Need help tackling rusted bolts!

[That NISMO Life]

Hey Guys,

Simple tasks like removing the front bumper are turning into unnecessary large ones.

I am new to the whole project car thing however it is a real passion of mine so i bought an MX-5 (mk1) to try and do up to take to the track and get some experience.

I have a small tool collection at the moment as i live with a family of girls and my dad who has all the tools lives abroad so i am starting literally from the bottom with not much money but that isnt going to stop me!

The problem i am facing is rusted bolts. I have had some bolt heads sheer off and another one that just kept spinning as i turned it.

How can i go about removing these?

I dont mind investing in some tools as i will undoubtedly use them again but being a newbie im kind of stuck.

Any help help and advise would be much appreciated

Thanks!

[DonkeyApple]

Start with a release agent and if that doesn't work then borrow the wife's kitchen blow torch.

[budfox]

That NISMO Life said:

Hey Guys,

I have a small tool

Thanks!

Join the club.

[mikeveal]

In ascending order of desperation:

Plusgas as a release agent, keep re-applying & leaving to soak. If four or five applications over 24hrs doesn't loosen it, its not going to go.

Then molegrips on the back if the back is spinning.

Then blowtorch if the bolt isn't near plastic.

Then hacksaw / angle grinder / dremel to remove the bold head.

If you have a sheared stud / bolt in metal work, drill the centre of the bolt, then find a suitably sized chisel. Remove the handle and tap the squared end of the chisel into the drilled hole. Apply a spanner to the chisel and wind out the stud. Far less prone to snapping than an easyout.

[Mattlan]

You are doomed!
wait until you get to the two captive bolts up in the front of the wing area that secure from the bumper through a flange and the wing.

I guarantee that the bottom one of these will be so rusted you will not be able to see where the bolt ends and the nut begins also they are massively over long for the job they do, couple that with the most awkward access ever, and they are just a joy to free off!!

Best of luck, always remember that however frustrating it gets, the car will repay you in fun many times over!

[That NISMO Life]

I definitely will be getting some plusgas ive heard a lot about that now

And as for the broken bolts that are too far gone, i will need to try the drilling method i think. i cant get to the back of the thread and there is no thread sticking out to grip too.

Fingers crossed i can actually get to the bit to drill into it. Its under the front bumper so will need to jack her up and lay down and hope the force doesnt break the bumper!

Thanks for your tips

[Mattlan]

the four bolts under the front of the bumper are secured on the back by "clip nuts" to the plastic air flow frame. Completely inaccessible by human hands, so if they shear its a blessing and you can replace both bolt and fastening once the bumper is removed. Be careful you don't twist the plastic tang of the bumper too much and rip it.

If you mean the bolts to the trailing edge underneath the bumper holding on the bars that frame the bumper out, then don't try to undo at the bumper side as they are always seized solid. Go to the other end where the bar is secured by a captive bolt dropping from the chassis rail, soak this for days first as if you shear this one it's a complete ball ache as it holds quite a lot together

Remove the bumper with both support bars still attached, the bars are very soft / rotten and will misshape the minute you put any torque to the nut at the end.

[Mattlan]

if the spinner is one under the front of the bumper get in with a junior hacksaw between the bumper and air frame and saw it through.

[mat205125]

Drown everything in WD40, and return to the job 24 hours later.

Take your time and persevere, however plan to replace all the fixings (there's good advice from people with a lot more experience than I by the looks of things)

Ultimately, decide what you want from the car ..... it sounds like you've bought it as a cost effective track / fun tool. Let that thought weigh up in your mind whether you will need or want to have a pristine factory refit, or something more "agricultural" and functional, e.g. bonnet pins for when you'll inevitably want to remove and refit again in the future.

[CrutyRammers]

Annoying though this is, consider it an essential part of your home mechanicking apprenticeship.
As above, plusgas(or similar) - spray it and give it a couple of firm smacks with a metal hammer which can help crack the rust off.
Then mole grips.
Then drillling or sawing/grinding/dremel.

[996TT02]

That NISMO Life said:

I definitely will be getting some plusgas ive heard a lot about that now

Unfortunately that won't work. Not even if you applied it a thousand times and let it soak a thousand years. Nor will any other lubricant, however well it penetrates.

Until the bolt is turning, at which point anything will work, even water, but the main issue is getting the bolt turning.

The thing that is not understood by many is that rust creates a mechanical lock between the surfaces. Rust also occupies more space than the metal that it was produced from, so there is also extremely high pressure between the parts.

Oil, penetrating fluid, whatever, is 100% harmless to rust.

Only use penetrating oil products after you have cracked the bolt, to help keep it turning. More suitable is an oil spray however.

I have used this before, to free rusted bolts, it helps a lot in many cases (but is no silver bullet):

https://eshop.wuerth.de/Rust-remover-Rost-Off-Blue...

This also looks promising, but I never tried it:

https://eshop.wuerth.de/Rust-remover-BOLTEX-PENTOI...

Other than that it's heat, brute force, nut splitter (if usable), and dealing with the consequences when everything fails.

One thing I'd do, if you have accessible bare threads use a small wire brush to clean them up very very well as even if you crack the bolt, it is very likely that it will seize again and more permanently once the far more rusty threads attempt to go through the nut.

Also, once the bolt is moving, you may need to cycle it out and back in slightly again several times, don't just attempt to speed it out.

[PositronicRay]

mat205125 said:

Drown everything in WD40, and return to the job 24 hours later.

.

WD 40 isn't the right stuff for the job.

Plus-Gas is good, I've been using a Wilko own brand "Liquid Wrench" give it time to work. It certainly helped getting out a rounded off disc location screw.

I resorted to a nut splitter for the ARB fasteners a while ago, the nuts were corroded and just rounded off as soon as I touched them.

[B'stard Child]

mat205125 said:

Drown everything in WD40, and return to the job 24 hours later.

WD40 isn't a very good penetrating oil - it's better suited to moisture dispersal - It is however better than nothing at all

On long bolts where the threads are all kippered and where there is no plastic in contact heat does a better job than any penetrating oil - sometimes with longer fixings I've used a grinding disc on an angle grinder to get rid of the excess thread - it has the additional advantage of putting heat into the thread and bolt if you grind the thread back - using a cutting disc to cut of the excess thread doesn't put as much heat into the bolt/nut.

I always nick the other half's Butane burner from the kitchen cupboard (the creme brule topper maker I think she bought it for) - the gas canisters leak over time I tell her that's why it always needs a new one when she wants to use it (not very often)

Appreciate that access on cars is sometimes very awkward but normally if you can get your hand to it you can apply some heat somehow and heat really does do the best job.

[DanielJames]

Blow torch and plus gas. I use a cheapo £20 Blow Torch from B&Q, one of the best things I've ever bought when working on my old Honda.

Ignore those who say to douse it in WD every night for a week.

[Mattlan]

here you go, the offending articles, as you can see it's plastic air frame to plastic bumper so heat is useless



the open face of the frame faces the front of the car , ie the bumper so access is impossible without removing the bumper , which can't be done without removing the bolts!!



the offending "clip bolt", as you can see from this one, it sheared !!

[MDMetal]

Mattlan said:

here you go, the offending articles, as you can see it's plastic air frame to plastic bumper so heat is useless



the open face of the frame faces the front of the car , ie the bumper so access is impossible without removing the bumper , which can't be done without removing the bolts!!



the offending "clip bolt", as you can see from this one, it sheared !!

You've perfectly focused the camera on the wooden flooring beautifully, it really looks gorgeous! Not so sure about the blurry metal clip tho bit distracting from your floor!

[Mattlan]

know , I tried three or four times but it was pi**ing it down at the time!!

[over_the_hill]

Just a note on WD40 - They also do a penetrating fluid as well as the usual lubricant stuff

http://wd40specialist.com/products/penetrating-oil...

[MDMetal]

over_the_hill said:

Just a note on WD40 - They also do a penetrating fluid as well as the usual lubricant stuff

http://wd40specialist.com/products/penetrating-oil...

I've used this a few times not sure if it helped or not but at the end the bolt was off un-sheared. Used this weekend on my calliper bolts when I was changing discs

[SwanJack]

Halfords do something similar to the wuerth product mentioned earlier, called 'shock and release', I found it works quite well