Anyone had NLP?

[tonyvid]

Talk to me about NLP! Is is mumbo-jumbo, genuinely helpful etc? My Psycho wants to have a go with this and I really need to do something different as I am stuck in a loop of looking back and it is pissing me off!!

[drivin_me_nuts]

It's often classed as a Pseudoscience (fails the holy mantra of the double blind test etc). Discredited by some, I believe the "Randi's" "Dawkins" of this world are somewhat skeptical. (whether you go with the Skeptics bible is very much up to you..)

Some say that it can provide a set of useful tools to help you deal with the "looking" back stuff.

But then again so can CBT (for which there are plenty of "proper research" but that can also take time and a lot of conscious effort, but for some it does work ... and so can councelling and psychotherapy. There are lots of people advertising their services as NLP'ers. But be warned, some of them are real psychological bullies who really will try and badger you into a way of thinking.

Try it, see how you get on. It might be for you, ot it might not.

[V8mate]

I think it's outstanding.

That's all

[tonyvid]

drivin_me_nuts said:

It's often classed as a Pseudoscience (fails the holy mantra of the double blind test etc). Discredited by some, I believe the "Randi's" "Dawkins" of this world are somewhat skeptical. (whether you go with the Skeptics bible is very much up to you..)

Some say that it can provide a set of useful tools to help you deal with the "looking" back stuff.

But then again so can CBT (for which there are plenty of "proper research" but that can also take time and a lot of conscious effort, but for some it does work ... and so can councelling and psychotherapy. There are lots of people advertising their services as NLP'ers. But be warned, some of them are real psychological bullies who really will try and badger you into a way of thinking.

Try it, see how you get on. It might be for you, ot it might not.

Cheers, the Psycho is the one that my GP uses in the surgery and I have been seeing her for a while now - she is "no nonsense" but she is on my side and I have been offered 4 free sessions. I'll give it a go as I'm not happy where I am as I am feeling very "hard-wired"

[MikeO996]

The underlying model of nlp (the neuro bit) is complete rubbish - it's made up. There is no evidence base for nlp. The useful bits of nlp are the things it has in common with cbt. It's often a money making refuge for a lot of charlatons who have no underlying training in working with people with mental distress. The underlying moral philosophy is dubious to say the least (moral relativism) - which means that you could argue it makes more sense in a business environment than in a mental health one (but remember point above about no evidence base). Some of the founders are VERY dodgy (one of them has been investigated for 2 murders, (of a prostitute, and his father-in-law).

Apart from that I think it's great.

Wouldn't wish to undermine your "psycho" who presumably has broader qualifications, but you've been seeing her for a while, and she's offered you 4 free sessions? What happens then?? I suspect she's paying the GP to use the surgery, rather than being the "psycho" that the GP uses.

Edited by MikeO996 on Friday 1st May 10:45

[tonyvid]

As I understand it, she will be using CBT and NLP elements together, I suppose taking the best out of both bits? The Surgery are trying this as a pilot and it is also under the observation of my GP(and at their suggestion)

My GPs use her as their Counsellor of choice and funded 6 sessions at the surgery. When that finished I had to see her privately. It's an odd one, it's not actually in the best interests of the Psycho to fix you as you can be a nice regular money stream but I am very aware of this. We can talk about stuff until the cows come home but I need something more fundamental to change the way my brain is set as it only has a past, the present is like that of a dog where you just do things at that moment and the future is sort of blank....

Thanks for all your advice, I am going into this with eyes wide open.

[davido140]

I got collared by a "health care professional" (translation "fking hippie") in reception at work the other day.

They had set out a little table selling thier crystals and crap.

Anyway, they grabbed me when I went for a fag and suggested hypnotherapy with NLP, I told them hypnotherapy was cack as I had tried it before and it didnt work, they rattle on about NLP so I make my excuses and did some googling.

Long and the short of it is, its a load of old bks, first emerged in the 70' debunked by the 80's.

[V8mate]

davido140 said:

I got collared by a "health care professional" (translation "fking hippie") in reception at work the other day.

They had set out a little table selling thier crystals and crap.

Anyway, they grabbed me when I went for a fag and suggested hypnotherapy with NLP, I told them hypnotherapy was cack as I had tried it before and it didnt work, they rattle on about NLP so I make my excuses and did some googling.

Long and the short of it is, its a load of old bks, first emerged in the 70' debunked by the 80's.

The only bks is what you just typed. I agree that there are plenty of the "fking hippes" you describe who certainly do "rattle on about NLP", but they are no different to the idiots on here who "rattle on about" cars they've never driven.

NLP has been incredibly successful in the business world, especially in sales (business to business and consumer), negotiation, general management and partnership working. It has also had proven success with many (not all!) people who have used it to treat conditions ranging from post-traumatic stress issues to dyslexia to weight-loss/smoking cessation/phobias.

As with any psychology, it's an easy bandwagon for people to jump on and profess credentials they don't have, but at the professional end, it's a powerful tool.

Don't dismiss what you don't understand. (And don't believe everything Google results tell you either!)

[tonyvid]

Which was why I asked about personal opinions of it rather than the wonderful world of Google, I would rather have the opinion of those in the know(and there are PHers who do) and people who had experienced it.

[davido140]

V8mate said:

davido140 said:

I got collared by a "health care professional" (translation "fking hippie") in reception at work the other day.

They had set out a little table selling thier crystals and crap.

Anyway, they grabbed me when I went for a fag and suggested hypnotherapy with NLP, I told them hypnotherapy was cack as I had tried it before and it didnt work, they rattle on about NLP so I make my excuses and did some googling.

Long and the short of it is, its a load of old bks, first emerged in the 70' debunked by the 80's.

The only bks is what you just typed. I agree that there are plenty of the "fking hippes" you describe who certainly do "rattle on about NLP", but they are no different to the idiots on here who "rattle on about" cars they've never driven.

NLP has been incredibly successful in the business world, especially in sales (business to business and consumer), negotiation, general management and partnership working. It has also had proven success with many (not all!) people who have used it to treat conditions ranging from post-traumatic stress issues to dyslexia to weight-loss/smoking cessation/phobias.

As with any psychology, it's an easy bandwagon for people to jump on and profess credentials they don't have, but at the professional end, it's a powerful tool.

Don't dismiss what you don't understand. (And don't believe everything Google results tell you either!)

Sounds like you need to rearrange your healing crystals and listen to some whale music.

Tell you what, I'll go for some NLP to help me quit smoking, if it doesnt work you pick up the bill? money where your mouth is?

ETA if it does work, I'll double the fee and give that to you!

ETA hell, in for a penny, I'll even go for the lose weight, make yourself a millionaire, stress relief and better punctuation sessions, (ok I might have make a couple of those up).

Edited by davido140 on Friday 1st May 16:44

[drivin_me_nuts]

davido140 said:

V8mate said:

davido140 said:

I got collared by a "health care professional" (translation "fking hippie") in reception at work the other day.

They had set out a little table selling thier crystals and crap.

Anyway, they grabbed me when I went for a fag and suggested hypnotherapy with NLP, I told them hypnotherapy was cack as I had tried it before and it didnt work, they rattle on about NLP so I make my excuses and did some googling.

Long and the short of it is, its a load of old bks, first emerged in the 70' debunked by the 80's.

The only bks is what you just typed. I agree that there are plenty of the "fking hippes" you describe who certainly do "rattle on about NLP", but they are no different to the idiots on here who "rattle on about" cars they've never driven.

NLP has been incredibly successful in the business world, especially in sales (business to business and consumer), negotiation, general management and partnership working. It has also had proven success with many (not all!) people who have used it to treat conditions ranging from post-traumatic stress issues to dyslexia to weight-loss/smoking cessation/phobias.

As with any psychology, it's an easy bandwagon for people to jump on and profess credentials they don't have, but at the professional end, it's a powerful tool.

Don't dismiss what you don't understand. (And don't believe everything Google results tell you either!)

Sounds like you need to rearrange your healing crystals and listen to some whale music.

Tell you what, I'll go for some NLP to help me quit smoking, if it doesnt work you pick up the bill? money where your mouth is?

ETA if it does work, I'll double the fee and give that to you!

ETA hell, in for a penny, I'll even go for the lose weight, make yourself a millionaire, stress relief and better punctuation sessions, (ok I might have make a couple of those up).

Edited by davido140 on Friday 1st May 16:44

substitute NLP for pretty much any other process, scientific, pseudoscientific or even alternative and you have a great rant.

Some processes work for some people some of the time. Notice some. Sometimes, psychology works, sometimes psychiatry works, sometimes councelling, sometimes will power alone. To dismiss something out of hand carte blanche and say in effect that "it's all bks cos I don't believe it" ... some would say that says more about you than the processes themselves.

There are many many processes that are used by people throught the world. Yes, some work by the placebo effect, no doubt about it, but some also really do work.. for SOME PEOPLE

NLP works for some of the people, some of the time. I neither condemn it nor praise it. It is just another tool in a toolkit that helps people improve their life. Take from it what you want, or leave it if you choose.

WRT your smoking, perhaps a little willpower and self dicipline on your part will help you get over the nicotine additcion and perhaps occupying your smoking hand with something positive whilst you try to break your addictive behaviour would be a suggetion.

HTH - no charge.

[davido140]

drivin_me_nuts said:

perhaps occupying your smoking hand with something positive

I think you're right it says a lot about me though, I'm a cynical, sceptical old fart!

Slight diversion, stopping smoking is relatively easy, its the not starting again 6 months down the line I find hard, perhaps adressing the catalysts for me starting again would be most positive for me.

[MikeO996]

[quote=V8mate
NLP has been incredibly successful in the business world, especially in sales (business to business and consumer), negotiation, general management and partnership working. It has also had proven success with many (not all!) people who have used it to treat conditions ranging from post-traumatic stress issues to dyslexia to weight-loss/smoking cessation/phobias.

[/quote]

Show me the evidence (there isn't any)

[dreamer75]

I had a car crash a few years ago which caused me a lot of problems - extreme anxiety while driving, all sorts of stuff.

Doc just prescribed me tablets which turned me into a mong, tried a hypnotherapist, then a friend who is into cars tried a bit of NLP on me. Haven't looked back since then, it just sort of went away!

Whether it was me wanting it to go away, placebo effect, whatever it was, it seemed to do the trick.

[flyingjase]

I'm an NLP Practioner and I can say that it does work, but only if you want it to! I've used it in a business and personal context including a random waitress one night at the Hard Rock Cafe, who's mood I completely changed within minutes.

The bootom line is, as one of the other posters has pointed out, NLP is one of several tools to help people. It's not right for everyone but then nor are most things.

All I wouild say, forget what anyone says on here, go make your own mind up, what's the worse that could happen?

[mybrainhurts]

flyingjase said:

I'm an NLP Practioner ....

The bootom line is...

You exhibit confusion between boobs and bums...

Suggest you treat yourself...


Come on, admit it, it's all American borrocks, isn't it...?

[flyingjase]

mybrainhurts said:

flyingjase said:

I'm an NLP Practioner ....

The bootom line is...

You exhibit confusion between boobs and bums...

Suggest you treat yourself...


Come on, admit it, it's all American borrocks, isn't it...?

Woops, looks like I need to NLP myself!!!!!

Distil NLP down and it is looking at things in a different way, as do other techiques badged differently. NLP provides exercises to do this and if that helps someone then great, if it doesn't then they can try something else.

But yes, I can see why people think it's OTT - it can be quite evangelical when used by some people.

[davido140]

flyingjase said:

it does work, but only if you want it to!

That is pretty much admission that its just a placebo effect.

A spanner doesnt only work only "if you want it to"

A powerful drug will not fail because the patient "didnt want to recover enough"

do you really think when your car wont start on a cold morning and you pat the dash saying "go on girl you can do it, start!" and it starts, the little chat you had with the car actually helped?

ETA not heard anything back about the wager I suggested, I WANT to give up smoking, for whatever reason I dont seem able, I'm a pussy, a weak willed prick, whatever.

Now, not WANTING it to work and thinking it WONT are two different things if I'm not mistaken.

I went to a hypnotherapist before, darkened room, headphones on, he spoke to me through headphones over wave noises. It was utter cack. To be fair I didnt smoke for 2 weeks afterwards, but that was mainly because I Couldnt afford to after having just spunked £200 on a hypnotherapist. I went with an open mind, I wanted it to work, and it didn't.

So how is Hypnotherapy with NLP so magically different?

I just dont think shelling out £300 for a hypnotherapy session with NLP is going to do much more than make me £300 poorer, I would happily pay £1000 if it was a GUARANTEE of stopping smoking for good. hence the offer of a wager. perhaps you would like to take me up on it Jase? you could even perform the session yourself to make sure its done to your standards?

Edited by davido140 on Monday 4th May 10:08

[flyingjase]

davido140 said:

flyingjase said:

it does work, but only if you want it to!

That is pretty much admission that its just a placebo effect.

A spanner doesnt only work only "if you want it to"

A powerful drug will not fail because the patient "didnt want to recover enough"

do you really think when your car wont start on a cold morning and you pat the dash saying "go on girl you can do it, start!" and it starts, the little chat you had with the car actually helped?

ETA not heard anything back about the wager I suggested, I WANT to give up smoking, for whatever reason I dont seem able, I'm a pussy, a weak willed prick, whatever.

Now, not WANTING it to work and thinking it WONT are two different things if I'm not mistaken.

I went to a hypnotherapist before, darkened room, headphones on, he spoke to me through headphones over wave noises. It was utter cack. To be fair I didnt smoke for 2 weeks afterwards, but that was mainly because I Couldnt afford to after having just spunked £200 on a hypnotherapist. I went with an open mind, I wanted it to work, and it didn't.

So how is Hypnotherapy with NLP so magically different?

I just dont think shelling out £300 for a hypnotherapy session with NLP is going to do much more than make me £300 poorer, I would happily pay £1000 if it was a GUARANTEE of stopping smoking for good. hence the offer of a wager. perhaps you would like to take me up on it Jase? you could even perform the session yourself to make sure its done to your standards?

Edited by davido140 on Monday 4th May 10:08

I don't make my living from NLP, so you're barking up the worng tree with me. I use it as a tool to achieve my personal goals and help some of the guys that work for me achieve theirs.

In your post, you are comparing mental v physical issues - that's not like for like (In NLP terms it's called a distortion)

Nobody on this planet could get you to give up smoking no matter how much you paid for the simple reason that you don't want to give up.

NLP provides a framework of exercises for someone to follow if they want to achieve a goal - it can't force you to do anything against your will.

The fact that placebo's work prove that the power of the mind works, and NLP is a tool that helps harness the power of the mind, but does it in a structured way rather than 'hope for the best' way

[tonyvid]

Thanks to all of you for your comments on this - it also forms a useful discussion so please carry on

Edited by tonyvid on Tuesday 5th May 23:06