Official 2024 Austrian Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS***
Poll: Official 2024 Austrian Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS***
Total Members Polled: 146
Discussion
Forester1965 said:
You have to leave a car's width. Doesn't matter whether it's your steering input or the track changing direction, you have to leave the width. Verstappen didn't.
The time based penalties for this don't really work because they can be draconian (a safety car towards the end could effectively put you last) or meaningless, as we had yesterday when Verstappen was >10 seconds in front of the next car. An available penalty should be a fixed 'x' number of places dropped from the finishing position if the result of the offence serious enough.
I thought it was serious enough to have a think about a DSQ. That would have been a worthy punishment for the impact it had on Norris and the race as a whole.The time based penalties for this don't really work because they can be draconian (a safety car towards the end could effectively put you last) or meaningless, as we had yesterday when Verstappen was >10 seconds in front of the next car. An available penalty should be a fixed 'x' number of places dropped from the finishing position if the result of the offence serious enough.
Biggles Flies Undone said:
I thought it was serious enough to have a think about a DSQ. That would have been a worthy punishment for the impact it had on Norris and the race as a whole.
Schumacher and Villeneuve collide at Jerez. Villeneuve went on to win the race.Schumacher was DQ'd from the 1997 season for "causing a collision".
Hamilton punts Max into the wall at Silverstone, ending Max's race. (50G impact apparently)
Hamilton receives a 5 second penalty for "causing a collision".
FIA seems perfectly consistent
Bo_apex said:
Biggles Flies Undone said:
I thought it was serious enough to have a think about a DSQ. That would have been a worthy punishment for the impact it had on Norris and the race as a whole.
Schumacher and Villeneuve collide at Jerez. Villeneuve went on to win the race.Schumacher was DQ'd from the 1997 season for "causing a collision".
Hamilton punts Max into the wall at Silverstone, ending Max's race. (50G impact apparently)
Hamilton receives a 5 second penalty for "causing a collision".
FIA seems perfectly consistent
Adrian W said:
Bo_apex said:
Biggles Flies Undone said:
I thought it was serious enough to have a think about a DSQ. That would have been a worthy punishment for the impact it had on Norris and the race as a whole.
Schumacher and Villeneuve collide at Jerez. Villeneuve went on to win the race.Schumacher was DQ'd from the 1997 season for "causing a collision".
Hamilton punts Max into the wall at Silverstone, ending Max's race. (50G impact apparently)
Hamilton receives a 5 second penalty for "causing a collision".
FIA seems perfectly consistent
Brilliant
Bo_apex said:
Adrian W said:
Bo_apex said:
Biggles Flies Undone said:
I thought it was serious enough to have a think about a DSQ. That would have been a worthy punishment for the impact it had on Norris and the race as a whole.
Schumacher and Villeneuve collide at Jerez. Villeneuve went on to win the race.Schumacher was DQ'd from the 1997 season for "causing a collision".
Hamilton punts Max into the wall at Silverstone, ending Max's race. (50G impact apparently)
Hamilton receives a 5 second penalty for "causing a collision".
FIA seems perfectly consistent
Brilliant
Forester1965 said:
Verstappen does what he does because it makes drivers think twice about trying to pass him. If they're uncertain, they're less likely to try and when they do it's more likely to be half hearted. Most other drivers treat Verstappen like the back of an angry donkey. Those that don't often end up retiring from the race (Monza '21 and this race being examples).
In both cases Max won by doing it.
He won't modify his approach until it costs him or likely to cost him a championship.
Personally I think he needs a race ban or two but in these business-first days I think it's very unlikely.
Exactly, he's doing it because he can. I started out in this thread by saying I wasn't interested in Max bashing, because I'm really not. He is the way he is - hot headed and with very little application of the rules, there is no reason for him to try and reign in that aspect of himself.In both cases Max won by doing it.
He won't modify his approach until it costs him or likely to cost him a championship.
Personally I think he needs a race ban or two but in these business-first days I think it's very unlikely.
If he moves under braking once there should be a warning, the following time he does it, instant drive through penalty. That would stop him doing it no matter how angry he might be... And if it doesn't stop him, it'll at least safely get him out of the way of the car trying to pass him.
Sadly the truth is the FIA know full well they could tighten up and simplify rule application, but they choose to leave rule application quite vague as it allows them the maximum ability to manipulate the race/season for the sake of the show. And Max himself is a big part of that show, so I too find it hard to believe there is much chance of him being prevented frim doing these things. Maybe if someone dies they'll have a rethink...
Derek Smith said:
rscott said:
It was damaged on a kerb when he went off-circuit it seems, so self-inflicted.My take on it...
Exceptionally poor stewarding, as there has been for years in F1.
Lando was taking the piss with track limits and Max with moving in the barking zone.
Lando was a sure fire five second penalty, that should have been given ASAP. To be fair, Max's engineer should have made it quite clear he was going to get a penalty so as long as he didn't get up the road by five seconds he was fine to let him past.
But then Max should also have been given warnings about his moving under braking and been given a time penalty as well. I'd have also given him a penalty for driving Lando off the track once the initial crash had happened on the following straight.
To be honest, as the pinnacle of motorsports I feel there should be more use made of the black flag.
I've seen other post race interviews and Max sounded rather more contrite than he did on his radio-I suspect he knows he was in the wrong and got away with extending his championship lead FOC.
The daft thing is, he's a big boy now and actually way more comfortable in himself in front of camera. I'm more disappointed he didn't say to Lando after the race "come on we'll look at the replay together and give our own sides of it to the viewers". Could have been TV gold!
People forget Lando wasn't exactly guilt free last time out when he pushed Max onto the grass at the start-and we didn't get Max crying about it and saying he wasn't going to be friends with Lando if he didn't apologise.
Imagine the uproar if he did!
Exceptionally poor stewarding, as there has been for years in F1.
Lando was taking the piss with track limits and Max with moving in the barking zone.
Lando was a sure fire five second penalty, that should have been given ASAP. To be fair, Max's engineer should have made it quite clear he was going to get a penalty so as long as he didn't get up the road by five seconds he was fine to let him past.
But then Max should also have been given warnings about his moving under braking and been given a time penalty as well. I'd have also given him a penalty for driving Lando off the track once the initial crash had happened on the following straight.
To be honest, as the pinnacle of motorsports I feel there should be more use made of the black flag.
I've seen other post race interviews and Max sounded rather more contrite than he did on his radio-I suspect he knows he was in the wrong and got away with extending his championship lead FOC.
The daft thing is, he's a big boy now and actually way more comfortable in himself in front of camera. I'm more disappointed he didn't say to Lando after the race "come on we'll look at the replay together and give our own sides of it to the viewers". Could have been TV gold!
People forget Lando wasn't exactly guilt free last time out when he pushed Max onto the grass at the start-and we didn't get Max crying about it and saying he wasn't going to be friends with Lando if he didn't apologise.
Imagine the uproar if he did!
suffolk009 said:
Has nobody on here mentioned the 2 points the Stewarts have apparently slapped on Verstappen's license?
Admittedly, I've not read the whole thread.
The licence points thing is bAdmittedly, I've not read the whole thread.
ks, if applied correctly Magnussen would already have a ban, no one will be getting a ban due to licence points, the Stewarts (sic) don't want to give a race ban to anyone. Interesting footage from a previous year with roles reversed and no penalty: https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.r...
Forester1965 said:
You have to leave a car's width. Doesn't matter whether it's your steering input or the track changing direction, you have to leave the width. Verstappen didn't.
Agreed, but that is different to moving under braking. Initially it seemed to me that Max was clearly moving under braking, but now I am not sure anymore. In any case he did not leave a car´s width to the white line, so that´t that.P.s. A car´s width at turn four seemed to include at least part of the kerb...
Hungrymc said:
Derek Smith said:
I thought both were the T1 incident with Sainz ? He certainly bounced across the sausage type kerb there.Biggles Flies Undone said:
Bo_apex said:
Adrian W said:
Bo_apex said:
Biggles Flies Undone said:
I thought it was serious enough to have a think about a DSQ. That would have been a worthy punishment for the impact it had on Norris and the race as a whole.
Schumacher and Villeneuve collide at Jerez. Villeneuve went on to win the race.Schumacher was DQ'd from the 1997 season for "causing a collision".
Hamilton punts Max into the wall at Silverstone, ending Max's race. (50G impact apparently)
Hamilton receives a 5 second penalty for "causing a collision".
FIA seems perfectly consistent
Brilliant
Same old max
Remember when he brake checked Lewis
HTP99 said:
suffolk009 said:
Has nobody on here mentioned the 2 points the Stewarts have apparently slapped on Verstappen's license?
Admittedly, I've not read the whole thread.
The licence points thing is bAdmittedly, I've not read the whole thread.
ks, if applied correctly Magnussen would already have a ban, no one will be getting a ban due to licence points, the Stewarts (sic) don't want to give a race ban to anyone. Adrian W said:
Bo_apex said:
Biggles Flies Undone said:
I thought it was serious enough to have a think about a DSQ. That would have been a worthy punishment for the impact it had on Norris and the race as a whole.
Schumacher and Villeneuve collide at Jerez. Villeneuve went on to win the race.Schumacher was DQ'd from the 1997 season for "causing a collision".
Hamilton punts Max into the wall at Silverstone, ending Max's race. (50G impact apparently)
Hamilton receives a 5 second penalty for "causing a collision".
FIA seems perfectly consistent
suffolk009 said:
Has nobody on here mentioned the 2 points the Stewarts have apparently slapped on Verstappen's license?
Admittedly, I've not read the whole thread.
Completely pointless penalty and just lip service the stewards are a joke.Admittedly, I've not read the whole thread.
Hulk got the same penalty yet....
He didn't hit his competitor
He didn't wreck his competitors race
He didn't force his competitor to retire
He didn't finish in the points.
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