Heysel tragedy 29 years ago today
Discussion
This doesn't get the same attention as Hillsborough as those that perished, with the exception of one, were not British. A very discrete and respectful tribute from Anfield today remembering the 39 that lost their lives.
Poor stadium facilities and terrible fan behaviour on all sides contributed to this disaster. I remember the scenes on TV and it was appalling.
I was 10/11 at the time and had just started attending football games at Old Trafford regularly with my Dad and other family. My memories are not good. The atmosphere outside grounds at the big games was very intimidating for a child a world away from my match day experience today. I wasn't allowed to games on my own like my dad in the 50's but we have nearly come full circle. Serious trouble is now rare and predictable.
On the cusp of a World Cup hooliganism invariably gets some press but we have moved on hugely in this country and probably, sadly only in Italy in recent years have I ever felt the threat or seen serious trouble and where caging is still needed.
We now end up banned on football forums for name calling as opposed to bundled in to the back of black marias for fighting!!
RIP to the 39 but I am so glad how the game in the county has moved on since that terrible night.
Poor stadium facilities and terrible fan behaviour on all sides contributed to this disaster. I remember the scenes on TV and it was appalling.
I was 10/11 at the time and had just started attending football games at Old Trafford regularly with my Dad and other family. My memories are not good. The atmosphere outside grounds at the big games was very intimidating for a child a world away from my match day experience today. I wasn't allowed to games on my own like my dad in the 50's but we have nearly come full circle. Serious trouble is now rare and predictable.
On the cusp of a World Cup hooliganism invariably gets some press but we have moved on hugely in this country and probably, sadly only in Italy in recent years have I ever felt the threat or seen serious trouble and where caging is still needed.
We now end up banned on football forums for name calling as opposed to bundled in to the back of black marias for fighting!!
RIP to the 39 but I am so glad how the game in the county has moved on since that terrible night.
Thought I'd have a quick look to see what was going on in rememberance of this tragedy.
I wondered if Liverpool would be doing anything, given their concern for never ever letting the world at large forget the impact of tragedy in football.
Imagine my utter amazement that the club *is* doing something.
http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/163716...
Although I am amazed at their attempts to whitewash history.
"Instead of leaving Brussels having seen our team lift a fifth European Cup, Reds fans travelled back to England having witnessed the deaths of 39 football supporters - including 32 Italian fans of Juventus, four Belgians, two from France and one man from Northern Ireland - following the collapse of a wall."
And what actually caused the wall to collapse?
My sense of anger at, and absolute distrust of Liverpool Football Club continues unabated.
The football world as a whole should be ashamed of their pandering to Liverpool while ignoring the victims of (Liverpool fans at) Heysel and the victims of the Bradford fire.
I wondered if Liverpool would be doing anything, given their concern for never ever letting the world at large forget the impact of tragedy in football.
Imagine my utter amazement that the club *is* doing something.
http://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/latest-news/163716...
Although I am amazed at their attempts to whitewash history.
"Instead of leaving Brussels having seen our team lift a fifth European Cup, Reds fans travelled back to England having witnessed the deaths of 39 football supporters - including 32 Italian fans of Juventus, four Belgians, two from France and one man from Northern Ireland - following the collapse of a wall."
And what actually caused the wall to collapse?
My sense of anger at, and absolute distrust of Liverpool Football Club continues unabated.
The football world as a whole should be ashamed of their pandering to Liverpool while ignoring the victims of (Liverpool fans at) Heysel and the victims of the Bradford fire.
RIP to those that died at Heysel.
The behaviour of football fans in the 70’s and 80’s was disgusting. I remember when my Granddad first started taking me to matches in the mid 70’s (I was 8 at the time) – the amount of violence outside some grounds was shocking, and for me as a child, terrifying at times... and it just got worse in the 80’s. Thank god we don’t have that today, and we can all take our kids to games without fear of violence.
But you’re missing the difference between Hillsborough and Heysel/Bradford.
The reason Liverpool fans have not let Hillsborough die is because the authorities blamed the fans for what happened and covered up their own incompetence.
Hackney said:
And what actually caused the wall to collapse?
My sense of anger at, and absolute distrust of Liverpool Football Club continues unabated.
The football world as a whole should be ashamed of their pandering to Liverpool while ignoring the victims of (Liverpool fans at) Heysel and the victims of the Bradford fire.
Yes, Liverpool fans were to blame for the deaths, but in reality, what happened at Heysel could have happened to any British club – it’s not like Liverpool fans were the only ones who behaved appallingly. My sense of anger at, and absolute distrust of Liverpool Football Club continues unabated.
The football world as a whole should be ashamed of their pandering to Liverpool while ignoring the victims of (Liverpool fans at) Heysel and the victims of the Bradford fire.
The behaviour of football fans in the 70’s and 80’s was disgusting. I remember when my Granddad first started taking me to matches in the mid 70’s (I was 8 at the time) – the amount of violence outside some grounds was shocking, and for me as a child, terrifying at times... and it just got worse in the 80’s. Thank god we don’t have that today, and we can all take our kids to games without fear of violence.
But you’re missing the difference between Hillsborough and Heysel/Bradford.
The reason Liverpool fans have not let Hillsborough die is because the authorities blamed the fans for what happened and covered up their own incompetence.
Interesting replies.
I've had a lengthy debate with a scouser today about this hence posting in the first place.
There are differences between Heysel and Hillsborough but both tragedies were caused by a combination of poor stadium design, poor crowd policing and poor crowd behaviour.
Bradford was different again, but because of all three incidents almost every football fan in the UK can go to watch their team safely.
I've had a lengthy debate with a scouser today about this hence posting in the first place.
There are differences between Heysel and Hillsborough but both tragedies were caused by a combination of poor stadium design, poor crowd policing and poor crowd behaviour.
Bradford was different again, but because of all three incidents almost every football fan in the UK can go to watch their team safely.
uk66fastback said:
Poor stadium design? Hillsborough had held many Cup semi finals previously without incidents ...
Not so. There narrowly avoided a similar disaster 8 yrs earlier in a cup semi. 38 injured.Hillsborough was a s
thole, the policing was worse than useless, and the fans were typical of fans of the day, badly behaved. All 3 contributed.Bit of a Unit said:
I consider fences as part of stadium design, I maybe wrong of course. I went to see Bordeaux in the 80's as a youngster on hols and they had an 8 foot wide trench at the front of the terraces in place of fences.
We had an electrified fence at Stamford Bridge for a while. Believe me, there were many games in that era when I considered throwing myself on it.TwigtheWonderkid said:
Not so. There narrowly avoided a similar disaster 8 yrs earlier in a cup semi. 38 injured.
Hillsborough was a sthole, the policing was worse than useless, and the fans were typical of fans of the day, badly behaved. All 3 contributed.
There was nothing wrong with the stadium 11 months prior according to an independent engineer.Hillsborough was a s
thole, the policing was worse than useless, and the fans were typical of fans of the day, badly behaved. All 3 contributed.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-27...
E24man said:
There always seems to be a world of difference in response to the Heysel disaster and the Hillsborough disaster
Very true and such a shame. No one should die going to watch football is the usual line.....unless it is in Belgium. There wasn't a ten minute tribute or plea for justice on the news tonight either.
The Italian's, who are typically a passionate and dramatic, demonstrative race, have accepted the events and continued to remember their dead with a quiet dignity that used to be associated with a rather more British stiff upper lip. They personify dignity for their deeds, words and actions.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Bit of a Unit said:
There are differences between Heysel and Hillsborough but both tragedies were caused by a combination of poor stadium design, poor crowd policing and poor crowd behaviour.
Poor crowd behaviour...at Hillsborough....a factor?? You're not allowed to say that anymore. Another sad Anniversary. Are you a Liverpool fan Zeb ?( if you see this ). If you are, there aren’t many that would come out & admit that the fans were accountable that day. Jeeze... you could get strung up from the nearest Merseyside lamppost. Anyway enough of that. Thoughts go out to the Juventus fans who lost loved ones on the 29th May.1985. Hopefully scenes like that will be a thing of the past. R.I.P.
35 years ago
35 years ago
Edited by Mariosbt on Friday 29th May 08:16
Re Hillsborough
Some Spurs fans who were there in the early 80.s said they were lucky not to be in such a situation.
With hindsight, perhaps Heysel was still fresh, and those who saw the mass attack on the Juventus fans ,and the pictures that we shown of the crowds outside Hillsborough may have put 2+2 and come up with near 4
What i remember was the scenes on TV outside before the game of Pools fans crammiing to get in
Whilst the old chestnut about there were 200k who were at Wembley in 1966 and saw England win. it could equally be said that there were many outside the ground without tickets who wanted to get in,by fair means or foul. The closing time of the pubs may have also had something to do with it with a late crush outside.1
Shots of fans being lifted up over the wall were shown. and it worried me a bit as The last time i saw, and was in a crush like that was the night Arsenal beat Spurs to win the League in 71. I cannot recall my feet touching the ground between the High Road and the entrances in Paxton road, and saw a few chaps near fainting. but back then it was a non ticket game and i reckon that well over 90k were there ( ground held 58K at the time IIRC).all trying to get in . The attendance figure that night was nowhere near the actual people inside. We were climbing over the turnstiles ,and daft as it myt seem still paying. just throwing the money at the gateman. God knows how much they made.
A few friends told me later that the crush went back as far as White Hart Lane Station and was similar at the front and Park lane End
They just said sod it and went back home. 1
With Hillsborough I dont think the blame could be laid 100% on the authorities ,but those who turned up on the off chance may need to recall that they might have had something to do with it
Liverpool Fans have had previous at Spurs,(other grounds may be available) Not that i condone it, but on the mid 60s and 70s i have seen several touts 'make a loss' on the seat tickets they were selling Like now the police and the club turned a blind eye. Even more annoying now as every game is all ticket and trace back should be a piece of urine.
Different World now, and i am trying to get excited about the resumption. no atmosphere and with the amount of games Imagine 2 world cups back to back, a lot of us will get tired of wall to wall football
Then when next season starts we will get the normal bleating of players not having enough of a break, insert Euros/WC between the end of last season and the new one. Players will be burnt out by December... Not looking forward to it at all.. It is all down to Money
Some Spurs fans who were there in the early 80.s said they were lucky not to be in such a situation.
With hindsight, perhaps Heysel was still fresh, and those who saw the mass attack on the Juventus fans ,and the pictures that we shown of the crowds outside Hillsborough may have put 2+2 and come up with near 4
What i remember was the scenes on TV outside before the game of Pools fans crammiing to get in
Whilst the old chestnut about there were 200k who were at Wembley in 1966 and saw England win. it could equally be said that there were many outside the ground without tickets who wanted to get in,by fair means or foul. The closing time of the pubs may have also had something to do with it with a late crush outside.1
Shots of fans being lifted up over the wall were shown. and it worried me a bit as The last time i saw, and was in a crush like that was the night Arsenal beat Spurs to win the League in 71. I cannot recall my feet touching the ground between the High Road and the entrances in Paxton road, and saw a few chaps near fainting. but back then it was a non ticket game and i reckon that well over 90k were there ( ground held 58K at the time IIRC).all trying to get in . The attendance figure that night was nowhere near the actual people inside. We were climbing over the turnstiles ,and daft as it myt seem still paying. just throwing the money at the gateman. God knows how much they made.
A few friends told me later that the crush went back as far as White Hart Lane Station and was similar at the front and Park lane End
They just said sod it and went back home. 1
With Hillsborough I dont think the blame could be laid 100% on the authorities ,but those who turned up on the off chance may need to recall that they might have had something to do with it
Liverpool Fans have had previous at Spurs,(other grounds may be available) Not that i condone it, but on the mid 60s and 70s i have seen several touts 'make a loss' on the seat tickets they were selling Like now the police and the club turned a blind eye. Even more annoying now as every game is all ticket and trace back should be a piece of urine.
Different World now, and i am trying to get excited about the resumption. no atmosphere and with the amount of games Imagine 2 world cups back to back, a lot of us will get tired of wall to wall football
Then when next season starts we will get the normal bleating of players not having enough of a break, insert Euros/WC between the end of last season and the new one. Players will be burnt out by December... Not looking forward to it at all.. It is all down to Money
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