Discussion
We have had the ghost, god and UFO threads recently so surely time for one in evolution.
People dismissing the theory of evolution seem to miss the point.
Evolution is not a theory, it is a fact. We observe it every day eg bacteria becoming resistant to antibiotics. There is abundant fossil evidence confirming that most life forms today did not exist in the past and most life forms that have ever existed have gone extinct. We have shown that animals existing today eg humans contain DNA from species that are extinct (Neanderthal / Denisovians). You can see that life forms existing today are related because they have evolved from earlier life forms as they share morphological features (the basic structure of mammals is very similar - ask any vet) and of course you can trace ancestry by looking at DNA.
The theory of evolution may not be correct but that doesn’t mean evolution hasn’t happened or isn’t happening. Just as our current theories about why earthquakes happen or why it rains are independent from the existence of earthquakes and rain.
Small wonder that many religious people get worked up about evolution because it is incompatible with myths about how humans were created in god’s image. Humans can’t be special if our existence is the result of random processes and blind luck eg if the meteorite hadn’t killed off the dinosaurs there would be no humans.
People dismissing the theory of evolution seem to miss the point.
Evolution is not a theory, it is a fact. We observe it every day eg bacteria becoming resistant to antibiotics. There is abundant fossil evidence confirming that most life forms today did not exist in the past and most life forms that have ever existed have gone extinct. We have shown that animals existing today eg humans contain DNA from species that are extinct (Neanderthal / Denisovians). You can see that life forms existing today are related because they have evolved from earlier life forms as they share morphological features (the basic structure of mammals is very similar - ask any vet) and of course you can trace ancestry by looking at DNA.
The theory of evolution may not be correct but that doesn’t mean evolution hasn’t happened or isn’t happening. Just as our current theories about why earthquakes happen or why it rains are independent from the existence of earthquakes and rain.
Small wonder that many religious people get worked up about evolution because it is incompatible with myths about how humans were created in god’s image. Humans can’t be special if our existence is the result of random processes and blind luck eg if the meteorite hadn’t killed off the dinosaurs there would be no humans.
Problem on the other thread is an unwillingness to read and digest fact.
I posted exactly what hypothesis, theory and law mean in scientific terminology and a few posts later someone said they understood it but it's only a hypothesis. Then we have someone opening the thread here saying it's a fact not a theory.
In this conversation, terminology matters.
Evolution is a scientific theory that is accepted by the scientific community as being correct, however it can not and will never be anything other than a theory.
It's been touched upon above, but for anyone struggling:
- We share a common ancestor with monkeys, we didn't evolve from them.
- Theory in pub talk and theory is science are completely different things.
- Evolution has been observed happening.
- Every time a new organism is classified two new 'gaps' appear in the evolutionary record - they're gaps in your understanding if you bring the gaps argument.
- If you don't understand it, don't argue against it until you do. At the point you understand it you won't want to argue against it.
- Since Darwin, a single fossil in the wrong place or time would have proved the TOE false, yet this hasn't happened. It's arguably one of the most studied branches of science because for well over a century the church wanted it dead. TOE has been used to suggest what fossils might be found where and been correct.
This s
t's real, dudes.
I posted exactly what hypothesis, theory and law mean in scientific terminology and a few posts later someone said they understood it but it's only a hypothesis. Then we have someone opening the thread here saying it's a fact not a theory.
In this conversation, terminology matters.
Evolution is a scientific theory that is accepted by the scientific community as being correct, however it can not and will never be anything other than a theory.
It's been touched upon above, but for anyone struggling:
- We share a common ancestor with monkeys, we didn't evolve from them.
- Theory in pub talk and theory is science are completely different things.
- Evolution has been observed happening.
- Every time a new organism is classified two new 'gaps' appear in the evolutionary record - they're gaps in your understanding if you bring the gaps argument.
- If you don't understand it, don't argue against it until you do. At the point you understand it you won't want to argue against it.
- Since Darwin, a single fossil in the wrong place or time would have proved the TOE false, yet this hasn't happened. It's arguably one of the most studied branches of science because for well over a century the church wanted it dead. TOE has been used to suggest what fossils might be found where and been correct.
This s
t's real, dudes. TwigtheWonderkid said:
Eric Mc said:
I don't think God has any issue with evolution.
Much of his fan club on the other hand....One of the cornerstones of the theory of evolution by natural selection is that it is unplanned. I think an omnipotent God might not be happy with that aspect.
Baldchap said:
Problem on the other thread is an unwillingness to read and digest fact.
I posted exactly what hypothesis, theory and law mean in scientific terminology and a few posts later someone said they understood it but it's only a hypothesis. Then we have someone opening the thread here saying it's a fact not a theory.
In this conversation, terminology matters.
- Evolution has been observed happening.
This st's real, dudes.
I didn’t say the theory or evolution was a fact. I said evolution as a process is a fact ie organisms alive today have evolved from extinct organisms. You made the same point above. I posted exactly what hypothesis, theory and law mean in scientific terminology and a few posts later someone said they understood it but it's only a hypothesis. Then we have someone opening the thread here saying it's a fact not a theory.
In this conversation, terminology matters.
- Evolution has been observed happening.
This s
t's real, dudes. Just like the theory of gravity and gravity are different - the former is our best explanation of how and why gravity works but the latter is an observed phenomena and the closest you can get to a “fact” - if you drop an apple it will fall whether out theory of gravity is correct or not. Similarly organisms will keep evolving whether our theory of evolution is correct or not. Even creationists evolve in that their specious arguments change to find new ways to deny the obvious.
Esceptico said:
Baldchap said:
Problem on the other thread is an unwillingness to read and digest fact.
I posted exactly what hypothesis, theory and law mean in scientific terminology and a few posts later someone said they understood it but it's only a hypothesis. Then we have someone opening the thread here saying it's a fact not a theory.
In this conversation, terminology matters.
- Evolution has been observed happening.
This st's real, dudes.
I didn’t say the theory or evolution was a fact. I said evolution as a process is a fact ie organisms alive today have evolved from extinct organisms. You made the same point above. I posted exactly what hypothesis, theory and law mean in scientific terminology and a few posts later someone said they understood it but it's only a hypothesis. Then we have someone opening the thread here saying it's a fact not a theory.
In this conversation, terminology matters.
- Evolution has been observed happening.
This s
t's real, dudes. Just like the theory of gravity and gravity are different - the former is our best explanation of how and why gravity works but the latter is an observed phenomena and the closest you can get to a “fact” - if you drop an apple it will fall whether out theory of gravity is correct or not. Similarly organisms will keep evolving whether our theory of evolution is correct or not. Even creationists evolve in that their specious arguments change to find new ways to deny the obvious.
Humans are increasingly interfering with natural evolution in other species (and maybe in humans too)
Selective breeding in plants and animals that we eat / work / have as pets
Genetic engineering of almost anything that isn’t human (officially, but I’m quite sure human genetic engineering is going on too)
Selective breeding in plants and animals that we eat / work / have as pets
Genetic engineering of almost anything that isn’t human (officially, but I’m quite sure human genetic engineering is going on too)
JPJPJP said:
Humans are increasingly interfering with natural evolution in other species (and maybe in humans too)
Selective breeding in plants and animals that we eat / work / have as pets
Genetic engineering of almost anything that isn’t human (officially, but I’m quite sure human genetic engineering is going on too)
Natural evolution.Selective breeding in plants and animals that we eat / work / have as pets
Genetic engineering of almost anything that isn’t human (officially, but I’m quite sure human genetic engineering is going on too)
What does “natural” mean?
Can you please show me something a chimpanzee does that isn’t natural?
Now, please give me an example of something a human does that isn’t natural.
An astronaut on a spacewalk or a scientist carrying out genetic engineering is as natural as a woodpecker banging its beak against a tree.
What’s the opposite of natural? Synthetic, or supernatural?
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