Discussion
los angeles said:
For those of us without a copy, give us a few details, BCA. Ta.
You need to buy it still for the article + to see the new member of the fast fleet
so I will stay vague... It was in a big performance test;
0-100-0 it did pretty well, but not as well as I thought it would (especially considering the trick tyres)
Vmax it disappointed big time by not entering
Lap Time - disappointing considering the cars blindingly obvious hidden pace.
Gutted
The Corvette C6 Z06 was immense though, owned by a PH'er too... very impressive!
los angeles said:
The Corvette C6 Z06 was immense though, owned by a PH'er too... very impressive!
LA, they praise the Z06 extremely highly, it wouldnt suprise me if its rather more capable on our roads than the UK press would freely admit. I want one.
Edited to add: They make the Marcos out to be a wobbly handful, or atleast thats how I read thier critisisms. I really want to see this car succeed and as a result, scare TVR into trying harder.
>> Edited by BCA on Monday 3rd April 09:10
BCA said:
Sorry, its got to be asked - what went wrong??? I was a little gutted to see it do so badly I must admit - anyone have any answers??
The difference in times between the top 5 cars (CSR260, Z06, Gallardo & KZ1) were tiny. From personal experience, my view of what 'holds back' the Marcos are the relatively slow gearshift and the ratios. Tenths off a 4WD Gallardo or a 7 litre Vette are hardly a disgrace and, as the scales proved, the proto Marcos is heavy (as protos typically are). Similarly based on experience I'd happily challenge any of those 'faster cars' to an in-gear acceleration challenge, arguably a better real world comparison, where I'd expect the Marcos to be the faster car.
While last week's Vroom Vroom programme was rather cheesy, its contest between the TSO and a new Viper for the 'overtake a truck from 50mph in 4th gear' highlighted where the Marcos is mighty: in-gear acceleration. The TSO annhiliated the Viper - it took 50m and half a second off the 8 litre Viper.
Missing the top speed run was a shame - I think weather and the various schedules and locations of EVO and the Marcos missed one another. The Marcos pulls about 35mph/1000rpm in 6th - and pulls it hard. The maths says if it could pull to the limiter in 6th, it could exceed 230mph. Clearly, it won't but I wouldn't bet against it getting past 190mph without much effort. I've seen over 160 myself and it was eerily lazy about how it went there pulling not much more than 4,500rpm. Think about what that means: you buy a car with a small block Chevy engine installed and gearing for 230+. Then you go on the Internet and look for some goodies to tweak the motor... A pukka 200mph doesn't seem that far away? That's the bit that appeals to me.
As for handling... Personally, I think something was awry and I sincerely hope EVO re-measures the car at Bedford some time. Where I think the car belongs is about 6 seconds further up the ladder. But even if it fell short on its relatively narrow tyres, what I would be confident of guaranteeing is this: it would be about the most fun lap you can do. Imagine a TVR Griffith with about 50% more power-to-weight that invites you to steer on the throttle rather than punish you for it. It's a great shame that this didn't come out in this particular feature.
In some ways I was disappointed too but on reflection it wasn't so bad.
The Z06 is an awsome package and very hard to beat especially given all the GM development time and what's more it's priced really well. I worked on one last year (top end tune)and got to drive it quite a lot. Competant is how I'd sum it up and it handled well without any issues. True, it's made to a price but it was reliable and faultless. I didn't like some of the cheap badges but it was assembled from a lot of high tech, quality parts. Excellent value for money and fine for UK roads, just wish I could afford one!
Boosted.
Boosted.
BossCerbera said:
I agree. The 7 litre Vette sounded bloody great too!
BTW - did I read somewhere that you had got (or could get) the 7 litre motor in a crate Boosted?
I have the stuff coming out of my ears but there's no market over here for it at the moment so I won't import. I have preferred access to half a dozen egines, parts and build up kits! You need to run them with an aftermarket ecu and that may put people off in the UK.
Boosted.
mrmaggit said:My feeling is, compared to other reviews and my impressions (not that I'd claim to be anywhere near as good as the EVO guys) is that it was in a valley of the development cycle and the car wasn't really in a state to do the testing at that point, perhaps they were trying something new handling wise or the ECU hasn't been tuned for the latest engine mods...
Yes, Jules, Prodrive designed the chassis and suspension set-up. I was disppointed at the lap times too, not that I'm a hero driver or anything.
As Marcos only have the one (GT2) prototype they have to fit development, test drives, appearances and artcles into a very tight schedule, perhaps they were concentrating more on something else so this review slipped, a shame, but they are too small to hit every target.
I don't want to seem unfairly critical about the GT2 or TSO but it's taken them years thus far and I don't see a lot happening if anything really. They had a decent car nearly 2 years ago. What are they doing with all this time? IMO they should get a car/s out there on the road or track. Actions speak louder then words and all that. Otherwise time will pass them by and something more exciting will come along. If they sold just one car even for development it would be out there clocking up some miles and getting noticed.
Boosted.
Boosted.
mrmaggit said:
They are making the dealer demo cars at present, I believe.
I can hardly believe this all takes so damn long . . . The car was launched last summer had a TG entry four months ago (I still hear the roar of this low and mean looking beastie) and they're doing democars right now? Phew, when will the first customers turn their keys?
Tony is too much of a perfectionist, he listens to all feedback and desperately tries to apply it (which he has in many, many cases), I think he does need to reach a point where the car is good to ship, which might not be quote at the 100% he'd like to achieve, but hey, look at what TVR has got away shipping over the years, the GT2 is way beyond that.
Tripps said:
Tony is too much of a perfectionist, he listens to all feedback and desperately tries to apply it (which he has in many, many cases), I think he does need to reach a point where the car is good to ship, which might not be quote at the 100% he'd like to achieve, but hey, look at what TVR has got away shipping over the years, the GT2 is way beyond that.
Perfectionist or not he hasn't got any sales because they aren't available or ready but tvr have sold thousands. If tvr don't go belly up they will have an ls7 powered saggy for sale, very soon and that will sell in droves. Marcos need to get the product on the street before it's forgotten, imo.
Boosted.
Boosted LS1 said:I totally agree, many great cars are shown from British companies that fail to make the light of day, or end up in just the hands of a few people, so something needs to be released ASAP, if they can be seen on the roads this summer all the better. If they can concentrate of the few issues and get it released, they can move onto the next projects and come back and revise the GT2 after a few months after the (factory) 1000 mile service and other owner feedback.
Perfectionist or not he hasn't got any sales because they aren't available or ready but tvr have sold thousands. If tvr don't go belly up they will have an ls7 powered saggy for sale, very soon and that will sell in droves. Marcos need to get the product on the street before it's forgotten, imo.
I've a vested interest in the GT2 being released, as my interest lies in something else a little further down the pipeline, so would very much like to see them on the roads as soon as possible.
re: TVR, I've spoken to the factory about the Cerbera 2 (my other potential next buy) and they hadn't confirmed anything about engine direction - has some sort of decision been made then?
Tripps said:
Perfectionist or not he hasn't got any sales because they aren't available or ready but tvr have sold thousands. If tvr don't go belly up they will have an ls7 powered saggy for sale, very soon and that will sell in droves. Marcos need to get the product on the street before it's forgotten, imo.
I've a vested interest in the GT2 being released, as my interest lies in something else a little further down the pipeline, so would very much like to see them on the roads as soon as possible.
re: TVR, I've spoken to the factory about the Cerbera 2 (my other potential next buy) and they hadn't confirmed anything about engine direction - has some sort of decision been made then?
1. There is the matter of the other project that's keeping marcos busy
2. As for the tiff, I know nothing
but there aren't many engines to choose from and it seems factual that they have looked at the lsx quite closely. Boosted.
dinkel said:When I called the factory them about the Cerb2 (from a "can I put a deposit down?" point of view) they were quite dismissive, rude in fact and wouldn't confirm any facts, not even whether it is to have a V8, nevermind where that would be sourced from, hopefully the Motor Show will give us some more clues...
We can only guess, can't we. TVR has other things on their minds today . . .
The shame is that I'd heard of it a few days before my Marcos visit, if that hadn't happened I'd have probably gone ahead the GT2.
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