Hard Floor Upstairs - Noise Control?

[HiRich]

My neighbour upstairs has asked to replace the carpet in their kitchen with something more... washable I guess. That would seem to mean tiles, wood or lino. The neighbour is a good bloke, and has been a good neighbour over many years, so I'm ready to compromise, but obviously don't want to create a nightmare for myself. Noise levels at the moment are pretty good (with a thick underlay).

Now this is hardly a new problem so there must be solutions, but what options are there? I'm not even sure what words to Google

• Would it be possible leave the existing underlay, and cover with plywood and a hard surface?
• Any thoughts on the surface? I'm tending to reject wood/veneer, but think tiles might be OK - wood seems even more "clicky"
• Any ideas, links for advice or suppliers.

For info, the space is no more than 10'x10' (though it might be an L rather than the full square, sited on regular floorboards, located in London. It's sited over lower-use areas of my flat, so perfection isn't expected.

Many Thanks in advance for any leads.

[mrmaggit]

Speak to a reputable flooring installer/supplier in your area, they'll be able to give you chapter and verse.

Be aware there are two types of sound, impact (footsteps) and airborne, and are treated differently from a soundproofing point if view.

[IainT]

Most appartment buildings have covenants in place to govern the flooring that's allowed to prevent noise impacting the people below.

Any hard flooring put down ususally has to have specialist padding to prevent noise transmission.

[mk1fan]

Those type of covenants usually specifically exclude the kitchen and bathroom areas.

You don't say what type of building it is.

The answer is relatively simple, you need seperation. Now in a new build this would be done by installing a floating floor and 'suspended' ceiling (not the type you see in an office).

In older buildings you're going to have to accept that full separation isn't going to be possible. With that in mind you can get pretty good results.

Starting at the top. A floating floor can be laid and British Gypsum do a system that replaces the existing floor.

In the floor void - assuming it's a timber floor - 100mm insulation is laid.

The ceiling below can be replaced with plasterboard fixed to resilent bars. Again British Gypsum do a system.

Any openings in the ceiling - eg for a downlighter - should have a 'fire cap' over it anyway and you can get accoustic versions too.

These works are not cheap though.

Now back to the covenants. Assuming there is a covenant to maintian a carpet covering except in the bathroom and kitchen then the neighbour has no obligation to do any of the works above. If I were the neighbour then I would happily upgrade the floor on my side however the ceiling below would be your responsibility.

Your situation isn't unique and is very common but unfortunately part of living in a flat.

[HiRich]

Sorry for the delay, I was distracted by installing the world's worst dishwasher.

I'm aware of the covenant, we own it and I manage it. It makes no dispensation for kitchens & bathrooms and requires carpets everywhere, but I can (and would be prepared to) turn a blind eye if a decent solution is found.

The house is Victorian, with standard floorboards over joists, basic plasterboard ceiling. There appears to be an RSJ in my room replacing original structure, though no matching structure above. The noise currently is remarkably good (footfall and airborne) - the only issue being the washing machine on spin cycle - this being achieved with a thick underlay. I would be quite happy if we matched that.

I've considered underfloor cavity insulation (for noise and heat). I've suggested that if the floorboards above needed to come up, I would take the opportunity to fit something. However, I suspect that would make the project unrealistic for him cost wise.

So my interest is in floorboards and above. A bit more Googling has led me towards vinyl tiles like Karndean and Polyfloor, as these seem to have a good reputation for looking goog, being washable, and relatively soft underfoot (= less impact noise). These would need to be on a layer of ply, and I'm then wondering if there is a simple system of separation between ply and floorboards.

Any ideas, or thoughts on these vinyl tiles? I'm off to the local shops for advice but would appreciate any more guidance.

[mk1fan]

Sorry to disappoint you but you're not going to find a simple lay over solution to noise control. To provide good noise insulation in a 'old' structure you need to do more than just lay some underlay.

Seems odd that leases were drafted with such a stupid covenant but hey that's what can happen in England and Wales.

[eps]

"Welcome" to Approved Document E... It really depends on how much you want to spend and how much work (as has been mentioned above) but I would guess that you wouldn't want to take all the floorboards up..

If you're happy with the current situation which is underlay and carpet... Then underlay under lino or similar would be the best solution all round.. Of course you can put an underlay under laminate, but it's the laminate itself that will generate a lot of the noise..

some blurb here : http://www.rlapolymers.com.au/rob_a11-11_lino_tips...

[GreenDog]

Buy the neighbour some carpet slippers to wear in the kitchen