Has anyone had a 2.5 STi that hasn't crapped itself??

[Godzilla_88]

Hi all!

I was looking to see if there is anyone out there who has had a good experience with the 2.5 unit in the Hawkeye onwards? I bought a Spec D around a year ago and have had a niggling feeling since that it will spill it's guts at any moment! I love the car and appreciate what it can do and don't want to get rid but i'm leaning more towards selling up.

The car I have, had the ringland issue at 22k and was rebuilt under warranty. It's currently at 88k and has no symptoms of HG failure/ringland issues (touch wood!) but it would be nice to know there are some of you out there that haven't experienced any issues with their 2.5 STi's, either standard or modded (mine is bog standard.)

If anyone could give any information on cost of a rebuild from when they have had an issue, it would be much appreciated as i would like to have that buffer there should anything happen.

Cheers for any info you guys can give!

[drumsterphil]

Yes, I have.

I bought my 08 Hatch Sti with 18k on the clock and it hadn't had the revised map and hadn't gone bang; however, within two months I'd had the engine forged as I was looking for more power and my mapper said advised it was certain doom if it didn't get done.

[texaxile]

Not personally, but a close friend has had an STi Hawk for 9 years , it's running a panel filter, std exhaust and std map, he does around 4k pa in it and it's been fine since day one. Although it is a bit of a garage queen, and gets serviced by Subaru every year, he's had no issues at all.

When I had my WRX Hawk I thought about mapping it, the reputation for the engines being a bit chocolate didn't really dissuade me, after reading up on Scoobynet it seemed that a majority of the problems were with the 08's onwards, and tbh while it was not an unknown issue, I think the way Subaru went about dealing with it caused most of the upset (by not openly admitting it). There are many drivers whose mapped 2.5's don't give them problems, but there's also a huge thread on Scoobynet about failures on them, makes interesting reading.

[vxr2010]

The failures should not have happened but in relation to the number of cars it's probably a small number , it was supposed to be 2008 onwards but a friend had a spec d and had what appeared to be similar engine issues not sure if it was ringland failure as never got to the bottom of it could be just ragged and not looked after

[Godzilla_88]

From the reading i've done on Scoobynet it does seem that Subaru just buried their head in the sand and refused to accept that their engines weren't as strong as they should have been. From what I remember, a lot of owners were accused of treating their cars poorly!

Nice to know that there are some examples of cars that are still going strong on standard internals! I've set my rev warning to 6k to avoid pre det by bouncing off the limiter and don't tend to drive like an idiot anyway, just the odd spurt here and there.
Now hopefully some snow will fall so I can really test out the AWD and have a play with DCCD

drumsterphil - would you be willing to give a ball park figure of what forging cost? I've had varying quotes from £2.5k - £6k. I reckon it would be a good idea to have something tucked away just in case.

[vxr2010]

I paid around 4 k , that was Pistons race bearings , rebore , it's worth cosworth head gaskets plus arp bolts , predictive text is great it was a nightmare just writing the above line , slight noise on start up but I know engine is strong

[TEKNOPUG]

There are fundamental issues with the engines which were exacerbated by the standard map (running lean). Remapped cars (for reliability rather than outright performance) can greatly reduce the chance of ring-land failure. Increasing the power/performance will increase the chances of a stock engine failing. It's not set in stone that the engine will fail at a certain number of miles (it's not as bad as say, Mazda rotary tips) but it is a known, documented weakness. There is a school of thought that the higher the mileage, the less likely they will fail - if they haven't failed by now, they aren't going to. Personally, I wouldn't buy one in the first instance as it would be a constant worry and they haven't depreciated enough (like the RX8 for example) to factor in the risk and subsequent rebuild. But then maybe that's because demand is still high for them and actual failures don't match reported failures - if they did I guess prices would be on the floor.

[TEKNOPUG]

Godzilla_88 said:

drumsterphil - would you be willing to give a ball park figure of what forging cost? I've had varying quotes from £2.5k - £6k. I reckon it would be a good idea to have something tucked away just in case.

vxr2010 said:

I paid around 4 k , that was Pistons race bearings , rebore , it's worth cosworth head gaskets plus arp bolts , predictive text is great it was a nightmare just writing the above line , slight noise on start up but I know engine is strong

If I was looking to spend that sort of money, I'd be inclined to look for a 2.0l JDM model instead.

[vxr2010]

I think you are saying you want to engine swap , I've heard the 2.5 ej257 is basically the same apart from cc to the Sti ver 7 , as far as heads but not Pistons , my fsti Pistons were in very good nick for the mileage , I got them changed based on long term usage of the car , the crank bearings were the issue on it , I would mod what you have , 2.5 have a lot more torque 2 litres drive very differently , a good engine builder can give you what you want , i used subaru4u and I would again

[Godzilla_88]

Thanks for the input guys, much appreciated.

I understand the reluctance to buy but i got it at a steal and if I factor in 3.5-4k rebuild i'm looking at probably just shy of what market dictates a forged hawk would go for. The car has had it's ECU flashed with revised maps and i'm not sure of what it was rebuilt with as on all the invoices it's part numbers instead of names and no amount of googling brings up what they used. Most likely standard Subaru parts i'm presuming.

I have to agree with VXR, the torque of the 2.5 makes it a very usable daily which is what I use it as. When funds allow, I will be getting myself in to a forged hatch!

It's interesting that a custom map has been mentioned as being a possible solution/preventative measure, as i live within a stones throw of Andy Forrest. I might drop him an email and see if he suggests bringing it in for him to tinker with

[texaxile]

BM paulmoonraker had a Hawk STi rebuilt by Extreme Scoobies in Essex, from what I remember it was a bit of a beast. He's a good guy to ask regarding what to do when rebuilding a 2.5, which included getting a new oil pump , as the standard ones aren't all that good either.

[drumsterphil]

Godzilla_88 said:

drumsterphil - would you be willing to give a ball park figure of what forging cost? I've had varying quotes from £2.5k - £6k. I reckon it would be a good idea to have something tucked away just in case.

About 3.5 - 4k I think - I've had a number of 2.5 rebuilds over the years so costs have varied.

Whereabouts are you?

[BurgerKing]

I'm running a Forester XT PPP, EJ255 engine the same as the Hawkeye Impreza WRX. Both head gaskets were knackered at 87k miles, usual symptoms of failure.

I had a full rebuild and the garage who did it (Autotechnica in Buxton) had seen it all before many times. The block was in excellent condition, cylinder bores etc, just showing that I'd always looked after the car and not abused it. Superb engine now it's been rebuilt (forged pistons, uprated head gasket, the usual) but I can't help but feel that Subaru dropped the ball with the 2.5.

My Wife's horrendously complex Legacy B4 RSK is 17 years old now and still running great, very nice engine indeed.

[tonyb1968]

The EJ257 is a flawed engine, pistons were of a bad and cast design, the oil pick up pipes block up easily, the head bolts on early cars were poor and caused HG issues because they flexed too much, the map sucked on MY06 cars onwards (failures were that bad in the States that they stopped production of the engine till they fixed it), and they also suffer cracking between cylinders (very common).

Is it a small amount that go wrong?
No, its a very excessive amount that let go for an engine, a small amount would be a few percent, not 40-50% of the engines out there (and it is that bad).
Its not all Subaru's fault of course, poor mods, incorrect fuel and poor servicing add to this, if its not been forged then keep away from the 2.5 tbh.

Torque wise, the 2ltr twin scroll is a far nicer car to drive, it gives better low down drivability (it produces more torque lower down than the 2.5ltr) and is just a better engine without the failure issues.

[texaxile]

tonyb1968 said:

The EJ257 is a flawed engine, pistons were of a bad and cast design, the oil pick up pipes block up easily, the head bolts on early cars were poor and caused HG issues because they flexed too much, the map sucked on MY06 cars onwards (failures were that bad in the States that they stopped production of the engine till they fixed it), and they also suffer cracking between cylinders (very common).

Is it a small amount that go wrong?
No, its a very excessive amount that let go for an engine, a small amount would be a few percent, not 40-50% of the engines out there (and it is that bad).
Its not all Subaru's fault of course, poor mods, incorrect fuel and poor servicing add to this, if its not been forged then keep away from the 2.5 tbh.

Torque wise, the 2ltr twin scroll is a far nicer car to drive, it gives better low down drivability (it produces more torque lower down than the 2.5ltr) and is just a better engine without the failure issues.

Also, when you factor in the cost of a decent rebuild plus the cost of the car in the first place,then it's possibly not too far away from the price of a blob JDM twinscroll 2.0 anyway. I've seen 2.5 WRXs fetch around £5000 up to £6500 in the classifieds, ( STi's a bit more)chuck in a 3k rebuild and I guess it kind of adds up.

• Edit in**, doing some research I see that the EJ255 in the Impreza won the Engine of the Year in the 2.0 to 2.5 class in 2006!. bloody hell lol.

Edited by texaxile on Thursday 4th February 19:25

[V10 SPM]

I bought a 2.5 WRX STI new in 2009 and ran it as my daily driver until 2015. I covered almost 60000 miles and never had any problems with the engine. I did have some issues with the brakes though. Every time I parked the car after it had been raining the brakes would lock on.

[vxr2010]

I looked at an 09 or 59 plate Sti , it was slow and not that exciting and involving to drive , then I found out about engine issue I walked away , the Foz was a lot more fun to drive , it was a good price for the car but I was thinking add 4000 £ for a rebuild put me off , it's a shame Subaru have made a mess of things , I know it's probably a small percent , in USA it's a lot more due to there fuel , the ej257 is a good lump just needs the right things done to it , bearings better Pistons head gasket and arp bolts , the oil pick up is a known issue but that seems to cover most cars , mine was fine but they put more weld on it any way

[mmcd87]

tonyb1968 said:

Is it a small amount that go wrong?
No, its a very excessive amount that let go for an engine, a small amount would be a few percent, not 40-50% of the engines out there (and it is that bad).

Where did you get 40-50% value from?

[MikeyLCR]

I have a 2005 JDM Forester STi that was imported by Litchfields and has their performance pack installed. I bought it in 2010 and it's had oil and filters every 5k miles. Now on 93k and no engine issues so far just all the expected maintenance items.

[V10 SPM]

vxr2010 said:

I looked at an 09 or 59 plate Sti , it was slow and not that exciting and involving to drive

I found that my 59 STI felt almost as quick as my Viper GTS and it was certainly a much slicker package with great power delivery and surprisingly practical as well.