Lost weight now need help building/define
Discussion
Hi
So I’m 6 foot 1, Around 2 years ago I lost over 3.5 stone over the course of 4/5 months on a low calorie diet, and since then I’ve been fluctuating from high 12’s to mid - high 13’s, currently 13 stone 6.
I’m now much happier although I feel too scrawny almost, especially my arms, and the mrs has told me she doesn’t find my school boy body attractive
I’m looking at joining the gym, my aims are to get fit and to build and then define muscle, I do not want the bulky body builder look, instead I want the toned/defined look with abs, but first I need the muscle to define.
I say I have another stone of body fat I’d like rid off (mainly around my Stomach, would it be best to lose this first or will I lose this fat whilst proceeding for my new target, or will any new muscle sit behind the fat further empathising the fact it’s there?
Second, what do I do about calories? I’ve used to being in a deficit (1500cal), how do I ensure any surplus is going into rebuilding my muscles and not getting stored back as fat?
One other thing, I’d like to stay as light as I can, as I have hobbies which weight comes as a disadvantage although my main priority is being happy within my own body, so although I know gaining muscle will make me heavier, I still have fat weight to lose so I’m hoping losing one and gaining the other will balance things out slightly.
So I’m 6 foot 1, Around 2 years ago I lost over 3.5 stone over the course of 4/5 months on a low calorie diet, and since then I’ve been fluctuating from high 12’s to mid - high 13’s, currently 13 stone 6.
I’m now much happier although I feel too scrawny almost, especially my arms, and the mrs has told me she doesn’t find my school boy body attractive
I’m looking at joining the gym, my aims are to get fit and to build and then define muscle, I do not want the bulky body builder look, instead I want the toned/defined look with abs, but first I need the muscle to define.
I say I have another stone of body fat I’d like rid off (mainly around my Stomach, would it be best to lose this first or will I lose this fat whilst proceeding for my new target, or will any new muscle sit behind the fat further empathising the fact it’s there?
Second, what do I do about calories? I’ve used to being in a deficit (1500cal), how do I ensure any surplus is going into rebuilding my muscles and not getting stored back as fat?
One other thing, I’d like to stay as light as I can, as I have hobbies which weight comes as a disadvantage although my main priority is being happy within my own body, so although I know gaining muscle will make me heavier, I still have fat weight to lose so I’m hoping losing one and gaining the other will balance things out slightly.
My advice would be to get as strong/muscular as possible with a basic routine that incorporates multi joint compound movements.
There are plenty about but ultimately if you’re doing squats, bench, deadlift, row etc regularly and are progressively increasing the weight while eating well you’ll get more muscular and stronger.
Consistency is the key, you just need to stick at whatever routine you choose and keep pushing yourself.
In your shoes I’d start now and make sure you’re eating a high protein diet while trying to cut out sugar/processed food as much you can manage.
You will not have to worry about getting too big. It’s very difficult to put muscle on naturally beyond a certain point without steroids so just do as much as you can and there is no chance you’ll accidentally end up looking like a bodybuilder.
There are plenty about but ultimately if you’re doing squats, bench, deadlift, row etc regularly and are progressively increasing the weight while eating well you’ll get more muscular and stronger.
Consistency is the key, you just need to stick at whatever routine you choose and keep pushing yourself.
In your shoes I’d start now and make sure you’re eating a high protein diet while trying to cut out sugar/processed food as much you can manage.
You will not have to worry about getting too big. It’s very difficult to put muscle on naturally beyond a certain point without steroids so just do as much as you can and there is no chance you’ll accidentally end up looking like a bodybuilder.
Trying to lose fat and gain muscle simultaneously is rather difficult as typically one needs a caloric deficit and the other a surplus.
I'd suggest you'd be best off losing the rest of the fat you want before trying to bulk up to avoid risk of stalling with both goals or ending up putting fat back on and losing motivation, especially if you're after abs, as they are 90% diet induced and only gonna start being visible <12% body fat.
That should mean that when you swap to bulking, you're starting from a fat level you are happy with and it will be easier to shift the fat again post-bulk.
It's worth starting at the gym regardless, working on technique and conditioning your body for training, but progress will be slow if you are still cutting.
As for calories, you can increase them slightly if training. The important thing is to keep them clean. Don't know what your diet currently is, but generally you want lots of protein and avoid processed carbs.
I'd suggest you'd be best off losing the rest of the fat you want before trying to bulk up to avoid risk of stalling with both goals or ending up putting fat back on and losing motivation, especially if you're after abs, as they are 90% diet induced and only gonna start being visible <12% body fat.
That should mean that when you swap to bulking, you're starting from a fat level you are happy with and it will be easier to shift the fat again post-bulk.
It's worth starting at the gym regardless, working on technique and conditioning your body for training, but progress will be slow if you are still cutting.
As for calories, you can increase them slightly if training. The important thing is to keep them clean. Don't know what your diet currently is, but generally you want lots of protein and avoid processed carbs.
To get a body builder's big physique, you need to regularly lift weights, lift heavy, eat 4-5 high protein meals a day, (probably need pharmaceutical help) and several years of dedication.
No one can get "big" in a few months - see actors getting superhero roles - they'll be lifting 4-6 hours a day with personal trainers and dieticians advising them.
For the OP - advise lifting heavy weights regularly, consistency is key. Do you have space for a small gym at home? Dip bars, pull up bars don't take up much space.
High protein diet. It takes longer to build muscle than to lose weight. So build muscle first, then diet. You may find you lose some fat when lifting anyway.
No one can get "big" in a few months - see actors getting superhero roles - they'll be lifting 4-6 hours a day with personal trainers and dieticians advising them.
For the OP - advise lifting heavy weights regularly, consistency is key. Do you have space for a small gym at home? Dip bars, pull up bars don't take up much space.
High protein diet. It takes longer to build muscle than to lose weight. So build muscle first, then diet. You may find you lose some fat when lifting anyway.
Ben-imhe8 said:
Hi
I do not want the bulky body builder look, instead I want the toned/defined look with abs, but first I need the muscle to define.
Both looks can happen overnight, just avoid the protein drinks if you don't want to turn into a mass monster like Arnie. I do not want the bulky body builder look, instead I want the toned/defined look with abs, but first I need the muscle to define.
Strudul said:
Trying to lose fat and gain muscle simultaneously is rather difficult as typically one needs a caloric deficit and the other a surplus.
Is...incorrect. One needs dedication, and knowledge of training protocols and basic nutrition. Whether it's difficult or not depends entirely on the motivation of the individual.wong said:
popeyewhite said:
Both looks can happen overnight, just avoid the protein drinks if you don't want to turn into a mass monster like Arnie.
With all due respect, I don't think it can happen overnight. 
popeyewhite said:
Strudul said:
Trying to lose fat and gain muscle simultaneously is rather difficult as typically one needs a caloric deficit and the other a surplus.
Is...incorrect. One needs dedication, and knowledge of training protocols and basic nutrition. Whether it's difficult or not depends entirely on the motivation of the individual.Why do you think experienced bodybuilders go through phases of bulking and cutting?
It doesn't matter how dedicated and knowledgeable you are if your diet is not appropriate, it's just science.
My diet so far has obviously been weight loss motivated, so I’ve focused purely on calories and not the nutritional content, fully aware this will need to change for my new goal.
Also I do not mean to offend the body builders, of course I won’t accidentally slip into that sort of physique, I just meant that I want to start with the correct techniques/ plan for my goal
from the outset and not go down the wrong route only to then have to backtrack if you know where I’m coming from.
Also I do not mean to offend the body builders, of course I won’t accidentally slip into that sort of physique, I just meant that I want to start with the correct techniques/ plan for my goal
from the outset and not go down the wrong route only to then have to backtrack if you know where I’m coming from.
Strudul said:
Why do you think experienced bodybuilders go through phases of bulking and cutting?
Well I could spend a long time on that, as I'm currently training a MR UK (and previous title holder), but you'd get a lecture on steroid use, anabolism/catabolism and nutrition.Strudul said:
It doesn't matter how dedicated and knowledgeable you are if your diet is not appropriate, it's just science.
Which you don't appear to have understood correctly. It's possible to increase lean mass with correct training and protein ingestion on a deficit, it's also easy to lose adipose tissue and retain lean mass on a calorie surplus, the key, as I've said, is correct protein supplementation and training. You need knowledge and dedication well beyond asking for advice on a car forum. Whilst people like you hand out negative bro science though the layman won't even get started.Ben-imhe8 said:
My diet so far has obviously been weight loss motivated, so I’ve focused purely on calories and not the nutritional content, fully aware this will need to change for my new goal.
Also I do not mean to offend the body builders, of course I won’t accidentally slip into that sort of physique, I just meant that I want to start with the correct techniques/ plan for my goal
from the outset and not go down the wrong route only to then have to backtrack if you know where I’m coming from.
For toning and building some decent shape I find that the HIIT stuff I do makes a big difference.Also I do not mean to offend the body builders, of course I won’t accidentally slip into that sort of physique, I just meant that I want to start with the correct techniques/ plan for my goal
from the outset and not go down the wrong route only to then have to backtrack if you know where I’m coming from.
I've still got weight to lose but do HIIT 3 times a week - all bodyweight/kettlebells/dumbells. The one I do is an over 30s mens group - coach led with around 15 people maximum so he's constantly wandering around coaching us all through
I've not got my diet right yet so haven't dropped as much weight as I would like, but definition in my legs/chest/arms etc and inches lost are definitely noticeable from it
popeyewhite said:
Strudul said:
It doesn't matter how dedicated and knowledgeable you are if your diet is not appropriate, it's just science.
Which you don't appear to have understood correctly. It's possible to increase lean mass with correct training and protein ingestion on a deficit, it's also easy to lose adipose tissue and retain lean mass on a calorie surplus, the key, as I've said, is correct protein supplementation and training. You need knowledge and dedication well beyond asking for advice on a car forum. Whilst people like you hand out negative bro science though the layman won't even get started.The "negative bro science" of the International Sports Sciences Association?
ISSA said:
Fat loss requires eating fewer calories than you spend each day. On the other hand, to gain muscle mass you need to consume more calories than you use.
First of all fair play for the weight loss!
10 years ago at 33 I was 18 stone and had spent my 20s overweight and unhealthy with bigger all exercise. I joined a gym, eat right and trained religiously for about a year and lost 5 stone.
Then I stopped the cardio side of things almost completely and tried to bulk, it didn’t last.
I found that trying to do one without the other too hard.
Eating enough clean high protein food is expensive (more so now I’d say) and the lifting got less frequent and the eating very frequent.
So I went back up to about 16/17 stone.
A month ago something clicked (at 43) and now I’ve been in my home gym for a month and can feel the fat going and some of the muscle returning. I’m already starting to outgrow the weights I have so I’ll be back in a proper gym for a couple of days a week.
I’d say in your shoes you’d need to maybe keep cardio to 25% and lifting to 75% and you should see more definition in your shape.
I’m no expert but at the beginning that’s how it worked for me, good luck.
10 years ago at 33 I was 18 stone and had spent my 20s overweight and unhealthy with bigger all exercise. I joined a gym, eat right and trained religiously for about a year and lost 5 stone.
Then I stopped the cardio side of things almost completely and tried to bulk, it didn’t last.
I found that trying to do one without the other too hard.
Eating enough clean high protein food is expensive (more so now I’d say) and the lifting got less frequent and the eating very frequent.
So I went back up to about 16/17 stone.
A month ago something clicked (at 43) and now I’ve been in my home gym for a month and can feel the fat going and some of the muscle returning. I’m already starting to outgrow the weights I have so I’ll be back in a proper gym for a couple of days a week.
I’d say in your shoes you’d need to maybe keep cardio to 25% and lifting to 75% and you should see more definition in your shape.
I’m no expert but at the beginning that’s how it worked for me, good luck.
Ben-imhe8 said:
Hi
So I’m 6 foot 1, Around 2 years ago I lost over 3.5 stone over the course of 4/5 months on a low calorie diet, and since then I’ve been fluctuating from high 12’s to mid - high 13’s, currently 13 stone 6....
...... instead I want the toned/defined look with abs, but first I need the muscle to define.
Everyone has abs, but for most of us they are covered in fat. I'm currently 5'11 and 70kg, my abs are just about visible - 4 pack at best, total body fat is around 17%, I recon I need to loss another 3-5kg and hit 15% body fat or lower, for them to really 'show'. Not sure I have will power to do that, currently I've got a good balance between eatting health weekdays, and going nuts at weekends. To get hit 15% body fat content will mean been a scourge at weekends too for food/drink, a step too far for me. So I’m 6 foot 1, Around 2 years ago I lost over 3.5 stone over the course of 4/5 months on a low calorie diet, and since then I’ve been fluctuating from high 12’s to mid - high 13’s, currently 13 stone 6....
...... instead I want the toned/defined look with abs, but first I need the muscle to define.
6'1, I recon you need to be at 75kg before you have any chance to get any ab definition.
Edited by gangzoom on Monday 27th June 12:38
First join a proper gym. Ultimately, and ideally, one that has ballet dancers. My first gym instructor was built like Bibendum (the Michelin Man). He said that some of the strongest and supple people he had in his classes were ballet dancers. Don’t forget that flexibility exercises, Pilates or Yoga will be needed alongside. Start with lots of reps and sets first, then aim to ‘pyramid’ the reps as you increase the weights if you want bulk up muscle. Be prepared for collar size to increase!
For general fitness the old Royal Canadian Air Force 5BX plans are still good - designed for no equipment and can be done anywhere.
For general fitness the old Royal Canadian Air Force 5BX plans are still good - designed for no equipment and can be done anywhere.
Read/listen to Starting Strength by Mark Rippertone.
In a nutshell it's deadlift, back squats, bench press, military press and cleans. Increase the weight every workout if you can.
Yes, you'll need to learn proper form, so a friend or a PT is a good idea, but you'll need to learn proper form even if you're doing dumbbell, kettle bells or whatever. The benefit is that you only need to learn good form on a handful of exercises and not 20 as you would if you're doing exercises targeting specific muscles.
Finally, you don't need to eat a calorie surplus to gain strength. I've been in a calorie deficit all year and gained significantly on all my lifts.
In a nutshell it's deadlift, back squats, bench press, military press and cleans. Increase the weight every workout if you can.
Yes, you'll need to learn proper form, so a friend or a PT is a good idea, but you'll need to learn proper form even if you're doing dumbbell, kettle bells or whatever. The benefit is that you only need to learn good form on a handful of exercises and not 20 as you would if you're doing exercises targeting specific muscles.
Finally, you don't need to eat a calorie surplus to gain strength. I've been in a calorie deficit all year and gained significantly on all my lifts.
Just go to the gym and start lifting. Come back and eat lots, but not s
te. Don't go too mad on the carbs.
It really is simple to start with. You will start to see results after a few weeks. After a few months, if you've kept it up, then you can start to look a little more into your diet and focus more on adjusting your training to suit your goals. Don't over think it. Lift then eat, rest and repeat.
You only get 'toned' by breaking down muscle for it to grow repair and grow bigger and stronger.
Read and take in everything that poppywhite says.
te. Don't go too mad on the carbs. It really is simple to start with. You will start to see results after a few weeks. After a few months, if you've kept it up, then you can start to look a little more into your diet and focus more on adjusting your training to suit your goals. Don't over think it. Lift then eat, rest and repeat.
You only get 'toned' by breaking down muscle for it to grow repair and grow bigger and stronger.
Read and take in everything that poppywhite says.
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