Why are Americans so religious?

[MC Bodge]

As a nation, the mainstream UK is not very religious at all. The CofE may be the established religion, but very few people are devout CofE and it is barely relevant.

There are pockets of very religious people in the UK, though, adhering to different religions. Islam is quite prominent in some towns and cities, as is Judaism on a smaller scale. It would be interesting to know how much genuine belief there is and will be interesting to see whether religious/cultural adherence will reduce over time, especially over opportunities and freedoms for women

-Living alongside a virtually secular society as they do.

[AC43]

GuigiaroBertone said:

MikeM6 said:

CHLEMCBC said:

It hasn't though. It's held them back and is ultimately responsible for the sthole they find themselves neck deep in. If they were really Christians and not Old Testament fundamentalists masquerading as such, there wouldn't be tens of thousands of people sleeping in tents in every city.
z+-+-5wThe "American Dream" of selfish self-fulfilment and conning your way into a personal fortune by clambering on the backs of other lesser mortals was never Christian. Their worship of and allegiance to Mammon is evident to everyone but themselves.

Is that first hand experience of your travels across America?

it's pretty much my experience, I'm ashamed to say, although the UK is swiftly heading in the same direction.

I've spent at least a week (sometimes months) in 22 states now and I can't think of another Western country where there is such an egregious rich/poor divide.

If you can afford to live in a upmarket US suburb, the ambience and local facilities are far swankier than what you'll get in similar parts of the UK, but likewise if you're unfortunate enough to fall through the cracks, then the lack of a welfare state is all too apparent.

In every US city I've visited (apart from NYC very recently), rough sleeping was at epidemic levels. I remember driving out of Portland one February morning heading towards the mountains and almost every doorway, bus shelter and bench had some poor person sleeping rough.

I don't know what they're doing in NYC- i'm sure they also have their fair share of homelessness, but at least they are largely off the streets.

NYC is way too cold in winter so they migrate to California.

[Gordon Hill]

I don't get the connection between religion and being thick and ignorant. Many atheists are as thick as mince as well and just as loud and zealous. I know quite a few people who have a belief in an afterlife but are also highly intelligent. What I have noticed though is that a lot of them tend to avoid organised religion and don't belong to any particular denomination preferring a more spiritual based existence.

I keep an open mind because I simply don't know one way or the other, it's pretty arrogant to be honest to say that you know it's all bullsh#t, you haven't died yet and you've about as much idea as I have no matter how "forward thinking and enlightened" you may profess to be.

[MC Bodge]

Gordon Hill said:

I keep an open mind because I simply don't know one way or the other, it's pretty arrogant to be honest to say that you know it's all bullsh#t, you haven't died yet and you've about as much idea as I have no matter how "forward thinking and enlightened" you may profess to be.

Keeping an open mind is one thing.

Believing things that are only the product of others' imaginations to be truth, based only on faith (ie. Wanting to believe it), with no evidence of any sort, is another.

[Mercdriver]

MC Bodge said:

As a nation, the mainstream UK is not very religious at all. The CofE may be the established religion, but very few people are devout CofE and it is barely relevant.

There are pockets of very religious people in the UK, though, adhering to different religions. Islam is quite prominent in some towns and cities, as is Judaism on a smaller scale. It would be interesting to know how much genuine belief there is and will be interesting to see whether religious/cultural adherence will reduce over time, especially over opportunities and freedoms for women

-Living alongside a virtually secular society as they do.

So why are the CofE represented in the lords? Time they were booted out. I do not want ANY religious leader of any denomination dictating what I can or cannot do

[Gordon Hill]

MC Bodge said:

Gordon Hill said:

I keep an open mind because I simply don't know one way or the other, it's pretty arrogant to be honest to say that you know it's all bullsh#t, you haven't died yet and you've about as much idea as I have no matter how "forward thinking and enlightened" you may profess to be.

Keeping an open mind is one thing.

Believing things that are only the product of others' imaginations to be truth, based only on faith (ie. Wanting to believe it), with no evidence of any sort, is another.

Yep get that and personally it's not for me but if others want to believe that then they can crack on with no ridicule or condemnation from me. Can't personally go in for zealots who ram their beliefs down others throats but equally I can't be @rsed with professional atheists like Gervais and Dawkins either.

[InformationSuperHighway]

I work for a tech company and an employee of mine went to a sales meeting (Middle of the country) where the company they were selling to prayed at the start of the meeting for clarity, purpose and to guide the vision of the meeting in Gods eyes.

[MC Bodge]

InformationSuperHighway said:

I work for a tech company and an employee of mine went to a sales meeting (Middle of the country) where the company they were selling to prayed at the start of the meeting for clarity, purpose and to guide the vision of the meeting in Gods eyes.

They must have had some terrible meetings in the past if they were resorting to that.

[Bill]

It is bizarre IMO, but then the constitution is also a cult...

There's was a fascinating/horrifying documentary on (iirc) BBC4 recently about christian fundamentalism in the US. Part of the religious right are funding Jewish fundamentalists in the ME in order to provoke the fighting and ultimately Armageddon and the second coming.

Batst obvs, but the have money and guns...

[Steve H]

Gordon Hill said:

MC Bodge said:

Gordon Hill said:

I keep an open mind because I simply don't know one way or the other, it's pretty arrogant to be honest to say that you know it's all bullsh#t, you haven't died yet and you've about as much idea as I have no matter how "forward thinking and enlightened" you may profess to be.

Keeping an open mind is one thing.

Believing things that are only the product of others' imaginations to be truth, based only on faith (ie. Wanting to believe it), with no evidence of any sort, is another.

Yep get that and personally it's not for me but if others want to believe that then they can crack on with no ridicule or condemnation from me. Can't personally go in for zealots who ram their beliefs down others throats but equally I can't be @rsed with professional atheists like Gervais and Dawkins either.

More importantly, if many of us are wrong and god does exist, and this is the world he decided to come up with, god is a bit of a tt.


I’m gonna burn in hell for that one. Or not. Probably.

[Pitre]

Mercdriver said:

So why are the CofE represented in the lords? Time they were booted out. I do not want ANY religious leader of any denomination dictating what I can or cannot do

This. 100%.

[MikeM6]

Gordon Hill said:

Yep get that and personally it's not for me but if others want to believe that then they can crack on with no ridicule or condemnation from me. Can't personally go in for zealots who ram their beliefs down others throats but equally I can't be @rsed with professional atheists like Gervais and Dawkins either.

Richard Dawkins is primarily an educator, so rather than trying to force beliefs down anyone's throat, his work is mostly about freeing others from indoctrination by teaching them about reality. You may not like him, but his body of work is excellent.

[Silenoz]

Steve H said:

More importantly, if many of us are wrong and god does exist, and this is the world he decided to come up with, god is a bit of a tt.


I’m gonna burn in hell for that one. Or not. Probably.

I made that point to my Irish Catholic grandmother, who told me there was a special place in hell reserved for me. I replied "Good, you know I hate queueing"

[Red 5]

It’s just money.
It’s proven a highly effective way of funnelling money from the poor to the galacticly wealthy.
There is nothing to manufacture, and there never has to be any end product.

The more strange the religion,sect or cult, the more aggressively they fleece their believers.

If running a religion was as profitable as a market stand, it would die out.

[Zetec-S]

Bill said:

It is bizarre IMO, but then the constitution is also a cult...

There's was a fascinating/horrifying documentary on (iirc) BBC4 recently about christian fundamentalism in the US. Part of the religious right are funding Jewish fundamentalists in the ME in order to provoke the fighting and ultimately Armageddon and the second coming.

Batst obvs, but the have money and guns...

Yep, there's plenty of people wking furiously to the war in Gaza as it means Jesus will be on his way down any minute they can get more people to gift all their worldly possessions to their church and fund their preacher's luxury lifestyle.

[hidetheelephants]

Gordon Hill said:

I don't get the connection between religion and being thick and ignorant. Many atheists are as thick as mince as well and just as loud and zealous. I know quite a few people who have a belief in an afterlife but are also highly intelligent. What I have noticed though is that a lot of them tend to avoid organised religion and don't belong to any particular denomination preferring a more spiritual based existence.

I keep an open mind because I simply don't know one way or the other, it's pretty arrogant to be honest to say that you know it's all bullsh#t, you haven't died yet and you've about as much idea as I have no matter how "forward thinking and enlightened" you may profess to be.

Overwhelmingly believers today are monotheists, they believe all gods except one are false; why not finish the job, go one further and realise they are all false, at least in the sense of being entirely manmade?

[75Black]

If I had to compare America to a European country in terms of having strong believers, they're definitely similar to Poland. Except one county is Catholic, also the further out into the countryside you go in Poland the more religious people become, a lot like the US. In 2022 I took a mini roadtrip from Tampa to Charleston, SC. while also stopping in Savannah and I used to think the "REPENT NOW" etc religious billboards were a bit of a meme...then I crossed the state border from FL to GA and they suddenly started appearing, (more were in SC but still) and my radio stations when out of range tuned to one of these hyper Christian rock radio stations, definitely eye opening.

[732NM]

Red 5 said:

It’s just money.
It’s proven a highly effective way of funnelling money from the poor to the galacticly wealthy.
There is nothing to manufacture, and there never has to be any end product.

The more strange the religion,sect or cult, the more aggressively they fleece their believers.

If running a religion was as profitable as a market stand, it would die out.

It's tax free too.

[CHLEMCBC]

MikeM6 said:

Is that first hand experience of your travels across America?

I have a few dozen US acquaintances who consistently post drivel on socials and I watch a lot of political commentary. What's your first hand experience of travels across America?

[Wheel Turned Out]

Gordon Hill said:

I don't get the connection between religion and being thick and ignorant. Many atheists are as thick as mince as well and just as loud and zealous. I know quite a few people who have a belief in an afterlife but are also highly intelligent. What I have noticed though is that a lot of them tend to avoid organised religion and don't belong to any particular denomination preferring a more spiritual based existence.

I keep an open mind because I simply don't know one way or the other, it's pretty arrogant to be honest to say that you know it's all bullsh#t, you haven't died yet and you've about as much idea as I have no matter how "forward thinking and enlightened" you may profess to be.

Agreed - anyone who claims to know is a fool. Anyone who claims to know what'll happen to you too is a sinister fool.

For me it's a matter of likelihood. Do I know for sure? No. Can anyone? No. But I do know there was a period before I existed. And in that period I simply didn't exist. No "pre-life". Nothing. So it follows, for me at least, that there is no "afterlife", I will simply return to the state of not existing that I was in before.

It seems to me you made the point that there's no correlation between religion and intelligence. Which I agree with. But then made the point that some of the highly intelligent people you know who believe in an afterlife aren't really "religious", more "spiritual", which rather sounds like their intelligence leads them to find the rigidity of religious thinking stifling and so they prefer to try and find their own path.