agreement it is not clear on this situation. The outcome of that must make a very large impact on the value of Caterham and I can't see anyone buying the team until Bernie clarifies what money they will, or won't, get.

No one outside of FOM really knows and I wouldn't pretend to but I wouldn't be surprised if the payment to Caterham for being a top 10 team depended on them at least equaling Marussia's points.

Wouldn't surprise me if when Finbarr O'Connell asked Bernie if Caterham F1 would receive the money for finishing 10th in 2012 and then 10th in 2014 if Marussia pulled out Bernie told him - "Well your 11th with 0 points compared to Marussia's 2. Your being beaten by a team that no longer exists. Score more than 2 points in Abu Dhabi and then we can talk."

I see Caterham F1 as a cheap ticket to a very exclusive club/party for someone. Hopefully they'll be renamed to remove the brand damage to Caterham cars but I bet we'll be back here and looking for new owners for the 2017 season.

[andyps]

I think the suggestion was that if Marussia don't exist at the end of the season their 2 points don't count and they effectively are not in the championship. That in turn means that Caterham finish 10th and get some money. But it does depend on whether the Concorde agreement actually covers the eventuality or, if not, Bernie's chosen interpretation.

[Likes Fast Cars]

I saw an interview with Finbarr O'C at the last race and he said words to the effect that they had their lawyers looking at the agreements and the rules to see what their position is (or should be). If Caterham benefit from Marussia no longer being around / eligible for any prize money, I would imagine Marussia's receivers and lawyers would have something to say about it. It could set a precedent.

[andyps]

Agree about the implication for Marussia and their administrators but if they had scored a couple of points at the first race and then gone out of business after a couple more races they would be long gone by the end of the season so the same money would become irrelevant.

[Cyder]

Prancing Hippo said:

Any rumours on what's happening at Marussia?

Met a friend who worked for Marussia over the weekend. He seemed 100% convinced that it's gameover for the team reinforced by the auction. Seems like quite the sorry state of affairs.

[Henry Fiddleton]

O/T:

Why don't ALL teams get a slice of the pie? The top 10 only makes no sense.

No wonder HRT, Manor and Caterham went under..