Need advice on brake pipe flaring

[TroubledSoul]

It looks very much like I am going to have to cut off the nuts on the hard lines on the rear of my M3 Evo. I've found that they just cannot be undone and the one I really had a go at with molegrips (flare nut spanner just slipped and slipped) has pretty much disintegrated.

I've seen all of these on the Machine Mart site and wondered which would be best for putting a flare on the pipe after I cut it?

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details...

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details...

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details...

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details...

I haven't had to do this before and don't know which would be best to use? I just need to find out where to get the nuts to put on the lines now so that's my next stop on Google!

[shalmaneser]

I've got the first one and it's done the job for me perfectly using copper lines.... Quite a satisfying tool to use, really although it takes a bit of skill to do a nice flare, get practicing first!

If the M3 comes as standard with steel lines it might be harder to flare them, I've not tried that.

[lostkiwi]

First three are essentially the same thing (all work on the same principle).I've used them on copper with no problems but on steel its hard work and if the pipe is corroded you'll probably end up splitting the pipe.
If the nuts and fittings are bad replace the lot with conifer and new fittings.

[TroubledSoul]

Well the one I tackled is copper, it got caught a bit with the wire brush on the drill and has shone up brightly. I have to assume the other side is also copper.

Can all of those kits be used with the pipe in situ?

[V8forweekends]

As poster above says, OEM steel lines (most are) need more robust kit. I have a flaring tool like the ones in your first three links and have made numerous brake pipes using copper (kunifer actually) tubing. When I needed to put a flare in a piece of steel tube it did actually manage it, but at the expense of the little mandrel thing which snapped. I got a replacement inexpensively, but you're going to be needing a different type for steel pipes.

Something like this which is what I wish I'd bought -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-SAE-Hand-Held-Flari...

[TroubledSoul]

The alternative of course, is to replace the hard lines while it's up on stands and the tank is pretty much empty. It would be a reall ball ache of a job, but the pipes themselves are only showing as a tenner each....

[tr7v8]

I have one of the first three & the last one. The last one is easier to use, especially in a confined space. And rip & replace, a roll of copper & the brass unions are peanuts & it makes it so much easier.

[V8forweekends]

TroubledSoul said:

Can all of those kits be used with the pipe in situ?

Yes - I have done it - not as easy as off, but usually possible.

[TroubledSoul]

V8forweekends said:

As poster above says, OEN steel lines (most are) need more robust kit. I have a flaring tool like the ones in your first three links and have made numerous brake pipes using copper (kunifer actually) tubing. When I needed to put a flare in a piece of steel tube it did actually manage it, but at the expense of the little mandrel thing which snapped. I got a replacement inexpensively, but you're going to be needing a different type for steel pipes.

Something like this which is what I wish I'd bought -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-SAE-Hand-Held-Flari...

That looks a nice piece of kit.

Would be very odd if I found one side to be copper but the other steel, but it could have been replaced on one side at some point.

[V8forweekends]

TroubledSoul said:

V8forweekends said:

As poster above says, OEN steel lines (most are) need more robust kit. I have a flaring tool like the ones in your first three links and have made numerous brake pipes using copper (kunifer actually) tubing. When I needed to put a flare in a piece of steel tube it did actually manage it, but at the expense of the little mandrel thing which snapped. I got a replacement inexpensively, but you're going to be needing a different type for steel pipes.

Something like this which is what I wish I'd bought -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-SAE-Hand-Held-Flari...

That looks a nice piece of kit.

Would be very odd if I found one side to be copper but the other steel, but it could have been replaced on one side at some point.

I should add that I'm working on old imperial fitting cars - it looks like you need an extra part for tool I linked to for DIN fittings - which I suspect a BM would have.

[TooMany2cvs]

lostkiwi said:

replace the lot with conifer

<chuckle>
He means kunifer - cupro-nickel pipe - not a bit off a passing pine tree...

Plain copper is out there, but you don't want it - it work-hardens in a way that cupro-nickel doesn't.

I've got that last one - https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details... - haven't tried the other style, but that works well enough. Don't bother paying extra for the pipe cutter doofer - the one I've got might be blunt, but I found it impossible to use without flattening the ends of the pipe over. I just use an angle grinder against a piece of wood to snip the pipe quickly and easily.

Whatever you do, PRACTICE FIRST. Get the hang on short pieces on the bench before you go near the car.

[TroubledSoul]

OK

Where's the best place to buy the union nuts? I see GSF have them but they are 95p each. I'd bet they can be bought at a better rate than that.

I'm going to have to check if the other side is also a copper line. If it is, I think cutting the unions off and re-flaring/adding new ones will be the easiest path forward.

[TooMany2cvs]

TroubledSoul said:

Where's the best place to buy the union nuts? I see GSF have them but they are 95p each. I'd bet they can be bought at a better rate than that.

There's umpteen sellers on eBay doing a roll of pipe plus a bag of 10 or 20 unions. The pipe's the same size for metric and imperial, but you'll obviously want metric unions.

[geeks]

V8forweekends said:

Something like this which is what I wish I'd bought -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-SAE-Hand-Held-Flari...

I have this one, it is far and above so much easier to work with that the the others you have suggested, I did have one of those and after fiddling around trying several times gave up and bought the alternative and wish i had from the start!

Practice, practice, practice is the key.. I have a pipe cutter from Wickes that does the job perfectly.

Unions and fixings were all from a local one man and his shop type outfit, cheaper and more friendly that GSF for me.

[TroubledSoul]

I think the Draper tool is probably the one to go for. More money than some of the other options but it looks decent and sounds like it's very easy to use in situ.

The other option is to buy the rear lines pre made in Kunifer. Someone on M3 Cutters said he got some from eBay for £28 all in. It does involve dropping the tank though and I have to weigh up whether it's worth it when I already have copper lines.

[imagineifyeswill]

Any of these tools will do for copper pipe although the draper is definately the best. Brake pipe unions are around £7.50 for a pack of 50 from any decent motor factor, Euro Car Parts for instance.

[tr7v8]

Don't use steel unions especially if you're keeping the car brass ones are much better & better engineering if used with copper pipe.