Quick question about soldering.
Discussion
I have done many many repairs and loom modifications by soldering joints, never ever had a problem. I have seen some really bad jobs though using solder, either by using bad quality solder or just dont have the technique.
I have tried to find nice small 'butt splices' for joining wires but most are too cumbersome to be hidden neatly away in a wiring loom. I also prefer to use adhesive heatshrink on my joints to help with water proofing and oxidising.
Trouble with most modern solders is the lack of lead as that used to give a little flexibility on thinner parts of the joint.
Bigger wires like battery, charging, heavy load items and earth leads should never be soldered, there are plenty of crimps around ideal for these.
I have tried to find nice small 'butt splices' for joining wires but most are too cumbersome to be hidden neatly away in a wiring loom. I also prefer to use adhesive heatshrink on my joints to help with water proofing and oxidising.
Trouble with most modern solders is the lack of lead as that used to give a little flexibility on thinner parts of the joint.
Bigger wires like battery, charging, heavy load items and earth leads should never be soldered, there are plenty of crimps around ideal for these.
buzzer said:
fluffnik said:
Yes.
... however crimping will provide a better connection both electrically and mechanically.
I hear this said... but find it hard to believe. any idea why? I would have thought a pair of wires twisted together and soldered was the best joint?... however crimping will provide a better connection both electrically and mechanically.
Uninsulated crimps and heatshrink sleeving are the way forward.
I keep being told this, but have never had a soldered joint fail, yet crimps constantly fail.
Granted I don't own a really high quality crimper which probably doesn't help, but heatshrink over a soldered joint is so much tidier, and if you're making multiple solders on the same loom if you stagger the positions there's no stress in the same position.
Granted I don't own a really high quality crimper which probably doesn't help, but heatshrink over a soldered joint is so much tidier, and if you're making multiple solders on the same loom if you stagger the positions there's no stress in the same position.
ch427 said:
cant see how crimping is superior to solder myself,
Crimping is a form of cold welding, you get inter-molecular bonding at the junction which gives the lowest possible resistance. You also don't get solder wicking and the subsequent loss of flexibility of the wire either side of the junction which is important in applications exposed to movement and vibration.On any kind of mission critical system (automotive, trains, space flight etc.) cables will nearly always be terminated by crimp connectors for their superior reliability (if crimped correctly!).
Richyvrlimited said:
I keep being told this, but have never had a soldered joint fail, yet crimps constantly fail.
Granted I don't own a really high quality crimper
That's like saying my soldered joints keep failing so crimps must be better, though I do use an iron set to the wrong temperature and/or an unsuitable solder alloy.Granted I don't own a really high quality crimper
Soldered joints can be fine in the correct environment, and if the cable is adequately supported either side of the joint (so that the solder wicked part of the cable isn't moved) it can even survive ok with some cable movement. However, it's still not electrically as good as a crimp, and it is a longer process, especially on large high current cables.
Edited by Mr2Mike on Friday 7th June 08:45
I have to say, I hear both sides of this argument and would always fall on the side of solder & heat shrink for a few reasons.
Solder joints are alleged to suffer corrosion due to the acids in the flux, i have never come across this, but like others have come across many failed crimp connections.
When you solder a joint correctly you can see that it is correct instantly, in a crimped connection you cannot.
When an aftermarket alarm/imobiliser is fitted all connections must be soldered or the certification will not be valid. (someone in the industry has stated this for a reason & they probably know much more than me)
Just my 2p worth.
Solder joints are alleged to suffer corrosion due to the acids in the flux, i have never come across this, but like others have come across many failed crimp connections.
When you solder a joint correctly you can see that it is correct instantly, in a crimped connection you cannot.
When an aftermarket alarm/imobiliser is fitted all connections must be soldered or the certification will not be valid. (someone in the industry has stated this for a reason & they probably know much more than me)
Just my 2p worth.
Mr2Mike said:
Have a look inside an equipment cabinet on the side of a railway track if you get the chance. They gets pounded by vibration from trains all day, yet have to be utterly reliable and remain in service for a very long time. You will find every cable is terminated by a crimp connector.
Add to that; look at the connectors in your car, they'll be crimped. Take a look at those nice, shiny MilSpec motorsport connectors - all crimped. Connectors in airplanes, tanks, ships yada yada - crimped.Proper crimping tool and connectors is the key; if you're getting crimping failures then it's only down to poor quality tools or connectors.
GnuBee said:
Add to that; look at the connectors in your car, they'll be crimped. Take a look at those nice, shiny MilSpec motorsport connectors - all crimped. Connectors in airplanes, tanks, ships yada yada - crimped.
Proper crimping tool and connectors is the key; if you're getting crimping failures then it's only down to poor quality tools or connectors.
You talk about using poor quality crimping tools, I am refering to manufacturers crimped connectors.Proper crimping tool and connectors is the key; if you're getting crimping failures then it's only down to poor quality tools or connectors.
You say about connectors in planes etc. I think you will find they are actually soldered plugs by preference.
The military also use soldered plugs or direct soldered connections by preference.
vrooom said:
I am going to solder new extension wires onto existing wires somewhere on my engine, it's about 10 inch away from fuel rail and is disconnected. so there is little petrol fumes about.
Can I solder safetly as my solder dont create sparks etc.
What was that you said about a quick question?Can I solder safetly as my solder dont create sparks etc.
There are many opinions about the answer to this question, and I think the answer is to make your own mind up on what is best for your situation as both are potentially good ways of connecting 2 wires together.
Ultimately, the answer to your question is. Yes, it is safe to do.
andyiley said:
You say about connectors in planes etc. I think you will find they are actually soldered plugs by preference.
The military also use soldered plugs or direct soldered connections by preference.
I'm pretty sure you are wrong on both counts, but definitely for aerospace applications which are crimped. A properly formed crimp is superior in every way to a soldered joint. A badly crimped termination is a liability that makes a soldered joint look like the best thing since sliced bread.The military also use soldered plugs or direct soldered connections by preference.
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