Weight training - absolute begginer
Discussion
I'm thinking about starting weight/strength training; something I've never done before. I've just turned 41, I weigh 11st 10lb and I'm 5' 11" tall. I have a 16" neck, 34" waist and 40" chest. I look pretty skinny and I'm not particularly strong so my aim is to gain muscle and increase my functional strength. Hopefully I'll lose body fat and look better too.
My diet is pretty clean; I eat mostly lean meat and loads of fruit and veg. I drink 2-3 litres of water a day and very seldom touch alcohol.
After a bit of "research" on the Internet, I've settled on the Stronglifts 5x5 beginner strength training program. I like the fact that it's easy to understand, based around a limited number of compound exercises, and only takes 45 minutes, 3 times a week. Any comments on the suitability of this program for a 41 year old absolute beginner would be appreciated.
Also, I read alot about the importance of testosterone in weight training. I've lost both my balls to testicular cancer so I use a testosterone gel daily to compensate. I know this is a long shot, but does anyone know if my progress will be compromised because I use testosterone gel?
My diet is pretty clean; I eat mostly lean meat and loads of fruit and veg. I drink 2-3 litres of water a day and very seldom touch alcohol.
After a bit of "research" on the Internet, I've settled on the Stronglifts 5x5 beginner strength training program. I like the fact that it's easy to understand, based around a limited number of compound exercises, and only takes 45 minutes, 3 times a week. Any comments on the suitability of this program for a 41 year old absolute beginner would be appreciated.
Also, I read alot about the importance of testosterone in weight training. I've lost both my balls to testicular cancer so I use a testosterone gel daily to compensate. I know this is a long shot, but does anyone know if my progress will be compromised because I use testosterone gel?
tuglet said:
I've lost both my balls to testicular cancer so I use a testosterone gel daily to compensate. I know this is a long shot, but does anyone know if my progress will be compromised because I use testosterone gel?
Sorry to hear that. Have the doctors given you any idea of your testo' levels when using the gel? Presumably, it'll be designed to get you around the same (minimum)natural level produced in the body? Can you ask for a stronger gel (sorry, I have no idea how this works..)In males, testosterone is the main catalyst to increasing muscle size and strength but presumably with the gel to compensate you should still be able to make the strength gains you are after.
Also, the 5x5 Stronglifts programme is a good place to start. Don't expect massive size gains with the workout because it's not going to happen, your strength however will increase, probably quite significantly.
Good luck!
Edited by UncleRic on Thursday 22 July 11:24
Sorry to hear that too.
Bottom line if you want to put the weight/mass on:
1. Make sure you eat often and cleanly, i.e. try and get plenty of protein by whatever means, and don't forget fruit and veg. (I stuggle as I don't get hungry).
2. Lift heavy for you. If you can do 8 reps of weight after warm-up, then you can go the next weight up. Don't get stuck doing the same reps and weights. A 5x5 is fine but change either the weights or plan after a month or so.
3. If you can focus on any exercise then focus on the compound ones.
And finally train. 3 times a week won't really cut it, aim and stick to doing training 5 times a week, and don't give up.
Peace
Bottom line if you want to put the weight/mass on:
1. Make sure you eat often and cleanly, i.e. try and get plenty of protein by whatever means, and don't forget fruit and veg. (I stuggle as I don't get hungry).
2. Lift heavy for you. If you can do 8 reps of weight after warm-up, then you can go the next weight up. Don't get stuck doing the same reps and weights. A 5x5 is fine but change either the weights or plan after a month or so.
3. If you can focus on any exercise then focus on the compound ones.
And finally train. 3 times a week won't really cut it, aim and stick to doing training 5 times a week, and don't give up.
Peace
Brother D said:
And finally train. 3 times a week won't really cut it, aim and stick to doing training 5 times a week, and don't give up.
Sorry disagree, as a beginner you will get 'much' better results from undertraining rather than overtraining.Rest is where you get bigger and stronger.
5 times is too much for someone just starting out, and even then a lot of people get very good results only doing maybe 2 sessions a week but really making them good ones.
Sorry to hear you had testicular cancer. It's surprising (or maybe it isn't when you think about it from a statistical viewpoint) to hear how many have lost one or both testicles on PH (see my Testicular Cancer thread). Anyway, just thinking aloud... women body builders seem to have no problems and presumably their testosterone levels are lower than the average male's so it can't be a real problem, can it (unless by weight training you were hoping to compete)?
"Testosterone is also produced in women's ovaries and adrenal glands. Little is known about the exact role of testosterone in women, but scientists believe it helps maintain muscle and bone strength and contributes to sex drive or libido.
"On average, men produce between 4 and 10mg of the hormone per day and overall they have about 20 times more testosterone than women."
(Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sex/article... )
I mean, if you just want to be stronger, then go ahead and do it. I see women climbers doing dozens of pull ups at the local climbing centre. My regular (female) climbing partner even does finger pull ups!
However, as suggested above, might be an idea to speak to your GP, first.
"Testosterone is also produced in women's ovaries and adrenal glands. Little is known about the exact role of testosterone in women, but scientists believe it helps maintain muscle and bone strength and contributes to sex drive or libido.
"On average, men produce between 4 and 10mg of the hormone per day and overall they have about 20 times more testosterone than women."
(Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sex/article... )
I mean, if you just want to be stronger, then go ahead and do it. I see women climbers doing dozens of pull ups at the local climbing centre. My regular (female) climbing partner even does finger pull ups!
However, as suggested above, might be an idea to speak to your GP, first.
Edited by ShadownINja on Thursday 22 July 11:46
bales said:
Brother D said:
And finally train. 3 times a week won't really cut it, aim and stick to doing training 5 times a week, and don't give up.
Sorry disagree, as a beginner you will get 'much' better results from undertraining rather than overtraining.Rest is where you get bigger and stronger.
Stick with the Stonglifts programme, there is plenty in there to get you going as a beginner. Eat well, eat the same on rest days and workout days and get plenty of sleep.
UncleRic said:
tuglet said:
I've lost both my balls to testicular cancer so I use a testosterone gel daily to compensate. I know this is a long shot, but does anyone know if my progress will be compromised because I use testosterone gel?
Sorry to hear that. Have the doctors given you any idea of your testo' levels when using the gel? Presumably, it'll be designed to get you around the same (minimum)natural level produced in the body? Can you ask for a stronger gel (sorry, I have no idea how this works..)In males, testosterone is the main catalyst to increasing muscle size and strength but presumably with the gel to compensate you should still be able to make the strength gains you are after.
Also, the 5x5 Stronglifts programme is a good place to start. Don't expect massive size gains with the workout because it's not going to happen, your strength however will increase, probably quite significantly.
Good luck!
Edited by UncleRic on Thursday 22 July 11:24
I'm not looking to get big so Stronglifts still sounds good to me. Thanks for the advise.
Cheers
tuglet
ShadownINja said:
Sorry to hear you had testicular cancer. It's surprising (or maybe it isn't when you think about it from a statistical viewpoint) to hear how many have lost one or both testicles on PH (see my Testicular Cancer thread). Anyway, just thinking aloud... women body builders seem to have no problems and presumably their testosterone levels are lower than the average male's so it can't be a real problem, can it (unless by weight training you were hoping to compete)?
"Testosterone is also produced in women's ovaries and adrenal glands. Little is known about the exact role of testosterone in women, but scientists believe it helps maintain muscle and bone strength and contributes to sex drive or libido.
"On average, men produce between 4 and 10mg of the hormone per day and overall they have about 20 times more testosterone than women."
(Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sex/article... )
I mean, if you just want to be stronger, then go ahead and do it. I see women climbers doing dozens of pull ups at the local climbing centre. My regular (female) climbing partner even does finger pull ups!
However, as suggested above, might be an idea to speak to your GP, first.
I hadn't thought about women body builders. That's a really good point. My GP, and GPs in general I suspect, know very little about male hormones. I see an endocrinilogist twice a year and even she seems to be making up as she goes along. From the people in her waiting room, I think she spends most of her time dealing with menopausal women."Testosterone is also produced in women's ovaries and adrenal glands. Little is known about the exact role of testosterone in women, but scientists believe it helps maintain muscle and bone strength and contributes to sex drive or libido.
"On average, men produce between 4 and 10mg of the hormone per day and overall they have about 20 times more testosterone than women."
(Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sex/article... )
I mean, if you just want to be stronger, then go ahead and do it. I see women climbers doing dozens of pull ups at the local climbing centre. My regular (female) climbing partner even does finger pull ups!
However, as suggested above, might be an idea to speak to your GP, first.
Edited by ShadownINja on Thursday 22 July 11:46
bales said:
Brother D said:
And finally train. 3 times a week won't really cut it, aim and stick to doing training 5 times a week, and don't give up.
Sorry disagree, as a beginner you will get 'much' better results from undertraining rather than overtraining.Rest is where you get bigger and stronger.
5 times is too much for someone just starting out, and even then a lot of people get very good results only doing maybe 2 sessions a week but really making them good ones.
markh1 said:
bales said:
Brother D said:
And finally train. 3 times a week won't really cut it, aim and stick to doing training 5 times a week, and don't give up.
Sorry disagree, as a beginner you will get 'much' better results from undertraining rather than overtraining.Rest is where you get bigger and stronger.
5 times is too much for someone just starting out, and even then a lot of people get very good results only doing maybe 2 sessions a week but really making them good ones.
and EAT MAN, EAT! If you find yourself feeling hungry you have failed! You should be eating plenty of high-quality food every 2-3 hours - but if you get hungry in between meals then eat more. IME, you will never grow as fast or make as much progress as you will in your first 6-12 months of training.Best,
Animal
Animal said:
markh1 said:
bales said:
Brother D said:
And finally train. 3 times a week won't really cut it, aim and stick to doing training 5 times a week, and don't give up.
Sorry disagree, as a beginner you will get 'much' better results from undertraining rather than overtraining.Rest is where you get bigger and stronger.
5 times is too much for someone just starting out, and even then a lot of people get very good results only doing maybe 2 sessions a week but really making them good ones.
and EAT MAN, EAT! If you find yourself feeling hungry you have failed! You should be eating plenty of high-quality food every 2-3 hours - but if you get hungry in between meals then eat more. IME, you will never grow as fast or make as much progress as you will in your first 6-12 months of training.Best,
Animal
tugle said:
Can you give some examples of high quality food, and roughly how many calories to aim for each day?
If your great grandmother wouldn't recognise it as food, or if it doesn't go mouldy or rot, don't eat it.Likewsie, if you can grow it or kill it.. eat it.
Don't be scared of dairy (unless you have specific alergies), eat plenty of fresh colourful veg, and replace breakfast cereals with rolled oats / porridge.
Edited by UncleRic on Thursday 22 July 13:01
1) Lean meat, fish and poultry
2) Fruit
3) Green vegetables (although all other colours are equally welcome!)
4) Whole grains and unrefined foods (wholemeal pasta, granary bread)
Bad: refined foods (white bread, white sugar, fizzy drinks)
As a guide, aim to consume the following:
Protein (4 kCalories per gramme): 1g per lb of bodyweight
Carbohydrates (4kCal/g): 2g per lb of bodyweight
Protein should be 25-35% of your daily calorie intake and your carb. intake should be approximately double that. The remainder of your calorie intake should be fats, but not lard or pies. Good fats can be found in oily fish and nuts, and incidental amounts will be found in most other foods (esp. meat). Fat is much more calorie-rich than proteins and carbs (9kCal per g).
As an example of a bad meal vs. a good meal
Bad: pie, chips and gravy: even if you go for low-fat options and get whatever amounts of protein and carbs that you've allocated yourself for that meal remember that all of the food on your plate hasn't been fresh in a long time, but has been cropped, processed, shipped, stored, prepared, frozen, shipped, etc, etc. A lot of the goodness has long gone.
Good: salmon, boiled potatoes, green beans: fresh fish and vegetables. This can have the same protein, fat and carb content as the above, but it's much more likely to have been in it's natural state a week ago.
Brucie bonus: assuming you're not lactose intolerant, try drinking a glass of milk before going to bed. Milk is high in micellar casein which is a slow-releasing protein to help your body repair itself whilst you sleep.
HTH,
Animal
2) Fruit
3) Green vegetables (although all other colours are equally welcome!)
4) Whole grains and unrefined foods (wholemeal pasta, granary bread)
Bad: refined foods (white bread, white sugar, fizzy drinks)
As a guide, aim to consume the following:
Protein (4 kCalories per gramme): 1g per lb of bodyweight
Carbohydrates (4kCal/g): 2g per lb of bodyweight
Protein should be 25-35% of your daily calorie intake and your carb. intake should be approximately double that. The remainder of your calorie intake should be fats, but not lard or pies. Good fats can be found in oily fish and nuts, and incidental amounts will be found in most other foods (esp. meat). Fat is much more calorie-rich than proteins and carbs (9kCal per g).
As an example of a bad meal vs. a good meal
Bad: pie, chips and gravy: even if you go for low-fat options and get whatever amounts of protein and carbs that you've allocated yourself for that meal remember that all of the food on your plate hasn't been fresh in a long time, but has been cropped, processed, shipped, stored, prepared, frozen, shipped, etc, etc. A lot of the goodness has long gone.
Good: salmon, boiled potatoes, green beans: fresh fish and vegetables. This can have the same protein, fat and carb content as the above, but it's much more likely to have been in it's natural state a week ago.
Brucie bonus: assuming you're not lactose intolerant, try drinking a glass of milk before going to bed. Milk is high in micellar casein which is a slow-releasing protein to help your body repair itself whilst you sleep.
HTH,
Animal
UncleRic said:
tugle said:
Can you give some examples of high quality food, and roughly how many calories to aim for each day?
If your great grandmother wouldn't recognise it as food, or if it doesn't go mouldy or rot, don't eat it.Likewsie, if you can grow it or kill it.. eat it.
Don't be scared of dairy (unless you have specific alergies), eat plenty of fresh colourful veg, and replace breakfast cereals with rolled oats / porridge.
Edited by UncleRic on Thursday 22 July 13:01
Animal said:
1) Lean meat, fish and poultry
2) Fruit
3) Green vegetables (although all other colours are equally welcome!)
4) Whole grains and unrefined foods (wholemeal pasta, granary bread)
Bad: refined foods (white bread, white sugar, fizzy drinks)
As a guide, aim to consume the following:
Protein (4 kCalories per gramme): 1g per lb of bodyweight
Carbohydrates (4kCal/g): 2g per lb of bodyweight
Protein should be 25-35% of your daily calorie intake and your carb. intake should be approximately double that. The remainder of your calorie intake should be fats, but not lard or pies. Good fats can be found in oily fish and nuts, and incidental amounts will be found in most other foods (esp. meat). Fat is much more calorie-rich than proteins and carbs (9kCal per g).
As an example of a bad meal vs. a good meal
Bad: pie, chips and gravy: even if you go for low-fat options and get whatever amounts of protein and carbs that you've allocated yourself for that meal remember that all of the food on your plate hasn't been fresh in a long time, but has been cropped, processed, shipped, stored, prepared, frozen, shipped, etc, etc. A lot of the goodness has long gone.
Good: salmon, boiled potatoes, green beans: fresh fish and vegetables. This can have the same protein, fat and carb content as the above, but it's much more likely to have been in it's natural state a week ago.
Brucie bonus: assuming you're not lactose intolerant, try drinking a glass of milk before going to bed. Milk is high in micellar casein which is a slow-releasing protein to help your body repair itself whilst you sleep.
HTH,
Animal
Sounds like I'm on the right track already. Just need to up the quantities significantly. Is skimmed milk as good as full fat?2) Fruit
3) Green vegetables (although all other colours are equally welcome!)
4) Whole grains and unrefined foods (wholemeal pasta, granary bread)
Bad: refined foods (white bread, white sugar, fizzy drinks)
As a guide, aim to consume the following:
Protein (4 kCalories per gramme): 1g per lb of bodyweight
Carbohydrates (4kCal/g): 2g per lb of bodyweight
Protein should be 25-35% of your daily calorie intake and your carb. intake should be approximately double that. The remainder of your calorie intake should be fats, but not lard or pies. Good fats can be found in oily fish and nuts, and incidental amounts will be found in most other foods (esp. meat). Fat is much more calorie-rich than proteins and carbs (9kCal per g).
As an example of a bad meal vs. a good meal
Bad: pie, chips and gravy: even if you go for low-fat options and get whatever amounts of protein and carbs that you've allocated yourself for that meal remember that all of the food on your plate hasn't been fresh in a long time, but has been cropped, processed, shipped, stored, prepared, frozen, shipped, etc, etc. A lot of the goodness has long gone.
Good: salmon, boiled potatoes, green beans: fresh fish and vegetables. This can have the same protein, fat and carb content as the above, but it's much more likely to have been in it's natural state a week ago.
Brucie bonus: assuming you're not lactose intolerant, try drinking a glass of milk before going to bed. Milk is high in micellar casein which is a slow-releasing protein to help your body repair itself whilst you sleep.
HTH,
Animal
I see no problem with training 4 times a week, in fact my best gains have been on a 4 times per week plan. Current plan is (roughly):
Day 1- overhead + 2x accessory
Day 2- Deadlift + 2x accessory
rest day
Day 3- Bench + 2x accessory
Day 4- Squat + 2x accessory
rest day
rest day
Also, diet just needs to be healthy with enough protein/calories for growth. Nothing complicated about getting strong, growth will come with strength provided you eat enough.
Day 1- overhead + 2x accessory
Day 2- Deadlift + 2x accessory
rest day
Day 3- Bench + 2x accessory
Day 4- Squat + 2x accessory
rest day
rest day
Also, diet just needs to be healthy with enough protein/calories for growth. Nothing complicated about getting strong, growth will come with strength provided you eat enough.
tuglet said:
Is skimmed milk as good as full fat?
Yes, but I wouldn't worry at this stage unless you have a particular preference for one over the other or if you intend to drink a large quantity (say more than a pint a day).One thing you must do is monitor your progress regularly. Can you get your bodyfat checked at your gym? If so, it might be worthwhile recording your height, weight and b/f now and again every 6-8 weeks. If your bodyfat percentage is increasing by more than 1-2 percent over the course of 2 measurements (c. 3 months), or is over 20% and not decreasing (as a result of all the healthy food and exercise) then maybe switch to some lower-fat options (assuming you're not just getting your fat from the good sources such as in my earlier examples).
After 6 months or so of committed training you should see real and significant progress.
However, consistency is key. When I was a kid and started training at 17 I practically lived in the gym but my diet was terrible. After 5 months of not gaining a single pound in bodyweight I decided to sit down and get my diet in order and wrote myself out some guidelines and meal plans. In my first month of eating properly I gained 6lbs, and I carried on gaining weight for the next year or so and ended up about 2st heavier.
It sounds like you're largely getting the right advice here. I didn't start any form of fitness or training until I was forty. I was 186cm, 92kgs and 30%BF - I wish I'd taken some photographs then.
48 next week, still 186cm tall
but have been 75kgs 11%BF which was too low - settled at about 80kgs now and 14%BF. I have a little more fat than I'd like but not the handfuls I had when I started. If I chose to lose 5 or 10kgs it's very simple, because I now have a better understanding of my body - all it takes is a little time and effort. Note I said simple, not easy - a small reduction in intake and an increase in activity and it pretty much falls off me these days.
Funnily enough, I'm due a change to my routine so I'm starting 5x5 next week, someone mentioned it on the weight training resources thread I started t'other day click. Are you taking the advice at stronglifts.com?
48 next week, still 186cm tall
but have been 75kgs 11%BF which was too low - settled at about 80kgs now and 14%BF. I have a little more fat than I'd like but not the handfuls I had when I started. If I chose to lose 5 or 10kgs it's very simple, because I now have a better understanding of my body - all it takes is a little time and effort. Note I said simple, not easy - a small reduction in intake and an increase in activity and it pretty much falls off me these days.Funnily enough, I'm due a change to my routine so I'm starting 5x5 next week, someone mentioned it on the weight training resources thread I started t'other day click. Are you taking the advice at stronglifts.com?
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