New to rowing - what is progress?

[22]

I have a Concept 2 in the office - it's only me, so no suffering for others watching. 30 or 40 minutes is really all I can squeeze in. Hopefully I'll find some more time.

I tend to watch a YouTube video with intervals of hard rowing then a gentle row (perhaps 2-1), rinse and repeat etc. Usually sound off and music on.

So what's progress?

I know there is *some* progress as the exercises already aren't as tough, but no different to my new found enthusiasm to walk to the post office (rather than ask someone at work to go for me )

Am I looking to row 'further' over the same exercise in 30 minutes as I did before?
Should I make a note of the splits I'm doing? Push the resistance up (usually a 7 or 8).
Heart rate?
Srokes per minute - I've found myself sometimes going a little 'faster' than the video?
'Tougher' videos?
Ditch the videos?

If any of the advice involves buying a new gadget - I'm all ears!

[Slagathore]

Progress really depends on how serious you want to take it.

If it's just for general exercise and fitness, then I'd say progress would be seeing you heart rate come down over time, for the same workout. Which would be a good sign your fitness is improving.

I would get a Polar H10 chest strap and Polar Beat & Flow apps. really useful.

I think the rower will need a PM5 monitor and then you can connect Bluetooth to the app and the rower. Then you can use the C2 app - Ergdata.

You'll get tons of info to see how your progressing.

A good exercise is a 30,R20 - which is 30 minutes at stroke rate 20, which could be a perfect one for you with your time constraints. Set a baseline and then work on improving that. Or any interval set like 4 x 2000m with 90 second rest in-between etc.

I wouldn't bother putting the drag factor above 3-5 - you can check the drag setting on the app, there should be a video on youtube on how to do it. rough guide is around 120 for heavyweight males - no need to go any higher really unless doing a specific sprint or something.

Progress could also be getting lower splits from a lower stroke rate, but have to be really careful not to over-do it. Low rate and low split can load the back a hell of a lot and could cause injury.

But generally what I mean is if you're pulling a 2:10 at rate 24, a 2:10 at rate 18 should be comfortable and achievable after a while. Although technique plays a big part as well.

Best thing to do would just be to play around with a few workouts and get some base info and work from there.

I'm sure I read somewhere the biggest gains for someone who doesn't train like an Olympic athlete for volume, the best way to gain fitness is to work around top of zone 3 and in to zone 4. Otherwise, train lower and get the metres in.

[Louis Balfour]

22 said:

I have a Concept 2 in the office - it's only me, so no suffering for others watching. 30 or 40 minutes is really all I can squeeze in. Hopefully I'll find some more time.

I tend to watch a YouTube video with intervals of hard rowing then a gentle row (perhaps 2-1), rinse and repeat etc. Usually sound off and music on.

So what's progress?

I know there is *some* progress as the exercises already aren't as tough, but no different to my new found enthusiasm to walk to the post office (rather than ask someone at work to go for me )

Am I looking to row 'further' over the same exercise in 30 minutes as I did before?
Should I make a note of the splits I'm doing? Push the resistance up (usually a 7 or 8).
Heart rate?
Srokes per minute - I've found myself sometimes going a little 'faster' than the video?
'Tougher' videos?
Ditch the videos?

If any of the advice involves buying a new gadget - I'm all ears!

What are you trying to achieve?

[22]

Thanks Slagathore

Just trying to be fitter & healthier.

Crazy last 18 months with Mrs 22 my priority; turns out she's not going anywhere just yet, but I'm left with very little free time.

I'm absolutely at a place and time to make positive changes.

[Fergie87]

22 said:

I have a Concept 2 in the office - it's only me, so no suffering for others watching. 30 or 40 minutes is really all I can squeeze in. Hopefully I'll find some more time.

I tend to watch a YouTube video with intervals of hard rowing then a gentle row (perhaps 2-1), rinse and repeat etc. Usually sound off and music on.

So what's progress?

I know there is *some* progress as the exercises already aren't as tough, but no different to my new found enthusiasm to walk to the post office (rather than ask someone at work to go for me )

Am I looking to row 'further' over the same exercise in 30 minutes as I did before?
Should I make a note of the splits I'm doing? Push the resistance up (usually a 7 or 8).
Heart rate?
Srokes per minute - I've found myself sometimes going a little 'faster' than the video?
'Tougher' videos?
Ditch the videos?

If any of the advice involves buying a new gadget - I'm all ears!

I'm no expert but I bought a rowing machine about 18 months ago when I picked up an impact injury which meant running was limited. Initially it was just to be able to keep my cardio fitness up with no impact but it grew into more.

I started out with a decent level of fitness so thought it would be easy from to get go, I was wrong. The first thing I did was get on to row 5000m in place of a 15km run I'd usually be doing. It took me by surprise how hard it was, I was falling off the rower and tbh I didn't fancy doing it again. Before next time I decided to do a bit of research and found that drag factor 10 wasn't exactly for me and trying to row 30 s/m ws too quick. I've settled on drag factor 7 and I'm 5'11 and 75kg it's personal prefence I think. Technique also plays a huge part and mine was off. It was a bit of learning curve but over time I grew to love it and even being fully fit for running I haven't stopped. It has also complemented running far more than I expected with core fitness and increasing my threshold levels.

If you only have a max of 40 mins look to do intervals either 1000m warm up/down and 5x500m best effort with 60 seconds rest or 5 x 1000m 90 seconds rest depending on your fitness level. That would be plenty if you did a couple of 5000m+ steady rows keeping below 140bpm heart rate. If your not up to the 5000m yet then just do what you can and gradually increase by 10% a week.

As I said I'm no expert but it's what I did and ended up working my way to 50km a week and decent times from 5k to half marathon.

Currently I'm looking to start putting all my time into something else but still don't want to give it up. If you don't have one then a PM5 monitor and the concept app is very good. I wish I had known about it sooner.

Edited by Fergie87 on Monday 12th September 20:31

[Louis Balfour]

22 said:

Thanks Slagathore

Just trying to be fitter & healthier.

Crazy last 18 months with Mrs 22 my priority; turns out she's not going anywhere just yet, but I'm left with very little free time.

I'm absolutely at a place and time to make positive changes.

2k is the blue riband. Not sure how fit you are, but if the answer is "not very" start with the fan setting at about 5 and try for 10 minutes. Then 9, then 8, then 7. If you get to 7 you're fitter than 99% of people you'll see on a rower.

Then try these times keeping the stroke rate at 18. Concentrate on your legs, it's a pushing exercise not a pulling exercise.

30 minutes is a standard time on the pace monitor. 7000m is a good target to start off with.

Intervals are a quick and easy way to burn some fat. You can mix up the distance and rest, but 30s flat out, 30 seconds active rest for 7 sets is a convenient one. But the world is your oyster when mixing things up.

What is progress? That depends on the individual. But just looking like you can row a bit is a good starting point. There are loads of tutorials on Youtube. If you can find a big mirror and place yourself at 45 degrees to it, you can quite easily compare yourself to the "ideal" form.

Achieving a good 2k time has to be right up there. Providing you are able-bodied 8 minutes should come easily. 7.5 minutes you'll need to work for and 7 minutes will impress people in your average gym (just don't expect that it will down the rowing gym!).

[272BHP]

22 said:

Thanks Slagathore

Just trying to be fitter & healthier.

Crazy last 18 months with Mrs 22 my priority; turns out she's not going anywhere just yet, but I'm left with very little free time.

I'm absolutely at a place and time to make positive changes.

I don't want to sound unhelpful but if time is critical then I certainly would not waste it on a rower. Rowing is supplemental exercise at best and quickly gets boring, the minimal results will not help spur you on either.

Weights 2 x week combined with a running workout 2 times a week is a much better starting point and will quickly give visible and measurable results. If you cannot run then Couch to 5k it is and if you are not familiar with weights then get instruction.

Use the rower once a week for intervals and try and better your times.

[22]

Thank you all. Very helpful.

The 30 minute one I've been doing is SR 20, 22, 24, 26, 28, 28, 26, 24, 22, 20. 2 minutes at each and a minute of gentle 18 between. Today this was ~5500 metres over the half hour - resistance 7 on the wheel.

Yesterday was resistance 8, reduced as I struggled a bit with the 28 SR, (so sometimes do extra at 26 although was about the same on 7).

I've watched lots of vids about posture and technique - I think I'm about right. Might book a lesson with a PT at the office for a professional opinion. Had an op on my spine years ago, very conscious of injury.

Have a PM5, but the apps are news to me!

I can't run - low impact only. Rower has replaced a cross-trainer that didn't survive moving offices (a year ago ). I've bought a 2nd hand chin-up/dip bar and some dumbbells. I need something I can do quickly each day with minimal drama & fuss. I'm very driven though, so usually do something when I put my mind to it.

[Louis Balfour]

22 said:

Thank you all. Very helpful.

The 30 minute one I've been doing is SR 20, 22, 24, 26, 28, 28, 26, 24, 22, 20. 2 minutes at each and a minute of gentle 18 between. Today this was ~5500 metres over the half hour - resistance 7 on the wheel.

Yesterday was resistance 8, reduced as I struggled a bit with the 28 SR, (so sometimes do extra at 26 although was about the same on 7).

I've watched lots of vids about posture and technique - I think I'm about right. Might book a lesson with a PT at the office for a professional opinion. Had an op on my spine years ago, very conscious of injury.

Have a PM5, but the apps are news to me!

I can't run - low impact only. Rower has replaced a cross-trainer that didn't survive moving offices (a year ago ). I've bought a 2nd hand chin-up/dip bar and some dumbbells. I need something I can do quickly each day with minimal drama & fuss. I'm very driven though, so usually do something when I put my mind to it.

If the machine is quite new, put the resistance on 5 for now and leave it. Particularly if you have a suspect back, you don't want a high drag. You want to focus on form, you can change the workout by varying intensity. Later on (or if the machine is old and grubby), Google "Concept 2 drag factor" and see how to set it up properly (go for 125).

DON'T hire a random PT to show you how to row, JUST DON'T. I have met two in my life who knew what they were doing and one was an ex-varsity rower. Phone your local rowing club and ask if the in-house coach will give you a lesson in return for a donation to club funds. Alternatively, film yourself rowing and post it up here and we can take a look. There are plenty of rowers on this forum who know their onions (have a look at the 2k times posted in the sticky ^^^^)

I don't subscribe to the view that you should consider rowing a secondary exercise, especially if you don't have the full range of exercises available to you. If you cannot do other stuff it is a very helpful full-body workout and if you are using a Concept 2 with a pace monitor there is no scope for kidding yourself. What you see on the screen are the cold, hard facts.

[Ed/L152]

Expected progress depends on your starting point.

If your current level of fitness is quite low then doing anything with consistency will get progress. Get a bit out of breath for 30-40 minutes 3-5 times every week and you'll achieve 80% of fitness and health aims (in my opinion, I made those numbers up).

Measuring progress is another question. Unless you try for personal bests (for example, time for 2000metres, 5000metres, 10000metres, or distance covered in 30minutes, etc) then you'll need a heart rate monitor - where you'd see a lower average heart rate for the same effort row. Personal bests are fun but not necessary from a health and fitness point-of-view. Like many sports, but on the rower in particular, achieving personal bests is as much a mental battle as it is a physical.

At the beginning work on technique. Youtube is great for tutorials and workouts, e.g. https://www.youtube.com/c/DarkHorseRowing . Work on a consistent stroke and look up the common beginner errors to avoid (such as knee-bounce).

Rowers usually prefer the '500m split' unit of measuring power, mostly ignore Watts and completely ignore calories. The 500m split simulates how long it would take you to cover 500 metres if you maintained the same power for long enough, and the monitor will give you an updated read-out for every stroke. Lower is better and even a few seconds lower can be significiantly better. What should you expect? It's impossible to say - it's not something you should really compare between individuals, but it is something you compare between your workouts to track personal progress. It's a good idea to aim to maintain a steady split for a workout, so you need to get to know your ability to know what is a reasonable aim. It is also a good idea to maintain a constant stroke rate - as a beginner I would aim for 24-26. Rowers tends to favour lower stroke rates for longer sessions. High stroke rates are for personal bests, particularly over short distances. But stroke rate isn't as important as the split - it's the split that defines how much work you are actually doing. Maybe go for a constant 2m30s 500m split for 30 minutes to start with. If that's too easy try 2m25s, if it's too hard try 2m45s or 3m00s

I'd suggest 5 as a maximum for the damper setting. Personally I prefer a very low setting. It doesn't make much difference but 5+ is pointless for almost everyone.

The phone app Ergdata is the Concept 2 app which will record workouts, and you can easily program in the Concept 2 'Workout of the day' (WOD) as inspiration for something different every day.

Rowing is excellent exercise especially if you have less time. You can literally start within 20 seconds of deciding to do it (strip to pants and socks, HR monitor on, sit down and go. Plus a bit longer to get your phone set up I suppose!). Puddles of sweat can be a problem so you might need a towel on the floor underneath you. Done right it's not boring, but it does take a certain frame of mind. Maintaining a steady split and stroke rate, or maintaining a heart-rate zone takes almost constant concentratrion. For longer rows I prefer a video playlist over music. Early morning and very long rows I'll close my eyes and practically fall asleep.

Edited by Ed/L152 on Tuesday 13th September 10:17

Edited by Ed/L152 on Tuesday 13th September 10:19

[22]

Thanks everyone again, very generous with your time.

My first effort at the 30R20. Resistance 5. The ErgData thing says Drag factor 112 - I won't claim to fully understand this yet.

Initially it felt 'slow' at 20, but soon found a balance between pressure and speed. I didn't know how hard I'd find it later in the time so kept my projected at ~6000 metres and finished with 6050. Puts me firmly at the bottom of the 30 minute distance and 30R20 charts! At least I'm on there and absolutely will improve.

I did a couple of minutes before quickly realising I am hopeless at regulating my own SR at the moment. Put on a suitable video and started again. I have a tendency to speed up when adding pressure so plenty to work on.

Ed/L152 said:

At the beginning work on technique. Youtube is great for tutorials and workouts, e.g. https://www.youtube.com/c/DarkHorseRowing . Work on a consistent stroke and look up the common beginner errors to avoid (such as knee-bounce).

Yes, I've used this guy's technique videos and use his 30/40 minute exercises - thank you. Now I tend to have a video to watch in the corner of my eye for SR and music instead.

Louis Balfour said:

Phone your local rowing club and ask if the in-house coach will give you a lesson in return for a donation to club funds. Alternatively, film yourself rowing and post it up here and we can take a look.

Good shout - certainly the one that doesn't involve filming myself

Louis Balfour said:

There are plenty of rowers on this forum who know their onions

That much is clear and, once again, many thanks to all who have contributed.

[Louis Balfour]

Filming yourself and posting the footage here will get you free advice. What price your dignity?

[phil4]

At 6'3 you've got a mechanical advantage over short arses like me.

I used rowing as my near only exercise, doing 30 mins a day, every day, during covid. I lost 20Kg, and went from just obese, to just "normal" on BMI. My resting heart rate dropped noticeably, and my VO2 max went up nicely too.

For your own progress, try deciding what matters to you, there's lots of metrics you can choose, from distance in 30 mins (nice one on the >6k), to 2K times or even endurance marathons etc.
As others have said, don't bother with the damper over 5, it'll tire out your muscles before your cardio really has a chance. Then just focus on technique as you are, and see how you improve on whatever metrics you've chosen.

Of late I've been using Apple Fitness+ and following along their workouts. It's no different to the youtube ones, but if you've got an Apple Watch, your HR, rings etc gets popped up on screen. It also removes some of the boredom.

I'd also disagree with whoever said it was a "supplemental" form of exercise. Sure if you've a very specific criteria or sport in mind, it may not tick the box, but as it uses ~85% of your muscles, and gives you cardio workout, it's a pretty good "all in one".

[22]

Honestly, I wanted to jump back on for another session on Tuesday but thought baby steps for now. Wednesday I marginally beat Tuesday's 30R20 (had done 20 mins on dumbbells before hand). Today was back around Tuesday's time but, I've already walked 15,000 steps (well, pushed a lawnmower). Before I started today I thought I was going to row on and achieve 10,000m (without any pressure on time etc) but the 30mins felt about right. It doesn't feel like I'm really pushing yet, plenty of time as I get more familiar with my limitations.

Machine is in the office so might walk down over the weekend and try a distance without interruptions.

There's a lot more to this than a complete noob can find on YouTube - thanks all.

[Louis Balfour]

22 said:

Honestly, I wanted to jump back on for another session on Tuesday but thought baby steps for now. Wednesday I marginally beat Tuesday's 30R20 (had done 20 mins on dumbbells before hand). Today was back around Tuesday's time but, I've already walked 15,000 steps (well, pushed a lawnmower). Before I started today I thought I was going to row on and achieve 10,000m (without any pressure on time etc) but the 30mins felt about right. It doesn't feel like I'm really pushing yet, plenty of time as I get more familiar with my limitations.

Machine is in the office so might walk down over the weekend and try a distance without interruptions.

There's a lot more to this than a complete noob can find on YouTube - thanks all.

10k is boring and makes your backside sore. I am not a fan.

[gareth h]

There’s lots of really good info on the training section of concept 2 forum, forget about the numbers on the drag adjusting lever, all machines are different depending on how they are cleaned / maintained, as has been said start at 125.
I found a couple of 1 hour gentle rows and a 5 x 500mm interval set a week meant I didn’t get bored with rowing and kept progressing, and then mixed it up with some weights and cycling or running.

[CalNaughtonJnr]

How about a 'rugby test' every month or 2 to measure progress? When I was told about it a couple of years ago, it said that a Premiership rugby player should be able to complete it in 11 minutes or less;

1000m
3mins rest
750m
2min 30secs rest
500m
2mins rest
250m
2mins rest
750m

[phil4]

CalNaughtonJnr said:

How about a 'rugby test' every month or 2 to measure progress? When I was told about it a couple of years ago, it said that a Premiership rugby player should be able to complete it in 11 minutes or less;

1000m
3mins rest
750m
2min 30secs rest
500m
2mins rest
250m
2mins rest
750m

So rests total 9.5 mins, so surely the 11 mins you suggest doesn't include the rest, otherwise that'd be 1 min 30 to row 3250... nah.

11 mins to row 3250 means an average of under 1:41.5 for 11 mins. So yeah, that'd be quite a hard push, but makes sense.

[dirty doug]

Louis Balfour said:

10k is boring and makes your backside sore. I am not a fan.

I did a marathon on the C2 in 2016
About 3 hours 25 minutes
Now that was a numb bum…

[22]

Quick question. A few have suggested intervals 5x1000m with breaks etc. What SR am I looking for? It seems to me that reducing the SR and covering the same distance would be progress, but I'm at the start of this adventure.

For a newcomer, should I stick with a lower SR and push hard or just try and get each 1000m done as fast/hard as I am able?
And then the 'rest' period is this 18/20? and with any demand on split or projected?