Public or State?

[car.chic]

Do Public Schools Represent Value for Money?

Apologies for the random topic, for one of my foundation subjects at uni we have to put forward a group presentation on a debatable topic of our choice we have chosen the debate of whether or not public schools are worth it and as a fair few of you on here do have children even if you do not have children you are most welcome to put forward your views, I'd be interested to know -

- Does your child attend a public or state school?

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?

- Did you attend a public or a state school?

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your childs education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?

Many thanks for anyones responses to this thread!

[TheEnd]

There are usually top State schools around, but you need to be good to get into them, those who can't have to pay.

[theaxe]

car.chic said:

- Does your child attend a public or state school?

Too young atm, but ultimately no.

car.chic said:

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?

I'd rather earn less and spend more time with my child.

car.chic said:

- Did you attend a public or a state school?

State

car.chic said:

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your child's education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?

Probably not but if you live somewhere where the state schools are rubbish then I can see why you'd take that option.

car.chic said:

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?

I don't see how. I think a lot of kids end up at private school because their parents can afford it and assume it's the best thing to do. There is huge variety in the quality of both state and private schools but personally I'd rather not pay twice.

[thehawk]

- Does your child attend a public or state school?
Probably not

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?
Various, I didn't go to a public school and I also feel that how your child turns out is more reliant on that childs natural talents and how the parents bring them up.

- Did you attend a public or a state school?
State

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your childs education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?
Not really, I think the standards of teaching are probably similar. They probably encourage certain things more, like extracurricular activities but good parents should be doing this with kids anyway.

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?
The big difference between public and state is not the standards of education IMO, but the networking opportunities that going to a public school may afford. I thin state schools provide a more grounded attitude to life.

[oldbanger]

car.chic said:

- Does your child attend a public or state school?

Neither yet. Shortly to start at the priciest nursery school in the area, but will then go to local state school as soon as old enough.

car.chic said:

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?

Ideally I would have had a Montessori school but too expensive and far to far away. Went for the expensive nursery because it had a good ethos and a can-do atmosphere, when other places seemed less interested in keeping the kids occupied, or had issues regarding cleanliness, space etc.

Why the state school? Because it's the only local school, it's a good school and because we can't afford private school (the nursery fees for before LO is old enough are going to eatr everything).

car.chic said:

- Did you attend a public or a state school?

Public school, though I was a scholarship pupil.

car.chic said:

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your childs education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?

If I could afford to pay of that and still manage the current pared down standard of living then I would be very inclined to look at private schooling. On my current wages then it;s state or nothing, though I'm lucky that the local school is good.

car.chic said:

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?

I do think that private schools make more of an effort to produce rounded individuals and to encourange/inspire their pupils. State school teachers get paid no matter how well their pupils fare.

[Flanders.]

State school as then they would be forced to interact with everyone in society from the poor to the rich, the thick to the clever etc. IMHO it gives people more life skills than a private school.




Not that I have any kids to worry about.

[thehawk]

oldbanger said:

Neither yet. Shortly to start at the priciest nursery school in the area, but will then go to local state school as soon as old enough.

This has always interested me - why do you think sending them to expensive nursery schools is a good thing? I was full of similar ideas when my son was born but after doing research I'm happy with saving the money. It seems that pre-school stuff is least important phase of a kids education, in fact the European thinking is that kids should be kids and not taught any formal lessons at all until about 6 years old.

There have been a few studies done that seem to back this up. One tested school starting age and then compared the students at 16 years old, The late starters had equalled or passed the early starters. In fact the late starters were in countries like Japan, Switzerland and Scandanavian countries. Additionally another study showed that kids with too much early education in places were often more stressed out.

[anonymous-user]

I expect it depends on how good your local state schools are.

The advantages of public schools include, smaller classes, no constantly changing new labour target led education nonsense, teachers can easily remove unrully pupils, higher expectation from pupils, often better facilities, better links to the best secondary schools and universities,

Advantages of state schools are that it's free and possibly a wider range of pupils go there (which is not always a good thing).

Clearly there are some excellent state schools but unless you live near one, on average the public schools will provide better results and a more rounded education. I'd certainly educate my children at a public school day school because I would want to provide the best opportunities and wasn't in the tiny minority who had top state schools in their area.

The brighest children will do well in most schools.

[Corpulent Tosser]

theaxe said:

car.chic said:

- Does your child attend a public or state school?

Both attended state schools

car.chic said:

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?

The state schools in the area had a decent reputation, I did not consider the additional outlay to be value for money, though if I had lived in a different area where the schools were not so good I may have taken a different approach

car.chic said:

- Did you attend a public or a state school?

State

car.chic said:

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your child's education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?

They are worth paying if the state schools are badly inferior, though it could, and indeed should be argued that all state schools should be brought to a good standard, and that a tax rebate should be paid to those paying for their child's private education

car.chic said:

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?

I don't know as I went to a state school but it may be that the public school education may better prepare some children for some aspects of life, depending of course on what they do after they leave school.

[Coco H]

Does your child attend a public or state school? Will go to state (CofE) primary and then will consider

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice? No decent prep schools within 10 miles

- Did you attend a public or a state school?
Public school from the age of 3

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your childs education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?
Depends on the child - some children really benefot from smaller class sizes. Also depends on the state schools you can send your child too - some are truly awful but some are excellent

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?
It depends on the school and who you meet there. I met a lot of interesting and varied people from school - all have very high calibre jobs now - suregons, barristers, professors etc. But they were a motivated bunch. Some people who went to my school are still dossing about in their 30s

[Mr POD]

car.chic said:

- Does your child attend a public or state school?

State.

car.chic said:

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?

1) Can't afford public
2) I believe in GOOD education for all.
3) Distance
4) The type of people they would meet, would be biased to one social group

car.chic said:

- Did you attend a public or a state school?

State

car.chic said:

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your child's education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?

Probably not but if you live somewhere where the state schools are rubbish then maybe you should move or campaign for better schools.

car.chic said:

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?

You meet people like yourself and never get to meet anyone less financially fortunate.

[oldbanger]

thehawk said:

oldbanger said:

Neither yet. Shortly to start at the priciest nursery school in the area, but will then go to local state school as soon as old enough.

This has always interested me - why do you think sending them to expensive nursery schools is a good thing? I was full of similar ideas when my son was born but after doing research I'm happy with saving the money. It seems that pre-school stuff is least important phase of a kids education, in fact the European thinking is that kids should be kids and not taught any formal lessons at all until about 6 years old.

There have been a few studies done that seem to back this up. One tested school starting age and then compared the students at 16 years old, The late starters had equalled or passed the early starters. In fact the late starters were in countries like Japan, Switzerland and Scandanavian countries. Additionally another study showed that kids with too much early education in places were often more stressed out.

Well it goes like this:
of those with places between my home and place of work the cheapest nursery was dirty with rusty baby gates etc, 2nd cheapest was good but restricted opening hours and it would be very tight, 3rd cheapest starts winding down at about 3pm and when I visited at about 3.30 they had 5 kids left and were making them sit quietly in a circle with their coats on and all toys pens pencils etc had already been packed away (I'd probably be collecting about 5.30pm), 4th in terms of price was also good but I'd have to send packed lunch, so that was that - I went for the expensive one with long opening hours, all meals provided and so on.

I may have to reconsider of course as they've already put the prices up.

[turbobloke]

- Does your child attend a public or state school?
All attended state schools

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?
The area we live is selective and grammar school places were available via the 11+

- Did you attend a public or a state school?
State school

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your childs education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?
If there are no good state schools available, and if the independent (public) school is good, then yes, cheap at the price.

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?
In general yes, as the process pupils undergo tends to be education rather than crowd control, and resourcing is better. However the best recommendation for independent schools to me is their independence from government control, even the degree available today.

[A.Wang]

car.chic said:

Does your child attend a public or state school?

I'm also too young to answer that, being in my mid-20s...

car.chic said:

What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?

I am speculating on my parents' reasons and motivation, and reflecting on the positive aspects of what I experienced:

- smaller class sizes, so kids get more attention from teachers
- teachers are better paid and (in general) are more willing to provide extra help if needed
- organised sports and extracurricular activities, so kids are made to appreciate a wider range of experiences and to work as part a team
- all the kids have similar background, upbringing and values, so easier to mix and make friends
- kids learn to live with people from a young age, especially those they don't necessarily like
- kids are taught to be independent (as the phrase "Public School" is used, I'm presuming boarding here - there aren't any non-boarding ones from the original list of 9)
- and, in all seriousness, the "old boys network"

car.chic said:

Did you attend a public or a state school?

Public

car.chic said:

In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your childs education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?

Definitely, I would gladly pay twice that (which is what my old school is currently charging per term) for my kids to have the same education as I did, and for the reasons listed above

car.chic said:

Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?

I can't comment on whether my education gave me any real tangible advantage, however from interview feedbacks (both for uni and for jobs) I have been told that I come across as confident and self-assured (apparently in the nice way, I hasten to add). IMO Public Schools tend to better prepare people to be confident individuals - as demonstrated by this thread, I have no problem answering questions on topics I don't fully understand!

Edited by A.Wang on Monday 23 March 14:21

[bertie]

I have had this dilema myself.

I had a place reserved at 2 public schools for when he was due to start as you want the best, and paying must be better, right?

However, we then moved and in the village we have a superb church school, and having viewed the 2 private schools and then the local church one, decision made, the local church state school had a much better feel, great results as good if not better than the 2 private ones.

Plus, at a young age, I decided a lot of it is about social development, and having friends about he can walk to and sees around the village was an important factor.


I know of 2 other kids at private schools, and unless their parents arrange to take them in the car to a pre-arranged "play" they never see any other kids they know as the kids are from all over the county.

Plus I want my kids to be grounded, some of the ones I know from private are so snooty it is untrue.
Witness the one who said to a decorator they had in, "what's it like being a workman?" nearly got his block knocked off!

IMHO

[Benny Saltstein]

My son is 18 months so some way off going to school but we are rather surprised at our friends who're already putting their bundle of joy's name down at St Toff's Academy for Little Lord Snooty.

I went to a fee paying boys Grammar school in one of the larger northern cities and have to say that if that school still existed in the same state when I attended, then I wouldn't hesitate to find the money and send him there.

My wife went to state school in the South and I would say did better academically than myself. My father in law takes great pleasure in the fact he didn't spend a penny on both his daughter's education and yet they have both done well in life.

My old school was really good at getting the best out of every pupil, whatever their ability and I don't think I would have done so well otherwise. I think this is what you pay for. The sad thing is that since the demise of the assisted place scheme, the socio-economic makeup of most fee paying schools is fairly one dimensional.

[BoRED S2upid]

A friend of mine was brought up on a rough council estate went to the same school as me ended up with a PHD from Cambridge via Exeter and Manchester Universities so wether they are worth it or not if your clever enough it will not prevent your kids from getting to the best Uni's via alternative routes.

[Fatrat]

car.chic said:

- Does your child attend a public or state school?

Public

- What were the reasons / motivations behind this choice?

No decent state schools;smaller classes; individual attention

- Did you attend a public or a state school?

State

- In your opinion are fees of say £5000 per term (give or take) worth paying for your childs education when they are legally entitled to a free state provided education?

Much as I resent paying twice its my money and my choice and if I really resented it that much I could always send him to a state school (but I won't)

- Does the public school environment prepare a child for adult life / further education and work better than a state provided education?

It obviously varies between children/schools. Certainly I feel it does for our child otherwise I would not be paying £15K a year that I don't need to do. HTH

Many thanks for anyones responses to this thread!