How do you know what to do in the gym (and nutrition)?
Discussion
I'm just wondering this, because for me, it seems like there is no right or wrong answer really.
I know what I need to do, but its amazing that anyone ever comes to any real conclusion when you search the internet, or even take advise from so called experts, because they all offer different advice!
There seems to be so much conflicting evidence for things working that it just confuses people.
For example, some will tell you that you need to do 1 set of 20 reps (as on here), others will say 12 reps, others 5, others 3 and so on.
Some will say cardio is a waste of time for weight loss, especially solid state cardio, and to do HIIT. Others say you shouldnt do it or you'll lose muscle as well, others say its absolutely fine.
Then theres the old protein myths. There seem to be plenty of scientific evidence to suggest that the average person who is in training really only needs maybe 1-1.5g per kg of bodyweight, yet searching on the internet reveals that some are eating as much as 2 or more g per POUND of bodyweight.
So what is it? Is everyone on the internet an expert, or do people just regurgitate the same old worn out myths that other people have told them "so it must be right".
Do we over complicate things? I think we do?
Personally, I now just concentrate on compound exercises using free weights, and chuck a bit of cardio in when I can. I eat a normal, balanced diet. I am never going to be an athlete or a body builder, but I believe this routine CAN get me in good shape, without spending hideous amounts of money on supplements.
What I am trying to say is the myriad of advice on the internet is just very confusing for most, and that its really not rocket science. Lift heavy, do compounds, dont eat crap, keep moving. Does it need be more complicated than that for 99% of the general population?
I know what I need to do, but its amazing that anyone ever comes to any real conclusion when you search the internet, or even take advise from so called experts, because they all offer different advice!
There seems to be so much conflicting evidence for things working that it just confuses people.
For example, some will tell you that you need to do 1 set of 20 reps (as on here), others will say 12 reps, others 5, others 3 and so on.
Some will say cardio is a waste of time for weight loss, especially solid state cardio, and to do HIIT. Others say you shouldnt do it or you'll lose muscle as well, others say its absolutely fine.
Then theres the old protein myths. There seem to be plenty of scientific evidence to suggest that the average person who is in training really only needs maybe 1-1.5g per kg of bodyweight, yet searching on the internet reveals that some are eating as much as 2 or more g per POUND of bodyweight.
So what is it? Is everyone on the internet an expert, or do people just regurgitate the same old worn out myths that other people have told them "so it must be right".
Do we over complicate things? I think we do?
Personally, I now just concentrate on compound exercises using free weights, and chuck a bit of cardio in when I can. I eat a normal, balanced diet. I am never going to be an athlete or a body builder, but I believe this routine CAN get me in good shape, without spending hideous amounts of money on supplements.
What I am trying to say is the myriad of advice on the internet is just very confusing for most, and that its really not rocket science. Lift heavy, do compounds, dont eat crap, keep moving. Does it need be more complicated than that for 99% of the general population?
I know exactly what you mean OP, I was taught and instructed about various ways and methods of training, take for example core stability, trans vers ab contractions and yet the research was conducted on 12 Australians with no back injuries! So now the new fad is obliques with glutes and to be honest it makes more sense. So many training methods so many different experts out there. Minefield!
To add people do write and suggest utter crap on internet forums though.
Edited to add the other problem is you cant ask to see a someones qualification over the internet either but it is free which is a luxury these days.
To add people do write and suggest utter crap on internet forums though.
Edited to add the other problem is you cant ask to see a someones qualification over the internet either but it is free which is a luxury these days.
Edited by 996 sps on Friday 13th November 21:24
its well known that cardio or aerobic exercise is a cause of heart disease... http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19332846?itool=...
Mclovin said:
its well known that cardio or aerobic exercise is a cause of heart disease... http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19332846?itool=...
Irrelevant post as that report is specific to marathon runners. There is alot of info on the web and elsewhere and no doubt over-complicates it for people starting out in fitness. It takes a few years to figure out what your goals and aims are as well as what works best for you, your body type and your lifestyle. I have learnt a fair amount about this fitness malarkey and tbh it has allowed me to sort the wheat from the chaff in terms of what works best for me
as you say OP at the end of the day it is commonsense to remain fit and healthy. All the extra info can of course be very helpful should you wish to become bigger, faster, stronger etc or you wish to excel at a particular sport or activity.
pbirkett said:
Personally, I now just concentrate on compound exercises using free weights, and chuck a bit of cardio in when I can. I eat a normal, balanced diet.
That was essentially the conclusion I came to. I also followed The Abs Diet book. The result in around 6 months was this:
(although letting the good habits slip over the last couple of years has taken me most of the way back to the first photo - just got back 'on the wagon' this week)
pbirkett said:
There seems to be so much conflicting evidence for things working that it just confuses people.
For example, some will tell you that you need to do 1 set of 20 reps (as on here), others will say 12 reps, others 5, others 3 and so on.
whats conflicting about the number of reps you do?For example, some will tell you that you need to do 1 set of 20 reps (as on here), others will say 12 reps, others 5, others 3 and so on.
Those reps will deal with either toning(15+)>muscle building(8-12)>strength(3-5)
Edited by cheeky_chops on Saturday 14th November 13:26
I just keep it simple.
If you're a competition body-builder or wish to get down to less than 8% body fat (been there bought the t-shirt) then all aspects are very important. I've done plenty of stuff to get there like 1-2 hours per day of exercise and suppliments like ECA.
These days I keep I'm in athletic shape rather than like show shape which I used to do.
I eat well and use common sense.
Principles I use;
- Compound movements are best for building muscle and creating a balanced shape. People who specialise on specific muscle exercises need to know what they are doing or as you've probably seen in the gym a lot will end up with unusual and out of proportion muscles. Generally I do two types of exercise per muscle group and do 3 sets of 8 reps which most scientific studies agree (or there abouts) is the optimum. However if you're new to weights just build up to this and listen to when your body has enough, it's not a race with weights it's a marathon.
- Train your body, not your ego. What this means is form is all important over lifting big weights. How many people do you see swinging weights that are too heavy for them? I practice perfect (or as near as I can get) form and then add weight when I can. Doing it this way will mean you get much bigger gains and most importantly avoid injury.
- Eat well and make sure if you're trying to build muscle your body gets enough protein. My diet consists of lean meats, greens and variety to make sure I get what my body needs. I also use a protien shake after exercise or before I go to bed after a heavy session.
- Rest, rest, rest. You're body cannot grow nor be healthy if it isn't given the chance to recover and that means 8+ hours of sleep every night and off days. I only train 3-4 times a week. Over training will result in a burn out and also potentially injuries, it will also stop your muscles from growing as much as they can.
- Cardio, well I normally do at least 20 mins before weights although you need to consider where you are at the moment fitness wise because if you're not so fit you'll probably take to much out of yourself and not be able to do the weights very well. I also focus on variety so sometimes I row, sometimes I run, sometimes I bike or swim. If you mix cardio up it stops you're body from getting used to one form and it will also make you a much better all round athlete.
Anyway these are the simple things I learnt in my 7 years in the military.
If you're a competition body-builder or wish to get down to less than 8% body fat (been there bought the t-shirt) then all aspects are very important. I've done plenty of stuff to get there like 1-2 hours per day of exercise and suppliments like ECA.
These days I keep I'm in athletic shape rather than like show shape which I used to do.
I eat well and use common sense.
Principles I use;
- Compound movements are best for building muscle and creating a balanced shape. People who specialise on specific muscle exercises need to know what they are doing or as you've probably seen in the gym a lot will end up with unusual and out of proportion muscles. Generally I do two types of exercise per muscle group and do 3 sets of 8 reps which most scientific studies agree (or there abouts) is the optimum. However if you're new to weights just build up to this and listen to when your body has enough, it's not a race with weights it's a marathon.
- Train your body, not your ego. What this means is form is all important over lifting big weights. How many people do you see swinging weights that are too heavy for them? I practice perfect (or as near as I can get) form and then add weight when I can. Doing it this way will mean you get much bigger gains and most importantly avoid injury.
- Eat well and make sure if you're trying to build muscle your body gets enough protein. My diet consists of lean meats, greens and variety to make sure I get what my body needs. I also use a protien shake after exercise or before I go to bed after a heavy session.
- Rest, rest, rest. You're body cannot grow nor be healthy if it isn't given the chance to recover and that means 8+ hours of sleep every night and off days. I only train 3-4 times a week. Over training will result in a burn out and also potentially injuries, it will also stop your muscles from growing as much as they can.
- Cardio, well I normally do at least 20 mins before weights although you need to consider where you are at the moment fitness wise because if you're not so fit you'll probably take to much out of yourself and not be able to do the weights very well. I also focus on variety so sometimes I row, sometimes I run, sometimes I bike or swim. If you mix cardio up it stops you're body from getting used to one form and it will also make you a much better all round athlete.
Anyway these are the simple things I learnt in my 7 years in the military.
Edited by Ordinary_Chap on Saturday 14th November 13:29
Stevenj214 said:
pbirkett said:
Personally, I now just concentrate on compound exercises using free weights, and chuck a bit of cardio in when I can. I eat a normal, balanced diet.
That was essentially the conclusion I came to. I also followed The Abs Diet book. The result in around 6 months was this:(although letting the good habits slip over the last couple of years has taken me most of the way back to the first photo - just got back 'on the wagon' this week)
I never really concentrated on nutrition, but my new gf wants rid of me lovehandles so I followed the Weightwatchers technique and it works for me.
Just move more and eat less. I've read so many diet and nutrition books and that is my conclusion. Sure, there are some "tricks" that can help but even with the tricks, if you eat three KFC buckets a day you won't lose weight unless you weigh half a tonne.
Take up a sport as that's a fun way of moving. By sport, I don't mean shooting or golf. One that makes you gasp for breath. Even doing Wii Fit every day (the CV games) will shift the fat. The key is to do a regular (at least three times a week) activity that makes you short of breath.
http://www.nutristrategy.com/activitylist4.htm
And also note that even small things like a Mars Bar will add to the intake of fuel. It's great, really, because I like to keep my fuel levels up when I train.
PS don't even think about touching those slimming pills. They can range from simple caffeine pills (might as well drink coffee) to ones that stop fat absorption (meaning you can end up with fat just sliding out of your sphincter and into your pants
).
Take up a sport as that's a fun way of moving. By sport, I don't mean shooting or golf. One that makes you gasp for breath. Even doing Wii Fit every day (the CV games) will shift the fat. The key is to do a regular (at least three times a week) activity that makes you short of breath.
http://www.nutristrategy.com/activitylist4.htm
And also note that even small things like a Mars Bar will add to the intake of fuel. It's great, really, because I like to keep my fuel levels up when I train.
PS don't even think about touching those slimming pills. They can range from simple caffeine pills (might as well drink coffee) to ones that stop fat absorption (meaning you can end up with fat just sliding out of your sphincter and into your pants
).Edited by ShadownINja on Saturday 14th November 15:47
Stevenj - well done mate 
Its just as I thought really, there is too much complication out there for most people, and almost certainly too much BS.
When I started at the gym, I had all kinds of ideas of what to do, never stuck to one for long.
Now, I actually seem to do less actual exercises, but seem to be making better progress. I mainly just pick 3 exercises to do on any one day, and try to make sure that I train my whole body equally. I generally just do three of deadlifts, squats, bench press, military press, rows, and pull downs (or chins but I am too heavy and not strong enough for that yet). I am not eating anything special, I get a reasonable amount of protein but am not hung up on it.
Before, I would do all manner of isolation exercises on machines and gulp down protein shakes (spent about 50 quid a month on those!).
I honestly feel like I've made more progress in 3 months of doing compound free weight exercises than I did in a year of machines, but they were good for getting me up to speed.
Its a real easy routine to stick to. Theres not too much to remember, and you arent in the gym too long. I certainly work bloomin hard though.
I just feel like I've made so much better progress keeping it simple.
Its taken me to about 2 years of swapping and to'ing and fro'ing to realise that its really rather simpler than I was ever led to believe, even by people who describe themselves as professional fitness instructors.
Its just as I thought really, there is too much complication out there for most people, and almost certainly too much BS.
When I started at the gym, I had all kinds of ideas of what to do, never stuck to one for long.
Now, I actually seem to do less actual exercises, but seem to be making better progress. I mainly just pick 3 exercises to do on any one day, and try to make sure that I train my whole body equally. I generally just do three of deadlifts, squats, bench press, military press, rows, and pull downs (or chins but I am too heavy and not strong enough for that yet). I am not eating anything special, I get a reasonable amount of protein but am not hung up on it.
Before, I would do all manner of isolation exercises on machines and gulp down protein shakes (spent about 50 quid a month on those!).
I honestly feel like I've made more progress in 3 months of doing compound free weight exercises than I did in a year of machines, but they were good for getting me up to speed.
Its a real easy routine to stick to. Theres not too much to remember, and you arent in the gym too long. I certainly work bloomin hard though.
I just feel like I've made so much better progress keeping it simple.
Its taken me to about 2 years of swapping and to'ing and fro'ing to realise that its really rather simpler than I was ever led to believe, even by people who describe themselves as professional fitness instructors.
ShadownINja said:
PS don't even think about touching those slimming pills. They can range from simple caffeine pills (might as well drink coffee) to ones that stop fat absorption (meaning you can end up with fat just sliding out of your sphincter and into your pants ).
I don't do it anymore as I'm not bothered about having less than 8% of fat. ).Edited by ShadownINja on Saturday 14th November 15:47
However thats not really correct. Alibi is the weight loss pill you're talking about and I've never encounted a serious gym goer who would consider using it.
ECA and the ilk work very well but can have side effects and some people shouldn't take them, personally I had no side effects other than feeling happier than ever. I had the most awesome abs with that stuff and most competition guys use it as a staple suppliment.
I'm not interested in going back there as good as it looks. After a few years of maintaining that low fat ratio I felt tired by it all (I only took ECA for short periods of time, like one month out of 3 or 6). I feel so much better now not counting everything I eat and having a pint if I want too. I also feel far more healthy having gained a higher ratio of fat.
Ordinary_Chap said:
ShadownINja said:
PS don't even think about touching those slimming pills. They can range from simple caffeine pills (might as well drink coffee) to ones that stop fat absorption (meaning you can end up with fat just sliding out of your sphincter and into your pants ).
I don't do it anymore as I'm not bothered about having less than 8% of fat. ).Edited by ShadownINja on Saturday 14th November 15:47
However thats not really correct. Alibi is the weight loss pill you're talking about and I've never encounted a serious gym goer who would consider using it.
ECA and the ilk work very well but can have side effects and some people shouldn't take them, personally I had no side effects other than feeling happier than ever. I had the most awesome abs with that stuff and most competition guys use it as a staple suppliment.
I'm not interested in going back there as good as it looks. After a few years of maintaining that low fat ratio I felt tired by it all (I only took ECA for short periods of time, like one month out of 3 or 6). I feel so much better now not counting everything I eat and having a pint if I want too. I also feel far more healthy having gained a higher ratio of fat.
pbirkett said:
Now, I actually seem to do less actual exercises, but seem to be making better progress. I mainly just pick 3 exercises to do on any one day, and try to make sure that I train my whole body equally. I generally just do three of deadlifts, squats, bench press, military press, rows, and pull downs (or chins but I am too heavy and not strong enough for that yet). I am not eating anything special, I get a reasonable amount of protein but am not hung up on it.
Before, I would do all manner of isolation exercises on machines and gulp down protein shakes (spent about 50 quid a month on those!).
I honestly feel like I've made more progress in 3 months of doing compound free weight exercises than I did in a year of machines, but they were good for getting me up to speed.
Funnily enough i have come around to this way of thinking. Enough of isolation 3 time a week, get in and do 6 or 7 big compounds. Add pullups and dips to your list Before, I would do all manner of isolation exercises on machines and gulp down protein shakes (spent about 50 quid a month on those!).
I honestly feel like I've made more progress in 3 months of doing compound free weight exercises than I did in a year of machines, but they were good for getting me up to speed.
Before, i never touched a bar, was all isolation with dumbbells. I started with the bench press and now have just moved on to try all of the above. Need to make sure my form is good on the squat/dead before increasing the weight. And yea, my chins/pulls/dips are terrible, always avoided them. But i read to start with 10x1 and move on to 10x2, so be it!
cheeky_chops said:
pbirkett said:
Now, I actually seem to do less actual exercises, but seem to be making better progress. I mainly just pick 3 exercises to do on any one day, and try to make sure that I train my whole body equally. I generally just do three of deadlifts, squats, bench press, military press, rows, and pull downs (or chins but I am too heavy and not strong enough for that yet). I am not eating anything special, I get a reasonable amount of protein but am not hung up on it.
Before, I would do all manner of isolation exercises on machines and gulp down protein shakes (spent about 50 quid a month on those!).
I honestly feel like I've made more progress in 3 months of doing compound free weight exercises than I did in a year of machines, but they were good for getting me up to speed.
Funnily enough i have come around to this way of thinking. Enough of isolation 3 time a week, get in and do 6 or 7 big compounds. Add pullups and dips to your list Before, I would do all manner of isolation exercises on machines and gulp down protein shakes (spent about 50 quid a month on those!).
I honestly feel like I've made more progress in 3 months of doing compound free weight exercises than I did in a year of machines, but they were good for getting me up to speed.
Before, i never touched a bar, was all isolation with dumbbells. I started with the bench press and now have just moved on to try all of the above. Need to make sure my form is good on the squat/dead before increasing the weight. And yea, my chins/pulls/dips are terrible, always avoided them. But i read to start with 10x1 and move on to 10x2, so be it!
http://www.deepsquatter.com/strength/archives/manr...
Aftr 12 weeks I'll add a fourth medium day, prolly deadlifts, overhead press and a third one. So long as the legs, back and shoulder girdle is covered that's all I need.
I also intend to add an alternate day kettlebell routine for strength endurance.
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