Legal Advice Re Private Sewers

[Martin Keene]

Hi People

Looking for a little bit of legal guidance / advice before we start getting Solictors involved.

We bought a house in Jan 07 which is part of a development of 19 houses, which form a private close which is owned and run by a management company run by the residents.

Last year, a planning application was made to build 13 houses on a plot of land adjcent to our close. This development uses our road as access, and the surface water runs in to our private sewers, the foul runs a different way.

To cut a very long story short, they told us they had rights of free access and connection to the sewers. Tonight I saw a copy of the Land Registery Deeds concerning the sale of the land that our houses are built on, and it does say that the neighbouring land has right of free access for foul, surface and the road way. This was signed by the developer of the house I bought when they bought the land.

Obviously this means the developer has signed the management company and therefore the residents for liability of the surface water system for the new close.

However, and it is quite a big however, none of this is mentioned in my deeds for the house or any of the searches.

Slightly bemused as to where we go from here...

Thanks in advance.

[miniman]

Can't help much other than to say that the reason they have done it is almost certainly financial. When we were getting towards exchange on our new house earlier this year, one outstanding point was the sign-off of the surface water drainage by the council / water board / whatever. My solicitor was quite adamant that he needed to check into it as if the builder went bust the 12 houses would be jointly liable for sorting it out. I figured it would cost something like £10-20k split 12 ways so wasn't unduly worried.

It transpired that the price from the water board to do it was £250,000 hence why the builder was trying to explore other avenues, one of them being with the landowner of the adjacent farmland.

Anyway, certainly worth getting to the bottom of as the numbers involved are quite substantial to say the least.

[tenohfive]

How new is the development that your house is on? Just to rule out your local water authority.

[Martin Keene]

The land was purchase December 2003, construction from 2004-2006. We bought the last house which had been empty for 12 months.

[tenohfive]

Martin Keene said:

The land was purchase December 2003, construction from 2004-2006. We bought the last house which had been empty for 12 months.

Ah. Rules that out then.

I can't offer legal advice on this, good luck finding out.

[Tom_C76]

Martin Keene said:

Hi People

Looking for a little bit of legal guidance / advice before we start getting Solictors involved.

We bought a house in Jan 07 which is part of a development of 19 houses, which form a private close which is owned and run by a management company run by the residents.

Last year, a planning application was made to build 13 houses on a plot of land adjcent to our close. This development uses our road as access, and the surface water runs in to our private sewers, the foul runs a different way.

To cut a very long story short, they told us they had rights of free access and connection to the sewers. Tonight I saw a copy of the Land Registery Deeds concerning the sale of the land that our houses are built on, and it does say that the neighbouring land has right of free access for foul, surface and the road way. This was signed by the developer of the house I bought when they bought the land.

Obviously this means the developer has signed the management company and therefore the residents for liability of the surface water system for the new close.

However, and it is quite a big however, none of this is mentioned in my deeds for the house or any of the searches.

Slightly bemused as to where we go from here...

Thanks in advance.

I'm not sure where you're coming from with this. Is there currently a problem with the sewer? Right to connect wouldn't imply right to overload the sewer, but if it is functioning well where is the problem?

The liability for the sewer rests with the management company, which was presumably set up by the builders of your house. When they set up that company they can give it the duty to look after whatever they want to, including any rights they have already granted over the roads and sewers. I suppose your solicitor maybe should have checked what liabilities the company was in charge of, but the details of the management company don't need to be in your deeds, otherwise all of the deeds would need amending if there were any changes to the management company structure.

TC

[slow_poke]

Try the folks over on www.gardenlaw.co.uk forums

[Martin Keene]

Tom_C76 said:

Martin Keene said:

Hi People

Looking for a little bit of legal guidance / advice before we start getting Solictors involved.

We bought a house in Jan 07 which is part of a development of 19 houses, which form a private close which is owned and run by a management company run by the residents.

Last year, a planning application was made to build 13 houses on a plot of land adjcent to our close. This development uses our road as access, and the surface water runs in to our private sewers, the foul runs a different way.

To cut a very long story short, they told us they had rights of free access and connection to the sewers. Tonight I saw a copy of the Land Registery Deeds concerning the sale of the land that our houses are built on, and it does say that the neighbouring land has right of free access for foul, surface and the road way. This was signed by the developer of the house I bought when they bought the land.

Obviously this means the developer has signed the management company and therefore the residents for liability of the surface water system for the new close.

However, and it is quite a big however, none of this is mentioned in my deeds for the house or any of the searches.

Slightly bemused as to where we go from here...

Thanks in advance.

I'm not sure where you're coming from with this. Is there currently a problem with the sewer? Right to connect wouldn't imply right to overload the sewer, but if it is functioning well where is the problem?

The liability for the sewer rests with the management company, which was presumably set up by the builders of your house. When they set up that company they can give it the duty to look after whatever they want to, including any rights they have already granted over the roads and sewers. I suppose your solicitor maybe should have checked what liabilities the company was in charge of, but the details of the management company don't need to be in your deeds, otherwise all of the deeds would need amending if there were any changes to the management company structure.

TC

Hi

There currently isn't a problem with the sewer, and with the design of the new 'half' of the system that joins it, there is no reason to believe there will be. However, it is a pumped system with two very large pumps sitting in a tank, and as we stand at the minute all 32 house use it, but only the original 19 are liable for the running costs.

All of the deeds for all 19 houses do cover the Management company6, covering it's structure, funding, duties, responsibilities, etc.

I find it slightly puzziling that a company can lay down sewers, giving a third party free and unrestricted access to those sewers, and then not telling anybody responsible for the running of that company about that responsibility, either verbally or in writing...