Timber fence preservative - cost/benefit analysis
Discussion
Clickbait thread title - apologies!
I haven't done a full exercise - just mulling it over and would appreciate corrections if assumptions are wrong or any general thoughts from experience .
Background:
Moved into current house 3 years ago - ours and the neighbouring properties are Victorian semis with typically long but narrow rear gardens - 130ft x 25ft (40m x 7.5m). Envisage this being our final house move so planning to live here for 20+ years
Existing 6ft timber fence was literally falling to bits with several holes / gaps. As we have dogs, needed to be replaced for security.
Approached our new neighbour (at that time) who has legal ownership of the fence on one side - they were reticent initially but quickly agreed when they understood we were seeking approval & not a financial contribution
Fence was installed at the same 6ft height with new posts and gravel boards in concrete.
Went for framed, pressure-treated close-board with vertical timbers @£60/panel as they were much sturdier than lapped horizontal panels @£35/each.
There are around 50no 6ftx6ft (1.8mx1.8m) panels so at £60/unit, replacement of the timber would be £3,000 at current prices (assuming re-use of the concrete posts/gravel boards).
Have read various articles online that state the lifespan should be between X & Y for the panels we have - seems the general consensus is c. 15 years. We are in the South-East so don't get the wind/storms compared to (say) Scotland, but perhaps more UV exposure.
My question, (if anyone has read this far!) is whether treating the timber panels with a preservative or stain would have any substantial effect on the durability?
Fence is (40m + 7.5m + 40m) x 1.8m high = c. 160m² multiplied by 2 for the other side = approx. 320m² surface area.
Ronseal Shed and Fence Preserver gets good reviews & similarly priced to other products @ £35 for a 5 litre tin.
One litre is stated as covering 9.5m² = 47m²/tin so would need 7no tins to cover the 320m² for both sides = £245
Problem is, it states 3 coats needed on the product guide - even if I only applied 2no coats, still looking at £500 total cost.
Re-coating every 3 years from now over the expected lifespan = £2,000 in preservative & that's without the cost of buying a decent sprayer as I'm not prepared to spend a week or more with a brush.
If preservative treatment potentially doubles or more the estimated 15 year timber life-span, could be worthwhile.
If it only adds another 5 years, I'd rather spend £3K on replacing all the panels with new in 15 years time than spend £2K on products & the associated work/grief in the interim & still have to replace them in 20 years.
This post got far too long but any thoughts appreciated.
I haven't done a full exercise - just mulling it over and would appreciate corrections if assumptions are wrong or any general thoughts from experience .
Background:
Moved into current house 3 years ago - ours and the neighbouring properties are Victorian semis with typically long but narrow rear gardens - 130ft x 25ft (40m x 7.5m). Envisage this being our final house move so planning to live here for 20+ years
Existing 6ft timber fence was literally falling to bits with several holes / gaps. As we have dogs, needed to be replaced for security.
Approached our new neighbour (at that time) who has legal ownership of the fence on one side - they were reticent initially but quickly agreed when they understood we were seeking approval & not a financial contribution
Fence was installed at the same 6ft height with new posts and gravel boards in concrete.
Went for framed, pressure-treated close-board with vertical timbers @£60/panel as they were much sturdier than lapped horizontal panels @£35/each.
There are around 50no 6ftx6ft (1.8mx1.8m) panels so at £60/unit, replacement of the timber would be £3,000 at current prices (assuming re-use of the concrete posts/gravel boards).
Have read various articles online that state the lifespan should be between X & Y for the panels we have - seems the general consensus is c. 15 years. We are in the South-East so don't get the wind/storms compared to (say) Scotland, but perhaps more UV exposure.
My question, (if anyone has read this far!) is whether treating the timber panels with a preservative or stain would have any substantial effect on the durability?
Fence is (40m + 7.5m + 40m) x 1.8m high = c. 160m² multiplied by 2 for the other side = approx. 320m² surface area.
Ronseal Shed and Fence Preserver gets good reviews & similarly priced to other products @ £35 for a 5 litre tin.
One litre is stated as covering 9.5m² = 47m²/tin so would need 7no tins to cover the 320m² for both sides = £245
Problem is, it states 3 coats needed on the product guide - even if I only applied 2no coats, still looking at £500 total cost.
Re-coating every 3 years from now over the expected lifespan = £2,000 in preservative & that's without the cost of buying a decent sprayer as I'm not prepared to spend a week or more with a brush.
If preservative treatment potentially doubles or more the estimated 15 year timber life-span, could be worthwhile.
If it only adds another 5 years, I'd rather spend £3K on replacing all the panels with new in 15 years time than spend £2K on products & the associated work/grief in the interim & still have to replace them in 20 years.
This post got far too long but any thoughts appreciated.
Edited by OzzyR1 on Saturday 22 March 01:27
If the wood wasn’t already treated I’d be applying something, but you say the timber used was already pressure treated so will already have some preservative effect.
I’d be inclined not to bother if you’re happy with the colour, maybe freshen up your side in 3yrs or so. If it’s already treated might not need the same “dose” of ronseal
I’d be inclined not to bother if you’re happy with the colour, maybe freshen up your side in 3yrs or so. If it’s already treated might not need the same “dose” of ronseal
We have lots of close board fencing on our property that was installed when the house was new in 1996.
Most of it is still perfectly serviceable. The only bits that have needed replacing are the odd post and some boards that have had havoc wreaked on them by ivy growth.
So if they have were pressure treated properly they should last longer than 15 years. (Although I recognise that they were using different treatments in 1996).
I recently painted the fence, mostly because I don't like the grey colour and wanted to brighten up the garden.
One coat was fine but I have to say a sprayer was very messy and ineffective. In the end a paintbrush was the only option to do the job properly. If you want to do multiple coats you shouldn't leave much time between coats because the waterproofing qualities make applying the second coat more difficult.
Most of it is still perfectly serviceable. The only bits that have needed replacing are the odd post and some boards that have had havoc wreaked on them by ivy growth.
So if they have were pressure treated properly they should last longer than 15 years. (Although I recognise that they were using different treatments in 1996).
I recently painted the fence, mostly because I don't like the grey colour and wanted to brighten up the garden.
One coat was fine but I have to say a sprayer was very messy and ineffective. In the end a paintbrush was the only option to do the job properly. If you want to do multiple coats you shouldn't leave much time between coats because the waterproofing qualities make applying the second coat more difficult.
To be honest, the main problem is usually the base of the posts rotting out when the panels still have years of life remaining but may not survive being removed and put back. Plus, you have next to no control re the preservation of the other side of the fence in many cases. There isn't too much point treating one side and letting the other rot etc.
The approach that I would take with a 'forever' home where I was at the age that meant the renewal of various elements were looking like they would fall due at around a time when I may be too old to do the work or enjoy watching lump sums suddenly start going out when you suspect you won't be around long enough to benefit etc would be to set up a sinking fund.
Just work out what all the things are that will almost certainly need doing again in say 20 years and overpay a commensurate amount into the pension and claim the income tax back. I'd personally consider a fence to be something to budget to replace, putting the money you'd spend on maintenance to one side over the next 10-15 years to cover that off.
The approach that I would take with a 'forever' home where I was at the age that meant the renewal of various elements were looking like they would fall due at around a time when I may be too old to do the work or enjoy watching lump sums suddenly start going out when you suspect you won't be around long enough to benefit etc would be to set up a sinking fund.
Just work out what all the things are that will almost certainly need doing again in say 20 years and overpay a commensurate amount into the pension and claim the income tax back. I'd personally consider a fence to be something to budget to replace, putting the money you'd spend on maintenance to one side over the next 10-15 years to cover that off.
Creocote - it's not as good as the original and no longer available creosote but it's close and I do my fences roughly every 3 years with it. I'm replacing the last original fence right now (it's 42 years old)
Light
https://www.huwsgray.co.uk/cleaners-solvents/bird-...
They also do a dark version
Other suppliers are available but if you source it in 20 L containers it's a heck of a lot better value than 5L ones
Often you can find it discounted so worth seeking out then
Light
https://www.huwsgray.co.uk/cleaners-solvents/bird-...
They also do a dark version
Other suppliers are available but if you source it in 20 L containers it's a heck of a lot better value than 5L ones
Often you can find it discounted so worth seeking out then
What’s on the top edge of them? That is rotting away on ours after 25 yrs and sourcing replacements isn’t straightforward. With hindsight I’d have got a bunch of them from the original fencing supplier and put them away.
The other thing is some of the nails holding the vertical boards in place rusted away, but fixing those is easy enough - a nail gun would make it even easier.
The other thing is some of the nails holding the vertical boards in place rusted away, but fixing those is easy enough - a nail gun would make it even easier.
B'stard Child said:
Creocote - it's not as good as the original and no longer available creosote but it's close and I do my fences roughly every 3 years with it. I'm replacing the last original fence right now (it's 42 years old)
As an aside - proper traditional coal tar creosote is still available, it's just only "allowed" to be sold for professional use so you won't see it in B&Q or the like. Your nearest farm or fencing supply store will happily sell you a drum if it. Creosote treated posts and rails are still available too and will outlast normal treated wood by a significant factor - maybe a bit smelly and messy for what sounds like an urban garden though!
Snow and Rocks said:
As an aside - proper traditional coal tar creosote is still available, it's just only "allowed" to be sold for professional use so you won't see it in B&Q or the like.
Your nearest farm or fencing supply store will happily sell you a drum if it. Creosote treated posts and rails are still available too and will outlast normal treated wood by a significant factor - maybe a bit smelly and messy for what sounds like an urban garden though!
Did not know that - thank you - I got all my materials to redo this 10m section of fence from a local fencing supplier - they didn’t have it listed for sale but perhaps that’s because it’s not a trade site - I’ll give them a ring Monday and see if they have it (I’ve only got about 5 litres of creocote left so need some more)Your nearest farm or fencing supply store will happily sell you a drum if it. Creosote treated posts and rails are still available too and will outlast normal treated wood by a significant factor - maybe a bit smelly and messy for what sounds like an urban garden though!
3 x 8ft posts, 9 x 3.6 m cant rails, 3 x 3.6 m gravel boards, 90 x 1.8m feather boards and 6 x 20 kg bags of postcrete was £350 delivered
Probably more expensive than panels but I like the look of cant an rail fencing - from a security perspective - good side out makes it harder to climb over to get into the garden, local scroats can’t lift a panel up, wedge it and then get easy access to the garden which seems to be a local MO for house break ins.
beambeam1 said:
B'stard Child said:
Sorry for threadjack
Looks mighty good though. beambeam1 said:
It's high time someone started a "What did you have done or DIY around the house today" thread like the tools or tips thread for such hijacks.
That's a really good idea for a thread - it always feels like most of my free time ends up on "house stuff I have to do" rather than "car stuff I want to do" - why don't you kick it off??Cheers all, had already factored in doing both sides of the fence as I understand the point someone else made above about there being no point doing just "my" side when the other is unprotected. Neighbour would have no problem giving me access it it meant they didn't have to do it.
Tempted just to leave it from the comments above and replace it wholesale when the time comes or might put one/two initial coats on this summer and then just leave it and not bother with repeating every 3 years.
No issue with post rot as those and the gravel boards are both concrete.
Cheers all & agree with the last few comments that a "What DIY have you been doing" would be a good idea for a thread.
Tempted just to leave it from the comments above and replace it wholesale when the time comes or might put one/two initial coats on this summer and then just leave it and not bother with repeating every 3 years.
No issue with post rot as those and the gravel boards are both concrete.
Cheers all & agree with the last few comments that a "What DIY have you been doing" would be a good idea for a thread.
AndyAudi said:
If the wood wasn’t already treated I’d be applying something, but you say the timber used was already pressure treated so will already have some preservative effect.
I’d be inclined not to bother if you’re happy with the colour, maybe freshen up your side in 3yrs or so. If it’s already treated might not need the same “dose” of ronseal
^^^agree, once you start staining outside timber,you have started a job for life.I’d be inclined not to bother if you’re happy with the colour, maybe freshen up your side in 3yrs or so. If it’s already treated might not need the same “dose” of ronseal
If you must add a preservative to fencing, then consider adding engine oil to Creocote.
Creocote
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