M250 Vs. Evora

M250 Vs. Evora

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Scuffers

Original Poster:

20,887 posts

281 months

Sunday 19th April 2009
quotequote all
saw the M250 show car at Donington today, along with the Evora's.

Hate to say it, but I really do prefer the lines of the M250... (still looks good 10 years on)

Am I alone?

beano700

71 posts

204 months

Sunday 19th April 2009
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Couldn't agree more, thought that the M250 was much better looking than the Evora.
The Evora should be lower for starters.My son (at 13) thought the same too.

Loose_Cannon

1,593 posts

260 months

Sunday 19th April 2009
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I think you are in the vast majority, and I think the amount of times it is shown by the design staff it is held in great affection by them to. It has hardly dated

Tuna

19,930 posts

291 months

Monday 20th April 2009
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Agreed it has a stunning design, but it did have real packaging problems - even less storage than the Elise and quite a cramped cabin. For a GT, it wasn't something that you could seriously consider driving across continents in. I love the lines, but in retrospect it was more a 'big Elise' than a genuinely different car. Given the poor reception given to the Europa, I doubt it would have sold as well as they needed.

The Evora really has moved the game along.

purpleperil

1,214 posts

291 months

Monday 20th April 2009
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Tuna said:
Given the poor reception given to the Europa, I doubt it would have sold as well as they needed.
I was talking to a dealer on Saturday at the show - he said that he was at the motorshow when they launched the M250 and they took a whole year's profit in deposits for this car! Judging by that I don't believe they'd have been a problem with the take up - trouble is that now the market has moved along and dare I say the competition has caught up?

Monkey boy 1

2,063 posts

238 months

Monday 20th April 2009
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From my understanding, the £5K deposit for the M250 was held by a dealership, NOT by Lotus.

Yes, for it's time the vehicle looked stunning, but what you see it a styling departmet's vehicle. Not a Production intent vehicle.
But it's looking dated now (it is over 10 years old).

No doubt Lotus took some styling ideas from the M250 & used it on the Evora. Makes sence really as the work had already been done & saves time, but legislation, packaging issues & component performance & availability change over time, so what you see in the Evora is a totally different beast, once you get underneath the skin.

Tuna

19,930 posts

291 months

Monday 20th April 2009
quotequote all
purpleperil said:
Tuna said:
Given the poor reception given to the Europa, I doubt it would have sold as well as they needed.
I was talking to a dealer on Saturday at the show - he said that he was at the motorshow when they launched the M250 and they took a whole year's profit in deposits for this car! Judging by that I don't believe they'd have been a problem with the take up - trouble is that now the market has moved along and dare I say the competition has caught up?
I had a deposit on it. The point is that many people put down deposits without even having seen the car in the flesh, never mind sat in it. It was launched at the height of the dot.com boom and at the point where the Elise was probably at the peak of it's success. People expected a lot of it, and in retrospect I don't think it would have been able to deliver. You can't fault the styling, but the underlying platform wasn't up to the task. I think that's reflected in Lotus' decision to cancel it. It would have been a dead end for Lotus.

Scuffers

Original Poster:

20,887 posts

281 months

Monday 20th April 2009
quotequote all
Tuna said:
Agreed it has a stunning design, but it did have real packaging problems - even less storage than the Elise and quite a cramped cabin. For a GT, it wasn't something that you could seriously consider driving across continents in. I love the lines, but in retrospect it was more a 'big Elise' than a genuinely different car. Given the poor reception given to the Europa, I doubt it would have sold as well as they needed.

The Evora really has moved the game along.
Honestly don't think this is the case, at the time, it was very well recived with more deposits taken that total Europa's sold!

purpleperil said:
Tuna said:
Given the poor reception given to the Europa, I doubt it would have sold as well as they needed.
I was talking to a dealer on Saturday at the show - he said that he was at the motorshow when they launched the M250 and they took a whole year's profit in deposits for this car! Judging by that I don't believe they'd have been a problem with the take up - trouble is that now the market has moved along and dare I say the competition has caught up?
Yup, also the boot on the Evora is arguably smaller than the Elise!

not convinced with the engine location either, it;s been pushed well back and up to make space of the back seat, be interesting to see what the COG and weight distro is...


Kaiser_Wull

149 posts

187 months

Monday 20th April 2009
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Scuffers said:
saw the M250 show car at Donington today, along with the Evora's.

Hate to say it, but I really do prefer the lines of the M250... (still looks good 10 years on)

Am I alone?
You're not alone. Far from it. Just about every Lotus owner/enthusiast I spoke to at Donny said the same thing: "we like the look of the Evora but we love the M250".

For me, it's one of the best looking designs ever. It still cuts the mustard a decade on.


Tuna

19,930 posts

291 months

Tuesday 21st April 2009
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Scuffers said:
not convinced with the engine location either, it;s been pushed well back and up to make space of the back seat, be interesting to see what the COG and weight distro is...
I've got it as 39/61 front-rear.

The problem with the M250 was that it was based on a stretched Elise. Though they didn't make much of a deal of them at the time, the performance figures were a long way from class leading. The deposits were placed based on the success of the Elise, not the actual ride, handling and accommodation offered by the M250 - you couldn't even sit in the early motorshow car as it was a clay. If it had come to market, people would have started asking questions.

Fittster

20,120 posts

220 months

Tuesday 21st April 2009
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So a concept car looked better than a production model. Doesn't that happen all the time?

Scuffers

Original Poster:

20,887 posts

281 months

Tuesday 21st April 2009
quotequote all
Tuna said:
I've got it as 39/61 front-rear.

The problem with the M250 was that it was based on a stretched Elise. Though they didn't make much of a deal of them at the time, the performance figures were a long way from class leading. The deposits were placed based on the success of the Elise, not the actual ride, handling and accommodation offered by the M250 - you couldn't even sit in the early motorshow car as it was a clay. If it had come to market, people would have started asking questions.
be surprised if those figures are correct?...

either way, the arguments against the M250 just aren't valid in the bigger pictures.

it may well have been based on a (stretched) Elise chassis, so what, what do you think the Evora chassis is? yes they have changed some bit's (like the bolt on front structure etc) but it's essentially the same technology, and anyway, all the features you quote are equally do-able to either platform.

I am still not convinced there is a market for a 2+2...


Tuna

19,930 posts

291 months

Tuesday 21st April 2009
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Scuffers said:
be surprised if those figures are correct?...
They seem to be commonly stated around the 'net, but I can't identify where the original numbers came from. Reviews next week should confirm or deny.

Scuffers said:
either way, the arguments against the M250 just aren't valid in the bigger pictures.

it may well have been based on a (stretched) Elise chassis, so what, what do you think the Evora chassis is? yes they have changed some bit's (like the bolt on front structure etc) but it's essentially the same technology, and anyway, all the features you quote are equally do-able to either platform.
Really? If only Lotus had realised, they could have saved a fortune on all that development work for the new platform. I get the impression that the Elise chassis is not as far ahead of the competition now as it was when it was launched. Certainly the Evora chassis is significantly more rigid whilst being able to stretch further and wider, as well as improving the access.

Don't get me wrong, the M250 is a stunning design and I was very disappointed not to get one. The Evora is a completely different proposition, so can't really be compared as better or worse because it's not aiming to do the same thing. However, having gone through every stage of development of the M250 with deep excitement, by the time I was sitting in the rolling chassis I found myself asking some questions about whether it was going to be good enough to justify buying. Other than good looks, it didn't have that much to distinguish itself from the competition.

amare32

2,419 posts

230 months

Monday 20th July 2009
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Still not sure that the Evora looks as good as the M250...



cjm

533 posts

275 months

Tuesday 21st July 2009
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Stick a photo of an S2 Elise in there as well, it used all the good design ideas seen on the M250.


Edited by cjm on Tuesday 21st July 16:56

Scuffers

Original Poster:

20,887 posts

281 months

Tuesday 21st July 2009
quotequote all
cjm said:
Stick a photo of an S2 Elise in there as well, it used all the good design ideas seen in the M250.
some yes, but certainly not all, also, some of them did not translate as well on the Elise scale as they are on the M250.


PascalBuyens

2,868 posts

289 months

Sunday 30th August 2009
quotequote all
Scuffers said:
saw the M250 show car at Donington today, along with the Evora's.

Hate to say it, but I really do prefer the lines of the M250... (still looks good 10 years on)

Am I alone?
No, M250 definitely looks better.