Things you always wanted to know the answer to [Vol. 5]
Discussion
Gargamel said:
What do men who buy shirts with pockets keep in them. And why are they so prevalent? when they look s
t ?
I find a shirt pocket can be a useful place to keep a phone, but in that case the button is pointless.t ?On work shirts I used to keep my pass in a shirt pocket to stop it swinging around on the lanyard but I use a retractable clip one on my belt instead now. Again a button on the shirt is pointless though.
I have very occasionally used a button shirt pocket to keep a bank card in when going out, but these days with Garmin/Google pay that's not needed either.
Gargamel said:
What do men who buy shirts with pockets keep in them?
Casual shirts have pockets, smart shirts don't. Casual shirts are often worn without a jacket, smart shirts are worn with a jacket...which has its own pockets.To answer your question, glasses, a pen (schoolteacher), passport and tickets if travelling.
I think it's just that the trend is for casual shirts to have pockets.
Gargamel said:
That doesn't answer my questions though - also they are [shudder] short sleeved. I am not Australian.
thats your issue right there long sleeves! casual long sleeve are really not great style wise they really died in the 90's and 00's
ralph lauren do some long sleeve non pocket non button collar shirts but they look like a very specific person would wear them
Edited by Trustmeimadoctor on Wednesday 3rd July 14:11
popeyewhite said:
Gargamel said:
What do men who buy shirts with pockets keep in them?
Casual shirts have pockets, smart shirts don't. Casual shirts are often worn without a jacket, smart shirts are worn with a jacket...which has its own pockets.To answer your question, glasses, a pen (schoolteacher), passport and tickets if travelling.
I think it's just that the trend is for casual shirts to have pockets.
Trustmeimadoctor said:
Gargamel said:
That doesn't answer my questions though - also they are [shudder] short sleeved. I am not Australian.
thats your issue right there long sleeves! casual long sleeve are really not great style wise they really died in the 90's and 00's
ralph lauren do some long sleeve non pocket non button collar shirts but they look like a very specific person would wear them
Edited by Trustmeimadoctor on Wednesday 3rd July 14:11
For the past three years, I've insured my car with Churchill. Reasonable premium that increased a little each year. Green Flag cover included. Not had any claim or any change to my profile. Renewal time approaching and they write to me to tell me that they won't be offering to renew the policy so f-off! (they didn't actually say that but they may as well have, not even a thank you for the business).
What has changed that has lead them to turn away what I would have thought is a safe and solid bit of business?
What has changed that has lead them to turn away what I would have thought is a safe and solid bit of business?
Not sure there's a correct answer to this other than "because numpties" but I thought about this as I was washing my baguette in the shower this morning...
Why do English or English-speaking people put on an accent when speaking in a foreign language? Some people also do it when using foreign words in the middle of English sentences.
I've never spoken to someone's who's first language isn't English who speaks English in a generic English accent? They just speak in their normal accent and if they mispronounce something I don't think "haha you're an uncultured idiot" like I do when an Englishman pronounces chorizo wrong.
Just another bizarre English idiosyncrasy?
Why do English or English-speaking people put on an accent when speaking in a foreign language? Some people also do it when using foreign words in the middle of English sentences.
I've never spoken to someone's who's first language isn't English who speaks English in a generic English accent? They just speak in their normal accent and if they mispronounce something I don't think "haha you're an uncultured idiot" like I do when an Englishman pronounces chorizo wrong.
Just another bizarre English idiosyncrasy?
horsemeatscandal said:
Why do English or English-speaking people put on an accent when speaking in a foreign language?
I'm not certain they do. You could be fluent in French but a French person would know you're British by the way you're speaking their language in the same way we would when a French person speaks English. It takes a very special level of linguistic skill to speak a different language without the accent of your mother tongue.
Accents associated with different languages are influenced by the way the words are formed and sentences, structured. For example, inflections play a much more important role in Swedish than they do in English so when it's spoken, there's more tonal variation; more 'up and down'. If you spoke Swedish you would have to follow this style. You also have lots more tongue rolling (which English speaker's aren't good at). An English person speaking Swedish would sound like they're speaking using a Swedish accent but to a Swede, they'd sound like an English speaker speaking Swedish (and probably failing miserably!).
From our perspective, it may appear that they're putting on an accent but is really just the tonal approach needed for a particular language.
Or, it may be an example of the standard British approach to conversing in a different language - speak English but in their accent
horsemeatscandal said:
Some people also do it when using foreign words in the middle of English sentences.
It's because those words weren't designed for use in English. It's quite difficult to say 'croissant' in anything other than a French accent and sounds weird and awkward when you do say it in an English accent. Same with café au lait, crème fraîche. Etc. Doesn't apply to all words and those it doesn't apply to tend to be those that sound the same in both languages... cliché, chic, bon voyage, etc.horsemeatscandal said:
Why do English or English-speaking people put on an accent when speaking in a foreign language? Some people also do it when using foreign words in the middle of English sentences
Surely accents are just minor differences in the way different people pronounce words. If you're learning a foreign language you pronounce words the way you hear them, so will naturally pick up elements of the accent of the person who thought you. For example I've met several non-Americans with a noticeable American accent because they either learnt English from an American, or grew up watching American films so learned to pronounce words how they heard them.StevieBee said:
horsemeatscandal said:
Why do English or English-speaking people put on an accent when speaking in a foreign language?
I'm not certain they do. You could be fluent in French but a French person would know you're British by the way you're speaking their language in the same way we would when a French person speaks English. It takes a very special level of linguistic skill to speak a different language without the accent of your mother tongue.
Accents associated with different languages are influenced by the way the words are formed and sentences, structured. For example, inflections play a much more important role in Swedish than they do in English so when it's spoken, there's more tonal variation; more 'up and down'. If you spoke Swedish you would have to follow this style. You also have lots more tongue rolling (which English speaker's aren't good at). An English person speaking Swedish would sound like they're speaking using a Swedish accent but to a Swede, they'd sound like an English speaker speaking Swedish (and probably failing miserably!).
From our perspective, it may appear that they're putting on an accent but is really just the tonal approach needed for a particular language.
Or, it may be an example of the standard British approach to conversing in a different language - speak English but in their accent
horsemeatscandal said:
Some people also do it when using foreign words in the middle of English sentences.
It's because those words weren't designed for use in English. It's quite difficult to say 'croissant' in anything other than a French accent and sounds weird and awkward when you do say it in an English accent. Same with café au lait, crème fraîche. Etc. Doesn't apply to all words and those it doesn't apply to tend to be those that sound the same in both languages... cliché, chic, bon voyage, etc.If I say crème fraiche, I pronounce it "crem fresh" rather than "cream fraych" but I don't do a dodgy French accent. It's easy to do correct pronunciation without an accent. The thought came to me, not for the first time, listening to a Tour de France commentator talking about Italian food and when naming dishes doing an almost Super Mario-esque accent but then speaking in an English accent for the rest of the time. When a German drops an English phrase into a sentence they don't do a Victorian-era cockney accent or something. Or do they, and I just can't pick up on it?
RizzoTheRat said:
Surely accents are just minor differences in the way different people pronounce words. If you're learning a foreign language you pronounce words the way you hear them, so will naturally pick up elements of the accent of the person who thought you. For example I've met several non-Americans with a noticeable American accent because they either learnt English from an American, or grew up watching American films so learned to pronounce words how they heard them.
That's true, I have noticed that people who are using English a lot as a second language tend to adopt an American accent, especially non-Europeans and I suppose I don't think that's daft. You can tell they're not American though, the same way a Frenchman knows when an Englishman is adopting a French accent as per above. horsemeatscandal said:
Why do English or English-speaking people put on an accent when speaking in a foreign language?
Because it makes you more easily understood. Simple Eg: In French, 'chips' is pronounced "Freet" with a rolled R). In an English accent, you'd say "Frits" or "Frights" or even, as I heard once, "Fritters", amd a French person will (pretend to) struggle to understand you.
Whenever I hear anyone say "Bon Jor" it makes me cringe.
I'm a native English speaker. Yet we have some very strange pronunciation.
For example, i is u, e is i or u, a can be i or not.
Deck becomes dick, eggs become icx, can becomes kin, seven becomes sivin and ten becomes tin. Fish and chips becomes fush and chups.
And then words have different meanings, a dairy is a corner shop. Doesn't matter if it sells dairy products or not. Sweets are lollies, whether there's any lolly or not. Flip flops are jandals (Japanese sandals) and the Aussies call them thongs.
All very confusing!
For example, i is u, e is i or u, a can be i or not.
Deck becomes dick, eggs become icx, can becomes kin, seven becomes sivin and ten becomes tin. Fish and chips becomes fush and chups.
And then words have different meanings, a dairy is a corner shop. Doesn't matter if it sells dairy products or not. Sweets are lollies, whether there's any lolly or not. Flip flops are jandals (Japanese sandals) and the Aussies call them thongs.
All very confusing!
I think there's a difference between using correct pronunciation of foreign words and adopting an exaggerated accent for no reason, which is something that my ears only hear English people doing. I can pronounce "Didier Deschamps" correctly without a French accent. My 'p' might be a bit harsh, but Europeans often speak using English words but their native letter sounds (e.g. a Spanish 'j' or a German 'w') and it's still perfectly understandable and basically perfect conversational English. I don't think they sound stupid, but I think English-speaking people think themselves stupid without trying really hard to sound like they're genuinely French, Spanish, etc.
British insecurity, clearly!
British insecurity, clearly!
Edited by horsemeatscandal on Thursday 4th July 08:56
I learned Norwegian while living there in the 70s. I wouldn't claim complete fluency but I got very proficient. Many years later I knew a Norwegian lady who had married a Brit and settled here. She liked to talk with me in her own language but, coming from Oslo, she thought my heavy Bergen accent was hilarious. I wasn't even aware of it.
Similarly Mrs 404s South American cousins are highly amused by my Andaluciano Spanish.
But I have no trouble being understood and that's the whole point of the exercise isn't it?
Except Newfies. No idea what they're on about even when they claim to be speaking English.
Similarly Mrs 404s South American cousins are highly amused by my Andaluciano Spanish.
But I have no trouble being understood and that's the whole point of the exercise isn't it?
Except Newfies. No idea what they're on about even when they claim to be speaking English.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
I'm a native English speaker. Yet we have some very strange pronunciation.
For example, i is u, e is i or u, a can be i or not.
Deck becomes dick, eggs become icx, can becomes kin, seven becomes sivin and ten becomes tin. Fish and chips becomes fush and chups.
And then words have different meanings, a dairy is a corner shop. Doesn't matter if it sells dairy products or not. Sweets are lollies, whether there's any lolly or not. Flip flops are jandals (Japanese sandals) and the Aussies call them thongs.
All very confusing!
I hail from 3 degrees Lat North of you & share those linguistic peculiarities. I reckon a lot of people speaking the same ( at least nominally) language understand people better in a foreign setting when they're familiar with that foreign setting's film & tv.For example, i is u, e is i or u, a can be i or not.
Deck becomes dick, eggs become icx, can becomes kin, seven becomes sivin and ten becomes tin. Fish and chips becomes fush and chups.
And then words have different meanings, a dairy is a corner shop. Doesn't matter if it sells dairy products or not. Sweets are lollies, whether there's any lolly or not. Flip flops are jandals (Japanese sandals) and the Aussies call them thongs.
All very confusing!
I can understand English & American ( seen loads of it on the tube, from Coro/ Trainspotting etc to Hillstreet Blues/ Clint Eastwood etc).
However, when I first went to USA ( Boston) I had to say everything 3 times, really slowly to be understood. Nobody in Boston has seen TVNZ product/ is familiar with Kiwispeak.
I've also lived in Germany, the regional differences are huge - same as within the UK. A Geordie sounds nothing like person from southern Kent. Having seen tv shows from both, I can understand both without difficulty. A former girlfriend from Denver couldn't cope with Trainspotting at all.
paua said:
However, when I first went to USA ( Boston) I had to say everything 3 times, really slowly to be understood. Nobody in Boston has seen TVNZ product/ is familiar with Kiwispeak.
That's a good point. Loads of people in the UK struggle to understand some of the stronger accents from other areas of the same country. I have to temper my Cumbrian accent in some places; it's not particularly strong but I've had a few confused looks before. Maddest English-speaking accent I ever heard was in Limerick. I love an accent but they're dying out. One of the many reasons I don't like going to Manchester anymore is because the Manc accent is disappearing and being replaced that generic, upspeak-y, university student voice. Felt a bit like that last time I was in Newcastle, made me sad.
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