Rumination: How to make it stop!
Discussion
I had a verbal altercation on a train about three months ago, which ended with the other party spitting at me. I really wanted to deck him, but I was on a packed carriage, and figured it would be a bad idea given the dozens of witnesses.
Worse things happen at sea, I know, but since then I’ve replayed this incident in my head at least daily. What could I have done differently? Wouldn’t it have been satisfying to smash his head in? I can feel my pulse rise, my anger rising and my fists literally clenching as I relive the moment time and time again.
It strikes me that this is a common theme in my life. There are maybe a dozen or so incidents like this—some less serious, some more—that I replay in my head, some stretching back more than 20 years. It could be something as simple as someone pushing in line in front of me. I know I should shake it off, but I just don't seem to be able to.
I therefore hate any sort of confrontation not because I’m afraid of the situation itself, just because I know it will stay with me for the rest of my life.
I think the root cause of this is low self-esteem and an inferiority complex. I’m always comparing myself to others, and I often feel inadequate when I do so.
Has anyone else experienced similar? And if so, are there any tips or techniques you’ve tried to make this stop?
Worse things happen at sea, I know, but since then I’ve replayed this incident in my head at least daily. What could I have done differently? Wouldn’t it have been satisfying to smash his head in? I can feel my pulse rise, my anger rising and my fists literally clenching as I relive the moment time and time again.
It strikes me that this is a common theme in my life. There are maybe a dozen or so incidents like this—some less serious, some more—that I replay in my head, some stretching back more than 20 years. It could be something as simple as someone pushing in line in front of me. I know I should shake it off, but I just don't seem to be able to.
I therefore hate any sort of confrontation not because I’m afraid of the situation itself, just because I know it will stay with me for the rest of my life.
I think the root cause of this is low self-esteem and an inferiority complex. I’m always comparing myself to others, and I often feel inadequate when I do so.
Has anyone else experienced similar? And if so, are there any tips or techniques you’ve tried to make this stop?
I'd suggest it's entirely normal to be incensed by a stranger spitting in your face. It's absolutely disgusting and it's assault. OP is rightly very upset. The upset will pass but meantime try to find something else to occupy your thoughts OP. Not easy maybe! I'd be very, very angry.
popeyewhite said:
I'd suggest it's entirely normal to be incensed by a stranger spitting in your face. It's absolutely disgusting and it's assault. OP is rightly very upset. The upset will pass but meantime try to find something else to occupy your thoughts OP. Not easy maybe! I'd be very, very angry.
That was at the end of the altercation, not the start!I have no useful advice: many humans drive me bonkers, but I remind myself that 50% of humans are below average….
I can relate to this. I grew up getting bullied, nervy, didn't want to fight.
Fast forward and I've gone the other way. I've been charged with assault, albeit for chinning a car thief, and put myself and a guy in hospital in January after I caught him f
king about with my work van in the middle of the night. I'm ready to go at the drop of a hat if I think I'm in the right. I admire you for holding back the way you did on the train. I'm embarrassed to say that I think I'd have got off the train at his stop and finished it without too many people about.
The best advice I can give is that behaving the way I do sometimes doesn't make you feel that much better than just letting it go. I'm still having physio on my hand after the January incident because his teeth punctured a vein in my hand when I was swinging at him. I'm self employed, lost work, and was threatened with a second prosecution, even though he threatened me in the first instance.
The balance is really not to pursue it if you won't gain anything from it. If you aren't under threat of physical violence yourself, or aren't having to protect your own property, don't let your pride over ride a peaceful outcome, the consequences sometimes are out of all proportion to the intent or necessity.
Just to be clear though, I'm as guilty as you of over thinking anything and everything. I can rationalise my decisions, but overcoming an emotional reaction is something I still find very difficult. Good luck finding a resolution and some peace of mind.
Fast forward and I've gone the other way. I've been charged with assault, albeit for chinning a car thief, and put myself and a guy in hospital in January after I caught him f
king about with my work van in the middle of the night. I'm ready to go at the drop of a hat if I think I'm in the right. I admire you for holding back the way you did on the train. I'm embarrassed to say that I think I'd have got off the train at his stop and finished it without too many people about.The best advice I can give is that behaving the way I do sometimes doesn't make you feel that much better than just letting it go. I'm still having physio on my hand after the January incident because his teeth punctured a vein in my hand when I was swinging at him. I'm self employed, lost work, and was threatened with a second prosecution, even though he threatened me in the first instance.
The balance is really not to pursue it if you won't gain anything from it. If you aren't under threat of physical violence yourself, or aren't having to protect your own property, don't let your pride over ride a peaceful outcome, the consequences sometimes are out of all proportion to the intent or necessity.
Just to be clear though, I'm as guilty as you of over thinking anything and everything. I can rationalise my decisions, but overcoming an emotional reaction is something I still find very difficult. Good luck finding a resolution and some peace of mind.
Edited by Heaveho on Friday 5th July 00:30
One thing that's helped me is understanding that there is no short term interim relief from rumination. Either you are in a position to solve the problem, or you are not. Anything in the middle ground, little tricks, replaying, rationalisation, nothing helps.
So if you can't fix the problem or change the past, then the other option is to not think about it. Perhaps you can't stop the thoughts entering but you can simply shut them down and not entertain them. But little tricks don't work
So if you can't fix the problem or change the past, then the other option is to not think about it. Perhaps you can't stop the thoughts entering but you can simply shut them down and not entertain them. But little tricks don't work
This kind of thing is a sort of post traumatic stress.
I was bullied badly as a kid and it made me stressed about every interaction or task. I'd literally go cold as intrusive thoughts about a situation years past paralysed me and I over reacted as a result.
I realised that I was becoming a bully and a tyrant too, because I feared not having control of every situation.
Exercise saved me, and learning to actually cry.
I cried a river, of anger, frustration and regret.
I learned to just not care about things that didn't physically hurt me.
I was bullied badly as a kid and it made me stressed about every interaction or task. I'd literally go cold as intrusive thoughts about a situation years past paralysed me and I over reacted as a result.
I realised that I was becoming a bully and a tyrant too, because I feared not having control of every situation.
Exercise saved me, and learning to actually cry.
I cried a river, of anger, frustration and regret.
I learned to just not care about things that didn't physically hurt me.
I'm sure you are not alone, it's easy to say try and put it out of your head and focus on something else, but I know from experience it is not easy.
Are you depressed generally, or is it just when these "flashbacks" come into your mind at any random time?
Thinking logically, regarding the train incident, it's in the past, there's nothing you can do now, it's always best to avoid conflict in situations like this, you never know if they are going to pull a knife out on you or something.
One of my sons is a police officer in a rough area, stuff like this, (and worse) is a regular part of the job, he just seems to accept it as part and parcel, I must admit I couldn't do it.
I'm pretty sure there will be several self help groups online, there are for most things.
Good luck, you have made the first step by talking about it, never ever bottle things up, it's good to talk.
Are you depressed generally, or is it just when these "flashbacks" come into your mind at any random time?
Thinking logically, regarding the train incident, it's in the past, there's nothing you can do now, it's always best to avoid conflict in situations like this, you never know if they are going to pull a knife out on you or something.
One of my sons is a police officer in a rough area, stuff like this, (and worse) is a regular part of the job, he just seems to accept it as part and parcel, I must admit I couldn't do it.
I'm pretty sure there will be several self help groups online, there are for most things.
Good luck, you have made the first step by talking about it, never ever bottle things up, it's good to talk.
I would say lean into whatever your subconscious is telling you in a productive way and go from there. Is there a theme? Some sort of training around assertiveness and conflict resolution? Self defence classes, Krav Maga, Aikido or whatever?
Therapy could also be an option, if as you say, you think its caused by low self esteem. One of my colleagues suffers from this, it really does stop him from living his full life. He saw a therapist through the company scheme, because he had imposter syndrome, but that only lasted 3 months. His therapist told him it wasn’t enough to get to the root cause and he should carry on privately, but he didn’t. Its multi dimensional with him though, carried through in his relationships, career and general life, rather than it being limited to a particular scenario around conflict.
I remember on the company grad scheme, most of the cohort grew in confidence as time went by, but he didn’t. It was really quite sad.
Therapy could also be an option, if as you say, you think its caused by low self esteem. One of my colleagues suffers from this, it really does stop him from living his full life. He saw a therapist through the company scheme, because he had imposter syndrome, but that only lasted 3 months. His therapist told him it wasn’t enough to get to the root cause and he should carry on privately, but he didn’t. Its multi dimensional with him though, carried through in his relationships, career and general life, rather than it being limited to a particular scenario around conflict.
I remember on the company grad scheme, most of the cohort grew in confidence as time went by, but he didn’t. It was really quite sad.
Edited by wyson on Friday 5th July 10:42
couple of things to try.
make a list of the things in your life you consider to be good, repeat them to yourself daily.
Make a list of things you would like to improve in your life, list them by priority and make a (realistic) plan of how to achieve them, enact the plan.
Think about the incidents that are bothering you, examine how if you had acted differently it would/could have panned out. eg if you had chinned the bloke and he fell backwards hit his head and died. Of if you had chinned him and he fell to the floor weeping and the whole train carriage had stood and cheered you for being such a champion etc. compare these against what actually happened.
I suspect you are replaying them because in your mind they feel unresolved, a bit like when you get part of a tune in your head and can't get rid of it, the best way is to listen to, or sing the full song.
make a list of the things in your life you consider to be good, repeat them to yourself daily.
Make a list of things you would like to improve in your life, list them by priority and make a (realistic) plan of how to achieve them, enact the plan.
Think about the incidents that are bothering you, examine how if you had acted differently it would/could have panned out. eg if you had chinned the bloke and he fell backwards hit his head and died. Of if you had chinned him and he fell to the floor weeping and the whole train carriage had stood and cheered you for being such a champion etc. compare these against what actually happened.
I suspect you are replaying them because in your mind they feel unresolved, a bit like when you get part of a tune in your head and can't get rid of it, the best way is to listen to, or sing the full song.
I would have thought that hypnosis would have been suggested. I have no experience of it myself, but perhaps others will have. It would be interesting to know if hypnosis is at all effective.
ETA: I'm talking about stopping the daily replay / negative memories, rather than behaviour change for future incidents.
ETA: I'm talking about stopping the daily replay / negative memories, rather than behaviour change for future incidents.
Edited by Chris Type R on Friday 5th July 08:56
Thanks all for the responses. There's a lot of food for thought here and I'll certainly take it on board, so thank you for taking the time to get back to me.
I think certainly exercise and some martial arts/boxing training would be a good idea. They're things I've been thinking of doing anyway. I'm a bit insecure about my physicality — I'm about 182cm so not short, but I'm a pretty unspectacular blend of skinny and fat, both at the same time
The rumination's not something that's holding me back in life—at least, I don't think!—and I'm not afraid of standing up for myself, but I almost never react correctly in my view. I either go in too strong (not with violence, I might add) and get people's back up or I'm too passive and let people walk all over me, so it's definitely something I want to address.
It's the injustice of situations that boils my piss too. It annoys me that train bloke will think he came out on top on the situation as I walked away, but I get the same reaction if I witness this sort of thing happen to someone else. Even dashcam videos can get my heart racing if there's a confrontation and some ahole gets away with bullying/harassing someone else. I just want to see them get their comeuppance, but of course they never do. I don't know what this says about me!
I think certainly exercise and some martial arts/boxing training would be a good idea. They're things I've been thinking of doing anyway. I'm a bit insecure about my physicality — I'm about 182cm so not short, but I'm a pretty unspectacular blend of skinny and fat, both at the same time
The rumination's not something that's holding me back in life—at least, I don't think!—and I'm not afraid of standing up for myself, but I almost never react correctly in my view. I either go in too strong (not with violence, I might add) and get people's back up or I'm too passive and let people walk all over me, so it's definitely something I want to address.
It's the injustice of situations that boils my piss too. It annoys me that train bloke will think he came out on top on the situation as I walked away, but I get the same reaction if I witness this sort of thing happen to someone else. Even dashcam videos can get my heart racing if there's a confrontation and some a
hole gets away with bullying/harassing someone else. I just want to see them get their comeuppance, but of course they never do. I don't know what this says about me!LR90 said:
Thanks all for the responses. There's a lot of food for thought here and I'll certainly take it on board, so thank you for taking the time to get back to me.
I think certainly exercise and some martial arts/boxing training would be a good idea. They're things I've been thinking of doing anyway. I'm a bit insecure about my physicality — I'm about 182cm so not short, but I'm a pretty unspectacular blend of skinny and fat, both at the same time
The rumination's not something that's holding me back in life—at least, I don't think!—and I'm not afraid of standing up for myself, but I almost never react correctly in my view. I either go in too strong (not with violence, I might add) and get people's back up or I'm too passive and let people walk all over me, so it's definitely something I want to address.
It's the injustice of situations that boils my piss too. It annoys me that train bloke will think he came out on top on the situation as I walked away, but I get the same reaction if I witness this sort of thing happen to someone else. Even dashcam videos can get my heart racing if there's a confrontation and some ahole gets away with bullying/harassing someone else. I just want to see them get their comeuppance, but of course they never do. I don't know what this says about me!
sounds familiar, I repress annoyance most of the time, so when I do go off its usually spectacularI think certainly exercise and some martial arts/boxing training would be a good idea. They're things I've been thinking of doing anyway. I'm a bit insecure about my physicality — I'm about 182cm so not short, but I'm a pretty unspectacular blend of skinny and fat, both at the same time
The rumination's not something that's holding me back in life—at least, I don't think!—and I'm not afraid of standing up for myself, but I almost never react correctly in my view. I either go in too strong (not with violence, I might add) and get people's back up or I'm too passive and let people walk all over me, so it's definitely something I want to address.
It's the injustice of situations that boils my piss too. It annoys me that train bloke will think he came out on top on the situation as I walked away, but I get the same reaction if I witness this sort of thing happen to someone else. Even dashcam videos can get my heart racing if there's a confrontation and some a
hole gets away with bullying/harassing someone else. I just want to see them get their comeuppance, but of course they never do. I don't know what this says about me!Gassing Station | Health Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff